Case for a Fallen Enchantress – Legendary Heroes Expansion
1) Firstly sales/economic.
Frogboy already announced on one of the journals that the Downloadable content packs sell really well and are a great source of income for LH.
Secondly I’m willing to bet that the original income from hard sales of Fallen Enchantress & Legendary Heroes was below initial expectations because War of Magic didn’t meet expectations and Stardock gave out free copies of FE & LH to a large customer base.
I think this is enough reason to argue that an expansion pack around the $40-50 range would generate sufficient income if the content included was appropriate to the cost of the expansion
2) Development
-I would argue that expansions are a lot easier for any game producer than trying to make a brand new product. Why? Because the underlying engine, graphics support, AI & other systems are in place. Expansions allow for more development on improving existing features and adding new content – this gives reviewers and players much more to talk about also.
-An expansion imo carries much less financial risk and risk of a disastrous launch. I.e the dev team is not under huge pressure to build and release a new & largely untested fully functioning game to the publishers because of an underestimation in the required development time.
3) Marketing
-Expansions already have community and public support
-An expansion is going to get much more publicity than a big patch (2.0) or a series of downloadable packs.
-An expansion is a very powerful means to really ramp up public support for a game. I explored with Civ 5 Vanilla in a net café. It didn’t really do much for me so I didn’t bother buying it. I happened to read the reviews on BNW a few years later and that really excited me so I went and bought both expansions simultaneously….
-Expansions often have better reviews than new games. How many ambitious widely anticipated strategy games have had disastrous or poor launches? Remember Sim City 5, C&C4, War of Magic & Civ 5?
Regarding Civ 5 on release. It was pretty scaled back and received a lot of criticism from disappointed players. Gods and Kings expansion brought it up to a level that many players decided was acceptable with the fantastic Religions feature, but the second expansion Brave New World was what really defined it as what I think is one of the greatest 4X games in history.
To me Legendary Heroes feels like it is sortof around the Gods and Kings level or perhaps a bit below. It functions and its mostly fun but there still feels like there are many areas that need improvement before it is something that really raises the bar for the 4X experience. Many of these I would argue are fixable. Sure patches & purchasable content packs will help move the game in that direction but why stop there? An expansion promises you the financial return and allocates the dev team the sufficient resources to really bring things up to speed.
Before I go on I would argue that an expansion should not include naval warefare, ships and sailing/moving between continents unless the dev team was really sure they had the resources to do a good job of it. My reasoning is that it will take a lot of resources to implement sailing and moving across oceans & AI etc for sea battles and I’m not sure if it will really end up a shining point for the game.
Don’t get me wrong naval battles and sea exploration is interesting but it is VERY difficult to do well and I can’t help but think the dev team would be better putting their resources in things that would enhance areas of the game that already are in place.
I would like to see a new DLC focused on 1) tactical combat, 2) new tactical maps, 3) new tactical spells, 4) new monsters and 5) new weapons.
New Monsters - Example
For 1.8 I would give priority to adding LOS functionality to tactical battles and differentiate the ranges of ranged weapons.
I'd also like FE:LH to be further developed, either via expansions or DLC. I'd happily throw my bucks at an expansion for sure. The game is fun and quite polished right now, but there are still things lacking (e.g. Hall of Fame) to become one of those timeless masterpieces that will be played for decades, like MoM. And one can never get enough content.
The fact that (as pointed out by other posters) there are several more fantasy 4X games lately shows that there is demand, and that there can be a large market of players especially for the one or two games in the segment that get the reputation of being the best. Stardock has a good foothold with FE:LH, and it would be a pity for them to abandon the segment now IMHO.
E2015 doesn't pique my interest that much, to be honest - my favorite part of 4X games tends to be the beginning, when you are struggling with a couple of cities and learning the basic techs, so a game where you skip that part... well, let's see how it goes, but in principle I'd definitely take the current FE:LH to a desert island over a game like that.
hope everything will be better again, good luck.
If the LH universe continues, I'd really want it to be a sequel, for two reasons
1) 64-bit support. You can see how the Elemental games were held back by 32 bit. I wish SD had made the engine 64-bit only.
2) I really kinda wish the next game would be "Bacco's Dream"- so kinda "LH-A Different Story" (Madoka fans might get what I mean by that)
My dream concept is something Alpha Centauri ish with 7 defined factions (5 Kingdom Factions+Krax+ a new one), with the 4 Fallen Races being independents that work on their own rules (think Haroun/Gauri/Drauga/Slaanri) from Kohan. I think such a concept could be pretty neat. Of course, custom Kingdom races would be allowed- and I'd have no death shards unless corrupted. I'd probably throw in the opposition (as I imagine it right now) from E2015 as kinda an Infernals option (from FFH) that pops up from a wildland as an additional element to deal with.
I would instantly buy a LH expansion.
Ideally its focus would be on underused traits, new traits, new and more diverse races, an undead rework (skeletons being pointless, whole race seems to be scrappy tbh)
And of course, more strategic overlay work, by far the weakest point of this game compared to other 4x games.
Same.
Curious what you mean by "strategic overlay work" ?
I'm referring explicitly to the strategic elements of the game as opposed to the tactical elements. (combat)
In the case, I feel this game has a bit of weakness in city building and diplomacy moreso.
Ah cool right, yeah I tend to agree with those. Hopefully diplomacy will get some love in a 2.0 at some point, it's pretty much the biggest weakness in the game at this stage imo.
Double post ignore.
Are we still due a 2.0?
Froggy posted this message on another thread in this forum
Quick status report on LH.
In July we released 1.7. In August we released an update to that which was largely a bug fix.
Right now we're about to announce a new fantasy game in the series but is NOT a replacement to LH (i.e. LH is a 4X empire builder, the new game is an asymetrical 4X).
Once I have a chance we will be updating LH to v2.0 which is scheduled to have these features:
I don't have an ETA for this as I have to put my time between GalCiv, the new fantasy game, and LH. But most of what I'm talking about is backporting.
We also have a new DLC I am desperate to get out there that is mostly new tactical battle maps and new random map seeds.
SHIPS. I WANT SHIPS.
Fishing boats. Caravels, Triremes, Frigates, LOTS AND LOTS OF BOATS.
I WANT TO EXPLORE THE OCEAN. I WANT TO ATTACK A CITY FROM THE SEA.
S H I P S.
Oh, and I like 4X empire builders, so yes, I'm a lot more interested in an expansion to FE:LH than I am interested in SK.
I like to build an empire and interact with other empires. Doesn't look like SK is that, so..... maybe it's not for me.
A new stand alone game would be better than expansion to a sequel. Call it 'Legendary Empires' and make it a full-blown 'Fantasy version of Civilization'.
FYI the mod XtraDeconstruct supplies this. Sorcerers can summon ships, too.
I would buy an expansion, definitely.
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