For Sins 1.18 and Entrenchment 1.04
This is a post that I will update regularly to give the DEVS a better idea of what people think should be done to stats in the next patch. This is ONLY for patches, no new ships or elaborate concepts for the next expansion. This is for dealing with peoples’ concerns about balance. If there’s a balance idea you have that’s not on here, post it and I’ll put it up for voting if it seems valid. I love the fact that ICO pays attention to the forums and what people suggest, I’d like to make it easier for them. The idea is to have all ideas posted straight forward and ranked so the DEVS don’t have to sift through pages and pages to find popular ideas. SP and MP players are both welcome to comment. Post yay or nay for any idea you like or dislike (be specific please) or say no fix needed. If you’d like I’ll also insert specific values you may come up with. Some votes will be taken from other threads.
* Topics shoud be considered independent of eachother, vote for each topic as if the Devs were to choose only 1. Yay for fixes that you think would work, nay for fixes that you think won't*
** Now there's an easier way to cast your vote, download the easy entry form, fill it out and then copy and paste your results!**
>> Download The Easy Entry Form <<
REFERENCESSeveral members of the community have taken it upon themselves to run tests to prove imbalances and recommend possible fixes. I would Encourage everyone commenting here to read these and become more informed.Raging Amish's Lums vs Enforcers JJs HC Tests JJs Illum Tests
Deceivers Subjugator thread Deceivers Cap Carrier thread
RAGING AMISH's Balance MOD
Game BugsThese need to be addressed before anything else. The following is a compiled list of all known game bugs. Thanks to Pawelo for helping me compile and test these. If you can think of any others that aren't on here leave a comment to let me know.-Embargo Level 2 and 3 do not stop cargo ships.-Phasic Trap Research level 2 does not do anything.-Magnetize does not interrupt channeled abilities-Disruptive Strikes does not work on pulse beams-Allegiance through wormholes is flawed.-Wrong Sound effects on: Anima Tempest, repair cloud, nanite armor, EMP blast-Infocard errors: Dunov shield restore does not increase mitigation, labs do not speed up build time
-Akkan Colonize ability does not always spawn extractors at lvl2 and lvl3.
-Subverters Disrupt Shields can not target structures with shields-Some musics and Orange Skybox are not used.
SOLANUS ADJUDICATORS
The adjudicator, while it can target multiple structures, just doesnt have the punch its TEC cousin the Ogrovs has and has difficulty handling tight clusters of structures supported by repair bays. Also, without a well functioning healing unit, the poor adjudicator simply cant live long enough in the throws of battle to make a huge difference. We've discussed the changes, now its time to get official votes on them.
Buff the Adjudicator- Change armor type?:
Yay- JuleTron Kitkun N3rull eoncommander
Nay- Dargoon999 Warlord Mike
Reduce supply cost?:
Yay- JuleTron Kitkun Dargoon999 Warlord Mike Darvin3 SivCorp eoncommander
Nay-
Reduce number of firing banks to increase damage per target?:
Yay- Warlord Mike eoncommander
Nay- Kitkun N3rull Dargoon999
Increase damage?:
Nay- Kitkun Dargoon999
Increase shields?:
Yay- JuleTron Kitkun eoncommander
No Fix Needed- Ryat Extremor
MINES
These little critters were introduced in Entrenchment and have been seldom used. They are purely defensive, extremely expensive, and a huge gamble to put your money in. There's been much discussion on possible fixes, but now its time for an official vote, so here you go.
Buff Mines Increase damage? Yay- Juletron Whiskey144 SivCorp Extremor Nay- EadTaes Raging Amish Ovi_187 Kitkun eoncommander Increase damage radius? Yay- Top Vasari Whiskey144 EadTaes Warlord Mike Ovi_187 SivCorp Extremor eoncommander Nay- Juletron N3rull Raging Amish Kitkun Increase activation radius? Yay- Warlord Mike eoncommander Nay- EadTaes JuleTron N3rull Raging Amish Ovi_187 Kitkun Extremor Increase mines per deployment? Yay- eoncommander Nay- EadTaes N3rull Raging Amish Warlord Mike Ovi_187 Kitkun Extremor Increase deployment spread? Yay- Warlord Mike Extremor eoncommander Nay- Juletron EadTaes N3rull Raging Amish Ovi_187 Kitkun Decrease cost? Yay- Juletron Mindseye(25%) EadTaes(25%) Dargoon999 Whiskey144 N3rull(20%) Warlord Mike Ovi_187 Kitkun Extremor Nay- Raging Amish eoncommander Reduce build time for Proximity Mines(TEC)? Yay- Juletron Whiskey144 EadTaes Raging Amish Warlord Mike Ovi_187 Kitkun Extremor Nay- Increase duration of Gravity Mines(Vasari)? Yay- Juletron N3rull Mindseye Ovi_187 Kitkun Extremor Nay- EadTaes Raging Amish Fix homming mines AI to return to original deployment location(Advent)? Yay- JuleTron EadTaes N3rull Mindseye Warlord Mike Ovi_187 SivCorp Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- Raging Amish
Make Gravity Mines an upgrade to existing mines?
Yay- N3rull Juletron Dargoon999 Ue-Carbon Deceiver_0 Mindseye Kitkun Extremor
Nay- EadTaes Raging Amish
No fix needed-
SIEGE FRIGATESCosting more than most Heavy Cruisers, one would expect siege frigates to be able to handle a simple task like bombing a planet to oblivion, but with their super thin and weak hulls they certainly aren't worth the cost, and with Entrenchments bombardment protection on starbases, siege frigates find themselves in the obsolete unit pile. Personally I think they should be tough as nails since all they do is bomb planets and cost loads of resources and precious supply. With a decent buff these units could be the terror they once were and possibly bring back some of the planetary defense tech that fell from use after their nerf. (planetary shielding anyone?) Buff Siege Frigates Increase Hp/shields/armor?: Yay- Deceiver_0(Hp) Volt_Cruelerz Darvin3 Ryat EadTaes Dargoon999(10%) N3rull(+nerf) Kitkun eoncommander Nay- Soasertsus Cykur Mindseye Raging Amish Ascension Howdidudothat Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Extremor Change armor type (currently light)?: Yay- Deceiver_0(v. heavy) Soasertsus(v. heavy) Volt_Cruelerz(heavy/v.heavy) EadTaes (heavy) Dargoon999(heavy) N3rull(heavy) SivCorp Extremor(heavy) eoncommander Nay- Darvin3 Cykur Ryat Mindseye Raging Amish Ascension Howdidudothat Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Decrease Resource cost?: Yay- Soasertsus Darvin3 EadTaes Howdidudothat Sobric Extremor Nay- Volt_Cruelerz Cykur Ryat Dargoon999 Mindseye Raging Amish Ascension Ovi_187 Warlord Mike Kitkun Decrease Supply Cost?: Yay- Soasertsus(6) Darvin3 Cykur Ryat(10) EadTaes(10) Dargoon999(10) Mindseye Howdidudothat Raging Amish(12) Ascension(12) Ovi_187 mbaron888(8) Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun eoncommander Nay- Volt_Cruelerz Extremor Increase Bombardment damage?: Yay- Volt_Cruelerz Dargoon999(20%) Warlord Mike Extremor Nay- Soasertsus Darvin3 Cykur Ryat EadTaes Mindseye Raging Amish Ascension Howdidudothat Ovi_187 Sobric SivCorp Kitkun eoncommander
Make TEC Heavy Fallout Active (currently passive)?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Soasertsus Volt_Cruelerz Darvin3 Cykur Ryat Dargoon999 N3rull Mindseye Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Nay- EadTaes Ascension Howdidudothat Reduce Heavy Fallout effect time (currently 6 minutes)?: Yay- Darvin3 Sobric Warlord Mike Nay- Soasertsus Volt_Cruelerz Cykur Ryat EadTaes Dargoon999 Mindseye Raging Amish Ascension Howdidudothat Ovi_187 Kitkun Reduce Xp value (currently 65xp)?: Yay- Soasertsus Darvin3(40) Cykur EadTaes(15) Dargoon999(30) Ovi_187 Kitkun Nay- Volt_Cruelerz Ryat Mindseye Raging Amish Ascension Howdidudothat Sobric Warlord Mike Apply fixes to siege militia?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Soasertsus Volt_Cruelerz Darvin3 EadTaes Dargoon999 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor Nay- Ryat Ascension Howdidudothat Apply fixes to siege pirates?: Yay- Darvin3 EadTaes Dargoon999 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor Nay- Soasertsus Volt_Cruelerz Ryat Ascension Howdidudothat Sobric No Fix Needed-
SEREVUN OVERSEERThe overseer is a powerful, but seldom used ship due to it's current lack of usability. I'd recommend anyone planning on voting on this topic read a few of the replies on page 5, where Ascension and I debated some changes. I've also thrown in a few ideas to make overseers 'Jump Degradation' ability a little more potent for the 100AM and channeling it costs. Buff Serevun Overseers- Increase firing arc of abilities?: Yay- Deceiver_0 JuleTron Volt_Cruelerz Ascension Soasertsus milo896 Howdidudothat lifekatana N3rull Mindseye Cykur EadTaes Raging Amish Ovi_187 Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- Pbhead Sobric Increase turn rate?: Yay- Deceiver_0 JuleTron Volt_Cruelerz Ascension Soasertsus milo896 Howdidudothat lifekatana N3rull Mindseye Pbhead Raging Amish Ovi_187 Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- EadTaes Sobric SivCorp Make 'Reactive nanite armor' omnidirectional (360 degrees)?: Yay- Ascension Raging Amish Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Extremor
Nay- Deceiver_0 Soasertsus Darvin3 milo896 Howdidudothat lifekatana N3rull Mindseye Pbhead EadTaes Ovi_187 Kitkun eoncommander Increase reduction of jump speed for 'Jump Degradation'?: Yay- milo896 Howdidudothat Mindseye EadTaes Ovi_187 Sobric Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- Soasertsus lifekatana Pbhead Raging Amish Allow 'Jump Degradation' to do a damage % to incoming enemy vessels' hulls?: Yay- Deceiver_0 (5-10%) Soasertsus(20%AM) Darvin3 milo896 N3rull(speed reduction) Kitkun eoncommander Nay- Howdidudothat lifekatana Mindseye Pbhead EadTaes Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Extremor
Allow 'Jump Degradation' to disable passive regeneration?
Yay- Raging Amish Deceiver_0 Diplominator Juletron Sobric Extremor
Nay- Ovi_187 Howdidudothat Cykur Kitkun No Fix Needed-SKAROVAS ENFORCERThe relative weakness of the Enforcer has recently been brought to the forums attention (thanks JohnJames). With their higher resource cost, higher supply cost and more expensive upgrades, enforcers are unfortunately left in the dust by their counterparts. Many speculate that their extra ability (reintegration) is the cause for such a skewed balance, while others agree that reintegration lacks the power enforcers deserve. The following are some fixes that have been proposed. Personally, I think the Vasari should get a little more for what they pay for. Buff Skarovas Enforcers- Decrease Resource Cost?: Yay- Ascension EadTaes Sobric Nay- Deceiver_0 Soasertsus Volt_Cruelerz lifekatana Howdidudothat Darvin3 Mindseye Raging Amish Ovi_187 Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Decrease Supply Cost?: Yay- Soasertsus Sobric Extremor Nay- Deceiver_0 Volt_Cruelerz lifekatana Howdidudothat Darvin3 Mindseye EadTaes Raging Amish Ovi_187 Kitkun eoncommander Increase hp/shields/armor?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Darvin3 EadTaes(armor+1) Raging Amish SivCorp Kitkun eoncommander Nay- Volt_Cruelerz Soasertsus lifekatana Howdidudothat Mindseye Ovi_187 Sobric Extremor Increase Damage?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Soasertsus Ascension JuleTron Darvin3 Howdidudothat Mindseye Cykur EadTaes(22) Raging Amish(21.6) Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun eoncommander Nay- Volt_Cruelerz lifekatana Extremor Cheaper damage upgrades?:
Yay- Deceiver_0 Volt_cruelerz Top Vasari Ascension DesConnor Raging Amish N3rull lifekatana JuleTron Darvin3 Howdidudothat Mindseye EadTaes Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Extremor eoncommander Nay- Soasertsus Ovi_187 Kitkun Higher reintegration rate?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Volt_cruelerz Top Vasari Soasertsus N3rull lifekatana JuleTron Darvin3 Howdidudothat Ovi_187 Sobric Kitkun Nay- Mindseye EadTaes Raging Amish Extremor No Fix Needed- PbheadDOMINA SUBJUGATORSThe domina has been an a lot of peoples (f spending money on that) list for sometime. I tested and observed the subjugator while I was examining carrier caps and wrote a report on them as well. Here's some fixes that have been proposed for the Domina as well as the Stilakus Subverter (whose destiny is quite intertwined with the domina). I'll be putting the Subverter question under the REPULSE section as it has to do more as a counter to it. Buff Domina Subjugators- Increase firing arc of abilities?:
Yay- Deceiver_0 Mindseye Darvin3 Gugabalog Cykur(heal only) Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun eoncommander Nay- EadTaes lifekatana Pbhead Increase turn rate?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Darvin3 Gugabalog Mindseye Pbhead Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun eoncommander Nay- EadTaes lifekatana Make abilities AOE?: Yay- Warlord Mike SivCorp eoncommander Nay- Deceiver_0 EadTaes Gugabalog Darvin3 lifekatana Mindseye Pbhead Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Kitkun Remove channeling from abilities?: Yay- EadTaes Gugabalog lifekatana Raging Amish Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Nay- Deceiver_0 Darvin3 Mindseye Pbhead Ovi_187 SivCorp eoncommander Fix Targeting AI (on all abilities for all races) to prevent wasteful use?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Darvin3 EadTaes Gugabalog Soasertsus lifekatana Mindseye Pbhead Cykur Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun eoncommander
Nay- Pbhead No Fix Needed-CARRIER CLASS CAPITAL SHIPSI've noticed people use Carrier Caps generally for 1 ability, and not for the strikecraft and SC bonuses they offer. Weaker than most other classes, they are sparse and somewhat unthreatening on the battle field. Personally I think they should offer more benefit in the strike craft department than they do now. I've written a detailed report on them, and taken some of the proposed changes from it for this thread. Buff Carrier Caps- Increase Initial Armor? Yay- Deceiver_0 Soasertsus Ryat Howdidudothat Gugabalog Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Nay- Darvin3 -Ue_Carbon mbaron888 Pirate-Jack EadTaes DesConnor Swordsalmon lifekatana Pbhead Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Extremor eoncommander Increase Squadron Capacity? Yay- Deceiver_0 (see thread) Soasertsus Ryat -Ue_Carbon ReadyMan Howdidudothat mbaron888 Pirate-Jack EadTaes DesConnor Mindseye Swordsalmon Gugabalog N3rull lifekatana -aceca- Derek06 Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Extremor eoncommander
Nay- Darvin3 Raging Amish Make SC buffs AOE? Yay- EadTaes DesConnor Swordsalmon Gugabalog Derek06 Raging Amish Sobric SivCorp Extremor Nay- Deceiver_0 Soasertsus Ryat Darvin3 -Ue_Carbon Howdidudothat mbaron888 Pirate-Jack lifekatana Pbhead Ovi_187 Kitkun eoncommander Increase additional drones(Adept Drone Anima)? Yay- Deceiver_0 Darvin3 Howdidudothat Mindseye Swordsalmon Gugabalog Derek06 Raging Amish Sobric SivCorp Kitkun Nay- Soasertsus Ryat -Ue_Carbon mbaron888 Pirate-Jack EadTaes DesConnor lifekatana Pbhead Ovi_187 Extremor eoncommander Re-work Scramble Bombers? Yay- Deceiver_0 Soasertsus Ryat Darvin3 -Ue_Carbon Howdidudothat mbaron888 Pirate-Jack EadTaes DesConnor Mindseye Swordsalmon Gugabalog N3rull lifekatana Pbhead Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- No Fix Needed-LIGHT FRIGATESMost agree that Light Frigates don't scale well. Being limited in their usefulness early game, and becoming almsot complete obsolete late game with Heavy Cruiser research. Many ideas have been thrown around to get light frigates back on the battle field. Buff Light Frigates- Increase Damage?: Yay- TheRezonator Gugabalog Darvin3 -Ue_carbon Howdidudothat JuleTron Pirate-Jack N3rull Ascension Cykur Dargoon999(20%) Raging Amish(Vasari: 12) Ovi_187 SivCorp(10%) Nay- Volt_cruelerz mbaron888 DesConnor lifekatana Pbhead EadTaes Sobric Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Increase Damage bonus to heavy armor type?: Yay- Deceiver_0 TheRezonator Gugabalog -Ue_carbon JuleTron Pirate-Jack Howdidudothat mbaron888 DesConnor(Light) Ascension lifekatana EadTaes Dargoon999 Raging Amish(175%+) Ovi_187 Sobric SivCorp(25%) Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- Volt_cruelerz Pbhead Increase Hp/Shields/Armor?: Yay- Deceiver_0(armor) TheRezonator Gugabalog Darvin3 JuleTron Ascension lifekatana Dargoon999(10%) Ovi_187 Warlord Mike eoncommander Nay- Volt_cruelerz Pirate-Jack Howdidudothat mbaron888 DesConnor Pbhead EadTaes Raging Amish Sobric SivCorp Kitkun Extremor Increase ability range?: Yay- Deceiver_0 TheRezonator Gugabalog Volt_cruelerz -Ue_carbon JuleTron Ascension Eadtaes Dargoon999 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- Howdidudothat mbaron888 DesConnor lifekatana Pbhead Increase firing arc?: Yay- TheRezonator Gugabalog -Ue_carbon JuleTron Pirate-Jack Howdidudothat DesConnor N3rull Ascension Eadtaes Raging Amish Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Extremor Nay- Volt_cruelerz mbaron888 lifekatana Pbhead Dargoon999 Ovi_187 Kitkun eoncommander Increase turn speed?: Yay- Darvin3 EadTaes TheRezonator Pirate-Jack ReadyMan Howdidudothat mbaron888 DesConnor Mindseye N3rull Ascension Pbhead Eadtaes Dargoon999 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Extremor eoncommander Nay- lifekatana Kitkun Tweak Targeting AI to favor support cruisers?: Yay- Deceiver_0 TheRezonator Gugabalog Darvin3 Volt_cruelerz JuleTron Pirate-Jack mbaron888 DesConnor N3rull Ascension lifekatana Eadtaes Dargoon999 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- Howdidudothat Pbhead Nerf Counters- Decrease LRF Damage?: Yay- Proletari Darvin3 Azrak_Navarion ReadyMan Howdidudothat Mindseye Ascension Eadtaes Dargoon999(10%) Nay- Deceiver_0 Volt_cruelerz Pirate-Jack mbaron888 DesConnor lifekatana Pbhead Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor eoncommander
Decrease LRF damage bonus to medium armor?
Yay- Deceiver_0(125%) Ovi_187 Howdidudothat Sobric eoncommander
Nay- N3rull Cykur Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor
Increase LRF resource cost?: Yay- Extremor Nay- Deceiver_0 Pirate-Jack Howdidudothat mbaron888 DesConnor lifekatana Pbhead Eadtaes Dargoon999 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun eoncommander No Fix Needed- Soasertsus dresdaREPULSE:Many have said repulse needs a fix. Personally I agree. Nerf Guardians- Increase AM cost?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Raging Amish crashmatusow Ascension Pirate - Jack Volt_cruelerz Tohron Darvin 3 Top vasari mbaron888 Proletari -Ue_carbon Major Stress Mindseye Azrak_Navarion lbgsloan Gugabalog Soasertsus Howdidudothat JuleTron DesConnor lifekatana -aceca- Derek06 Cykur Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- dresda
Increase cooldown rate?
Yay- Raging Amish Deceiver_0 Howdidudothat Kitkun Extremor eoncommander
Nay- Ovi_187 Juletron Sobric Cykur
Decrease AOE?: Yay- Gugabalog -Ue_carbon DesConnor eoncommander Nay- Pirate - Jack Major Stress crashmatusow Mindseye Soasertsus Howdidudothat dresda lifekatana Pbhead Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor Increase resource cost?: Yay- Ascension Volt_cruelerz Sobric Extremor Nay- Pirate - Jack Major Stress Soasertsus Mindseye Gugabalog Howdidudothat dresda DesConnor lifekatana Pbhead Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Warlord Mike Kitkun eoncommander Cause damage to shields?: Yay- EadTaes Volt_cruelerz dresda Nay- Major Stress Mindseye Soasertsus Gugabalog Howdidudothat DesConnor lifekatana Pbhead Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Buff Counters- Increase LF ability range?: Yay- Gugabalog TheRezonator Volt_cruelerz Derek06 Raging Amish Sobric SivCorp Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- Pirate - Jack Major Stress Soasertsus Mindseye DesConnor lifekatana Pbhead Ovi_187 No affect to Cap Ships?: Yay- Pirate - Jack Major Stress Volt_cruelerz DesConnor Cykur Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- Mindseye Gugabalog Soasertsus lifekatana Pbhead Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Increase Distortion Field (targeting) range?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Soasertsus Sobric Kitkun eoncommander Nay- lifekatana crashmatusow Pbhead Raging Amish Ovi_187 Extremor No Fix Needed-MISSILE BARRAGE:This has been a heated issue for several months. In the most recent patch, the devs made the graphic unique (red missile exhaust?) and extended the duration while reducing dps. Was this enough? Nerf Missile Barrage- Decrease total damage?: Yay- Extremor Nay- mbaron888 Gugabalog TheRezonator Volt_cruelerz -Ue_carbon Howdidudothat DesConnor Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Increase AM cost? Yay- Ascension Ovi_187 Nay- mbaron888 Gugabalog TheRezonator Volt_cruelerz -Ue_carbon Howdidudothat DesConnor Derek06 Raging Amish Sobric Warlord Mike Extremor Decrease AOE? Yay- Tohron mbaron888 Howdidudothat JuleTron DesConnor Sobric Nay- Gugabalog TheRezonator Volt_cruelerz -Ue_carbon Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Warlord Mike Extremor Buff Counters- Increase range on ability interrupts?: Yay- Tohron TheRezonator Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Extremor Nay- Gugabalog Volt_cruelerz -Ue_carbon Howdidudothat DesConnor LF abilities can target caps?: Yay- Gugabalog TheRezonator Sobric Warlord Mike Nay- Volt_cruelerz -Ue_carbon Howdidudothat DesConnor N3rull Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Extremor Graphic/Audio Improvement?: Yay- Eadtaes Deceiver_0 Volt_cruelerz Gugabalog TheRezonator -Ue_carbon Howdidudothat N3rull lifekatana Derek06 Cykur Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Extremor eoncommander Nay- DesConnor No Fix Needed- Deceiver_0 EadTaes Azrak_Navarion Major Stress Top vasari Soasertsus ReadyMan lifekatana SivCorp Kitkun eoncommander CARRIERS:Extensively nerfed in the previous 2 patches, carriers have lost their place as a hard counter to long ranged frigates, as flak frigates can now destroy fighters much faster than they are built, and long ranged frigates can now hunt the carriers themselves down. Buff Carriers- Decrease build penalty?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Ascension crashmatusow Pirate - Jack mbaron888 Volt_cruelerz lbgsloan Gugabalog Top vasari Soasertsus Howdidudothat JuleTron N3rull lifekatana Derek06 Cykur Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun eoncommander Nay- DesConnor Raging Amish Extremor Increase fighter HP?: Yay- Ascension Mindseye Azrak_Navarion Gugabalog Howdidudothat Derek06 Extremor Nay- Pirate - Jack mbaron888 Volt_cruelerz Soasertsus DesConnor lifekatana Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Reduce movement penalty?: Yay- Tohron Soasertsus Raging Amish mbaron888 Gugabalog Howdidudothat JuleTron ReadyMan DesConnor Derek06 Sobric SivCorp Extremor Nay- Pirate - Jack crashmatusow lifekatana Cykur Deceiver_0 Ovi_187 Kitkun Nerf Counters- Reduce Flak rate of fire?: Yay- EadTaes Warlord Mike eoncommander Nay- Mindseye Gugabalog Volt_cruelerz Soasertsus Howdidudothat DesConnor lifekatana Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Kitkun Extremor No Fix Needed- Major Stress -Ue_carbon PbheadSCOUTS:With the recent nerf to carriers, scouts have come to the forefront as a decent anti-lrf ship, and with their new found popularity some changes have been suggested. Nerf Scouts- Reduce damage buff against light armor?: Yay- Volt_cruelerz Ovi_187 Nay- Deceiver_0 Ascension Soasertsus Gugabalog Howdidudothat Derek06 Raging Amish Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor Increase scout supply requirement?: Yay- Nay- Ascension Pirate - Jack Volt_cruelerz Gugabalog TheRezonator Soasertsus Howdidudothat Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor
Increase resource cost?: Yay- Nay- Ascension Pirate - Jack Volt_cruelerz Gugabalog TheRezonator Soasertsus Howdidudothat Derek06 Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun Extremor Buff Vasari Scouts- Increase Hp/Shields?: Yay- Deceiver_0 Raging Amish Volt_cruelerz Ascension Pirate - Jack Soasertsus Mindseye TheRezonator Howdidudothat Derek06 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Dargoon999 Extremor Nay- Gugabalog Ovi_187 Increase damage?: Yay- Ascension Raging Amish Volt_cruelerz Gugabalog TheRezonator Soasertsus Howdidudothat Derek06 Cykur(+.5dps) Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Dargoon999 Nay- Extremor No Fix Needed- EadTaes mbaron888 JuleTron Major Stress -Ue_carbon ReadyMan DesConnor lifekatana Pbhead eoncommanderILLUMINATORS:The relative strength of illuminators has been under debate for some time, and many fixes have been proposed, here are a few, let me know if you’ve got others. I've done my own research, and have posted my findings. Nerf Illuminators- Increase resource cost?: Yay- Ascension Volt_cruelerz Ovi_187 Pirate - Jack EadTaes Top vasari lbgsloan Gugabalog Azrak_Navarion Soasertsus Howdidudothat Derek06 Extremor Nay- Major Stress -Ue_carbon lifekatana Raging Amish Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun eoncommander Adjust damage division between beams?: Yay- Deceiver_0(33%) mbaron888 -Ue_carbon Gugabalog DesConnor N3rull Ascension Derek06 Raging Amish(33%) Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike eoncommander Nay- Pirate - Jack Major Stress Soasertsus Howdidudothat lifekatana Kitkun Extremor Decrease/adjust the HP/Shields?: Yay- Pirate - Jack (hp only) EadTaes TheRezonator Ascension Gugabalog -Ue_carbon Soasertsus Howdidudothat DesConnor -aceca- Derek06 Cykur Raging Amish(Hp&Armor) Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike SivCorp Kitkun Extremor(450/500) eoncommander Nay- Major Stress Volt_cruelerz Soasertsus lifekatana Increase supply requirement?: Yay- DesConnor Derek06 Kitkun Nay- Pirate - Jack Major Stress Volt_cruelerz Gugabalog Soasertsus Howdidudothat lifekatana Raging Amish Ovi_187 Sobric Warlord Mike Extremor eoncommander Decrease Damage?: Yay- EadTaes Ascension Soasertsus Major Stress Gugabalog ReadyMan DesConnor(Caps only) N3rull lifekatana Ovi_187 Extremor Nay- Volt_cruelerz -Ue_carbon Howdidudothat Derek06 Raging Amish Sobric Warlord Mike Kitkun eoncommander No Fix Needed- mbaron888 Mindseye dresda Pbhead
More to come-
Siege Frigates Buff Siege Frigates Increase Hp/shields/armor?: Nay Change armor type (currently light)?: Nay Decrease Resource cost?: Nay Decrease Supply Cost?: Yay Increase Bombardment damage?: Nay Make TEC Heavy Fallout Active (currently passive)?: Yay Reduce Heavy Fallout effect time (currently 6 minutes)?: Nay Reduce Xp value (currently 65xp)?: Yay Apply fixes to siege militia?: Yay Apply fixes to siege pirates?: Yay No Fix Needed-SEREVUN OVERSEER Buff Serevun Overseers- Increase firing arc of abilities?: Yay Increase turn rate?: Yay Make 'Reactive nanite armor' omnidirectional (360 degrees)?: Nay Increase reduction of jump speed for 'Jump Degradation'?: Yay Allow 'Jump Degradation' to do a damage % to incoming enemy vessels' hulls?: Nay Allow 'Jump DEgradation' to disable passive regeneration?: Nay No Fix Needed-SKAROVAS ENFORCER Buff Skarovas Enforcers- Decrease Resource Cost?: Nay Decrease Supply Cost?: Nay Increase hp/shields/armor?: Nay Increase Damage?: Yay Cheaper damage upgrades?: Nay Higher reintegration rate?: Yay No Fix Needed-DOMINA SUBJUGATORS Buff Domina Subjugators- Increase firing arc of abilities?: Yay Increase turn rate?: Yay Make abilities AOE?: Nay Remove channeling from abilities?: Nay Fix Targeting AI (on all abilities for all races) to prevent wasteful use?: Yay No Fix Needed-CARRIER CLASS CAPITAL SHIPS Buff Carrier Caps- Increase Initial Armor? Nay Increase Squadron Capacity? Yay Make SC buffs AOE? Nay Increase additional drones(Adept Drone Anima)? Nay Re-work Scramble Bombers? Yay No Fix Needed-LIGHT FRIGATES Buff Light Frigates- Increase Damage?: Yay Increase Damage bonus to armor type?: Yay Increase Hp/Shields/Armor?: Yay Increase ability range?: Yay Increase firing arc?: Nay Increase turn speed?: Yay Tweak Targeting AI to favor support cruisers?: Yay Nerf Counters- Decrease LRF Damage?: Nay Decrease LRF damage bouns to medium armor?: Yay Increase resource cost?: Nay No Fix Needed- REPULSE: Nerf Guardians- Increase AM cost?: yay Increase cooldown rate?: Nay Decrease AOE?: Nay Increase resource cost?: Nay Cause damage to shields?: Nay Buff Counters- Increase LF ability range?: Nay No affect to Cap Ships?: Nay Increase Distortion Field activation range?: Nay No Fix Needed-MISSILE BARRAGE: Nerf Missile Barrage- Decrease total damage?: Nay Increase AM cost? Yay Decrease AOE? Nay Buff Counters- Increase range on ability interrupts?: yay LF abilities can target caps?: Nay Graphic Improvement?: yay No Fix Needed- CARRIERS: Buff Carriers- Decrease build penalty?: Yay Increase fighter HP?: Nay Reduce movement penalty?: Nay Nerf Counters- Reduce Flak rate of fire?: Nay No Fix Needed- SCOUTS: Nerf Scouts- Reduce damage buff against light armor?: yay Increase scout supply requirement?: nay Increase resource cost?: nay Buff Vasari Scouts- Increase Hp/Shields?: nay Increase damage?: yay No Fix Needed- ILLUMINATORS: Nerf Illuminators- Increase resource cost?: yay Adjust damage division between beams?: yay Decrease/adjust the HP/Shields?: yay Increase supply requirement?: nay Decrease Damage?: yay No Fix Needed-
Agreed. When I asked for a Subversion buff I was asking to make it more useful more often. On paper the Antorak looks fine, but it isn't. It is almost never needed. Same goes for the other abilities. If Subversion actually briefly disabled enemy structures due to sabotage, then that would be deadly.
Also, the Dunov and Rapture are far, far more direct in support then the marauder. Both actually hurt the enemy. The Marauder doesn't physically hurt the enemy and doesn't physically help you either.
As for the deige frigate I think reduced fleet supply and greater health would be good, but to remove the seige rush putting them higher on the tech tree would be good. Making them too good causes huge problems because they are so low on the tech tree. Higher research prereqisites would remove the dreaded seige rush.
For the three new questions:
1) NO!!! For heavens sake NO!!!
2) Yes
3) Yes
Siege Frigates Buff Siege Frigates Increase Hp/shields/armor?: nay Change armor type (currently light)?: nay Decrease Resource cost?: yay Decrease Supply Cost?: yay Increase Bombardment damage?: nay Make TEC Heavy Fallout Active (currently passive)?: yay Reduce Heavy Fallout effect time (currently 6 minutes)?: yay Reduce Xp value (currently 65xp)?: nay Apply fixes to siege militia?: yay Apply fixes to siege pirates?: nay No Fix Needed-SEREVUN OVERSEER Buff Serevun Overseers- Increase firing arc of abilities?: nay Increase turn rate?: nay Make 'Reactive nanite armor' omnidirectional (360 degrees)?: yay Increase reduction of jump speed for 'Jump Degradation'?: yay Allow 'Jump Degradation' to do a damage % to incoming enemy vessels' hulls?: nay Allow 'Jump DEgradation' to disable passive regeneration?: yay No Fix Needed-SKAROVAS ENFORCER Buff Skarovas Enforcers- Decrease Resource Cost?: yay (should apply for all vasari ships tbh) Decrease Supply Cost?: yay Increase hp/shields/armor?: nay Increase Damage?: yay Cheaper damage upgrades?: yay Higher reintegration rate?: yay No Fix Needed-DOMINA SUBJUGATORS Buff Domina Subjugators- Increase firing arc of abilities?: yay Increase turn rate?: yay Make abilities AOE?: nay Remove channeling from abilities?: yay Fix Targeting AI (on all abilities for all races) to prevent wasteful use?: yay No Fix Needed-CARRIER CLASS CAPITAL SHIPS Buff Carrier Caps- Increase Initial Armor? nay Increase Squadron Capacity? yay Make SC buffs AOE? yay Increase additional drones(Adept Drone Anima)? yay Re-work Scramble Bombers? yay No Fix Needed-LIGHT FRIGATES Buff Light Frigates- Increase Damage?: nay Increase Damage bonus to armor type?: yay Increase Hp/Shields/Armor?: nay Increase ability range?: yay Increase firing arc?: yay Increase turn speed?: yay Tweak Targeting AI to favor support cruisers?: yay Nerf Counters- Decrease LRF Damage?: nay Decrease LRF damage bouns to medium armor?: yay Increase resource cost?: nay No Fix Needed- REPULSE: Nerf Guardians- Increase AM cost?: yay Increase cooldown rate?: nay Decrease AOE?: nay Increase resource cost?: yay Cause damage to shields?: nay Buff Counters- Increase LF ability range?: yay No affect to Cap Ships?: nay Increase Distortion Field activation range?: yay No Fix Needed-MISSILE BARRAGE: Nerf Missile Barrage- Decrease total damage?: nay Increase AM cost? nay Decrease AOE? yay Buff Counters- Increase range on ability interrupts?: yay LF abilities can target caps?: yay Graphic Improvement?: yay No Fix Needed- CARRIERS: Buff Carriers- Decrease build penalty?: yay Increase fighter HP?: nay Reduce movement penalty?: yay Nerf Counters- Reduce Flak rate of fire?: nay No Fix Needed- SCOUTS: Nerf Scouts- Reduce damage buff against light armor?: nay Increase scout supply requirement?: nay Increase resource cost?: nay Buff Vasari Scouts- Increase Hp/Shields?: yay Increase damage?: yay No Fix Needed- ILLUMINATORS: Nerf Illuminators- Increase resource cost?: nay Adjust damage division between beams?: yay Decrease/adjust the HP/Shields?: yay Increase supply requirement?: nay Decrease Damage?: nay No Fix Needed-
Not a good idea.
Probably not a good solution. Increased Antimatter cost would be better. Bottom line, multiple Guardians will be able to get the same effect either way....there has to be a solution to counter Repulse without nerfing the ability to uselessness.
Nah...I think you should increase other things ability to kill LRF in the balance of the game rather than nerf LRF themselves.
Serevun Overseer- Allow 'Jump Degradation' to disable passive regeneration?----Vas need buff so yes
Repulse- Increase cooldown rate?---I say flatout remove it and Guardians will still be on par with hoshis
Light Frigate- Decrease LRF damage bonus to medium armor? ---YES!
Random thing I noticed. For the record, if you decrease the damage bonus scouts get against light armor, you're also decreasing the bonus fighters get. Need I say more.
Correct. Both are anti-light, so unless you want to make LRF's unstoppable, don't do it...
Yep, an example of how small tweaks have a large impact. For example, in 1.10, carriers built fighters fast enough to be resistant to flak (which was having target selection issues, anyhow). Strong fighters countered Long Range Frigs, which in turn gave Light Frigs a role to hunt down Carriers. Strong fighters also countered scout armies and somewhat marginalized bombers.
Every time you adjust just one ship or one damage type, it has a whole chain of effects on unit balance. Currently I think Vasari are a bit disadvantaged except on maps with extra neutrals (such as 8 players on a 10 player random). One advantageous tweak to a Vasari support ship could make a huge difference to game balance and put them back on par...just like the Subverter nerf took away their strongest late game tactical advantage against the other race's cheap ships.
for advent, i wish!
I did a little looksy at the guardian. The duration of repulse is supposed to be 30 seconds, and at 6 antimatter a second with a 30 second antimatter cost to fire, 210 antimatter for one shot of repulse makes sense.
If there was a way to program it so that a channelling ability means the ship can't break the ability mid-use, we might have a fix. I'd still say up repulses antimatter rate though. Say lower the duration to 15 seconds with a cost of 12+ antimatter per second. That might help. These are just options, so before someone gets the chance to chew me out, it's just a thought
It's a good idea. How ever if it'S channeling will it continue to repulse for the whole duration of the channeling? That would be bad. But if it only repusles at the start then its good.
Deciever you should star a topic about mines.I think they cost to much and arent effective enough.Its a gamble to use them and even then you probably spend more then it kills.Anyway I suggest a decrease in cost by about 25%.Just an idea...I never see them anymore in mp.
Good idea mindseye, its true mines need a little help. I try and use them as much as I can, but I never get around to it unless I've got a huge econ, but the trade off then is I have a crap load of planets to try and protect. And your right it is a gamble, the game doesnt come with a whole lot of chokepoints (especially on Random maps), so you luck out if you have a good one, but chances are your enemies will find a way around it. A 25% reduction in cost may help, but I also think you should get more mine for your money and they should cover and area at least 50% larger than they currently do. Either that or they need to be super deadly. Right now it takes around 6-7 deployed to cover the edge of a gravwell for 1 phase lane and around 8-9 to cover half the edge of a gravwell (for planets anyway). Thats a pretty big investment currently for something that may or may not deliver a serious blow to an incoming enemy fleet, that is IF (note the big IF) the enemy decides to come from that direction. Plus once an enemy plows through that thin line, the rest are very likely to go to waste, so you'll probably have 1 deployment do some damage, abd the rest to just sit there and look intimidating. oooh scary!
the only reason i ever use mines is to clear the pirate base if i am vasari. but really i have to agree mines really are too easy to go around or destroy even if they are placed at the very edge of the grav well it is possible to make your ships jump in short so you can just go around, i have done this on numerous occations.
instead of a cost reduction i think their explosion radius should be bigger that way they could do some serious dmg to enemy fleets if they get too careless.
Well in the beta they were insane because they were free and had no limit but now there is a limit per gravwell I think they could be farely cheap and we would be safe.Its like you say enemy can go around and if he brings a few scouts the minefield is no sweat and thats the prob with them being so expensive.Seems to me to deploy a round of mines cost more than a cobalt and would barely even kill that 1 cobalt if he ran thru it so its off balance imo.Mines should be deadly and a real obstacle.Plus for vas they have to build a specific unit just to deploy them.
25% mine reduction price: Yes
I think the real problem with mines is that they are visible. Making them stealthed, and I mean really stealthed; only detectable by... Capships? and/or Scouts with a mine detection upgrade would make them very useful. But if we are talking about an easy fix, then yeah I think a drop in price would be good.
If they were stealthed like then they they would need a price hike.
Actually, I wouldn't mind a raise in cost if they were completely stealthed.
I may be wrong, but I seem to remember a thread not to long ago where a couple of people attempted to mod some invisible ships, and had some serious problem solving issues with it. I don't remember if they actually succeeded, but it may be a tough concept to include. A price hike would definitely be warranted if they were invisible until detected, but that may be asking a little too much of the Devs. It's also probable that they thought of this while developing entrenchment and couldn't get it to function properly, so decided to do without it. I'm going to do a little research and testing on the mines and post some clear cut fixes for voting real soon.
Personally I like to build mines around my frigate factory / repair bay combo when I'm on the defensive against illums. Illuminators need to move in close to use all their beams, but with mines on the field they can't do this without sacrificing some of their numbers. At very least it buys you precious time.
Still, I find mines to be way too easy to disarm, avoid, or otherwise just tank through with flak frigates (those things can absorb so much punishment before dying for so low a cost). The sacrificial lamb can knock out enough mines as to disable your defense. Something needs to be done, because right now they're quite costly to deploy considered how easy they are to counter.
my $0.02-
decrease credit cost by 25-45% (50%?, unlikely, mine spamming would probably ensue)
decrease other costs by 30-40%
decrease construction time for TEC's mines. The other 2 races can deploy a field of 10 in about 0.5 seconds. The TEC take around 10-30 seconds (depending on the constructor count, constructor location before construction begins, etc. etc.)
With all the mines, I think an increase in damage would be good. 40-50% increase. Additionally, perhaps having the Vasari's mines be able to put a max of 30% of their damage through shielding and directly hit the hulls of enemy ships.
With the TEC/Vasari mines, a radius increase for the damage is a great idea. I don't theink the Advent need this, considering that their mines move/home in on targets.
Gravity Mines- wide area effect, and have the ships either a. completely immobile or b. moving extremely slowly
I think tec should be the cheapest and least damaging because they are easily spammed and totally defensive.Advent should prolly cost the most and maybe do most damage and vas should be in the middle.Before I get bashed advent are the most advanced(homing) and should do the most damage since they detonate off the hull of the ship.Aditionally it takes away squads from hosts.The balance should be in the cost so Im not asking for any inbalance here.
It might be cool if a vas mine hit a ship it slowed it down kinda like the egg bomb.It would make their mine fields more deadly if you couldnt get thru them with speed.
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