Okay. I wanted to try TEC. So if you are a fan of the TEC maybe you all can help. I have a couple of questions.
1.) What ships and combo of ships do you focus on? What does you TEC fleet looks like?
2.) Economy. What do you research. In what order? What do you do to get that economy roaring.
3.) What do you do with diplomacy as TEC? If anything?
4.) I keep hearing that TEC is a fast starter? How so?
Any help will be greatly appriciated. I stink at TEC.
1. Hoshikos, lots and lots of Hoshikos. The LRFs are nice in mass quantities as well. Armor upgrades are essential. Sovas and Akkans are great early game starters. Akkans continue to be useful end game as well. Marza's Missile Barrage is great for crowd control. The Orgovs are the death of any starbase. Though the Vasari takes a little bit of work due to its movement abiltiy.
2. Trade ports
3. Supply Pact. Extra 800 supply is awesome
4. The Akkan is a fairly decent in offensive capabilities allowing for ease of militia removal plus its colonization allows for you to get metal/crystal production up an running instantly.
TEC is a faction that's all about getting the upper hand early with a superior economy and fleet, then pummeling its opponent into warm goo by sheer overwhelming power. Definitely a great faction for those who like pressure games.
Early-on, TEC should lean on its economic bonuses to get some rapid expansion going. An Akkan can colonize most planets with reasonable militia count single-handedly, though you may want half a dozen scouts escorting it to quickly clean up Krosovs and Javelis in the militia. This frees up some population cap for a second force to go and colonize asteroids and very-low militia planets. Remember, all you have to do is knock out the Krosovs and Javelis, then you can colonize and build a turret. If the militia count isn't that high, then you now own the planet and only needed a handful of scouts to do it!
Using tactics like these, plus its economic advantages (that cheap metal extraction tech can be a real boon if you have a volcanic next door) you should be able to get a competitive and powerful economy running very quickly. This should be funneled straight into a powerful military. Have multiple frigate factories pumping away with Javelis, Gardas, and Hoshikos. If the map is large enough, you can hop straight to Kodiaks instead of Javelis. Attack aggressively and try to keep the enemy behind you. The other factions do not get a support cruiser as good as the hoshiko this early in the game, but if you let up the pressure, you WILL meet guardians and subverters, which will make your job significantly more difficult.
The TEC's defensive options are fantastic, and as such do phenomenally well in a battle of attrition. Their firepower is unspectacular, though it will do the job, though the time it takes to do that job is significantly longer than most other fleets can survive. If playing a long game where it is viable, build a force of Hoshiko's and Cielo's alongside your main force, the Hoshiko's will augment the TEC's already bullish resilience and help them stand against the withering firepower of the Advent, and the Cielos will increase damage output, allowing the TEC to counter the Vasari, who's ships are very difficult nuts to crack.
Also as Darvin said, pressure is key, with a strong enough economy, you can keep the pirates off your back with bounty on other players, which can force less well off players to spend precious resources on defences, the Incite Rebellion ability is useful as well, forcing the enemy to moderately harden all their planets, not just their border worlds. This is excellent since, thought the TEC rule the field militarily in the early game, late game the military situation can look quite grim.
Finally, never underestimate the power of specialising planets into production. A single fortress world with naught but factories and a few trade ports can allow you to replace your losses with lightning speed, even before Industrial Juggernaught is researched.
To be honest, all the factions have some superb defensive options at their disposal.
Cost for cost, TEC actually has the best overall firepower of any faction. In fact, there are only two weapon types that have an advantage over TEC: fully upgraded phase missiles, and fully upgraded plasma. On every other count, TEC either matches or surpasses the other factions for damage.
Ever since the Illuminator bug-fix, early-game rush forces have been dominated by TEC's brutal mix of low costs, high survivability, and brutal firepower. Vasari can keep up with the Skirantra and assailant, but a good TEC player will push them on the defensive. Advent... good luck buddy, you'll need it.
TEC really has three big problems in the vs Vasari matchup. The first problem is the subverter, which will shut down a lot of your firepower. The Cielo's buff is meaningless if your units are disabled. The second problem you face is bomber spam, which can cause tremendous damage to your forces and knock out capital ships before you even get a chance to use their abilities. The third issue is phasic traps, which will shut down your entire strike craft force when you go on the offensive, greatly limiting your options. Having counter-measures in place for these tactics takes priority over unlocking the Cielo.
I'm not saying the Cielo is a bad unit, but I find it's not useful enough to justify a 5-lab cost, and it's not going to have nearly the impact of a guardian, subverter, or hoshiko.
Most people play with pirates off, especially in Diplomacy.
Be very careful of researching this ability. The attacks it sends are quite small and easily repelled by a modicum of defense, but grant significant amounts of experience points. You may actually end up making your opponent stronger by leveling up their capital ships, and this tech does not have an off button. I've actually seen people lose because they research this. This is easily the most double-edged tech in the game, and personally I wouldn't touch it with a 10-foot pole.
Akkan/Sova leads are great...however, you don't absolutely have to have an akkan to pull off a double colonization start, and the Sova is much better IMO for rushes...
I would also seriously consider a Marza as your 2nd capital ship...it heavily depends on the map and number of players, but a Sova/Marza rush can be brutal....go for their planets and avoid their fleet if you decide to do a Marza rush...
It all depends on proximity. Since you don't have time to scout before you buy your first capital ship, that can be a bit of a gamble. If the enemy is within 4 jumps (give or take depending on the intervening militia) then a Sova start is a great lead. Anything more and the Akkan will pay off in spades, and the Sova start only really shines for cleaning up more difficult militia.
Again, on most maps you don't actually know which will work better until you've done your scouting, so it's a bit of a gamble. Both are very respectable openers and should serve you well. That said, on multistar or otherwise expansive scenarios, you should always lead with the Akkan, and on sudden-death scenarios (or those that could be sudden death) you should always lead with Sova.
Marza can work if you outplay your opponent, but I'd put it behind the Kortul and Vulkoras opener in terms of viability. A Marza opener is something you pull out when you want to handicap yourself without being completely silly about it.
I find Akkan/Marza works even better than Sova/Marza. Having the ability to colonize the planets you bomb out on the fly is extremely advantageous, while the economic opener from the Akkan gives you the frigate-power to support the more vulnerable capital ship types and run down the carrier caps that otherwise threaten them.
The problem here is that the Marza has to charge up to 85 antimatter to use raze planet, so if you're jumping around too much you have to wait a significant amount of time before the ability activates. That makes fast hit-and-run exercises more difficult. The Vulkoras doesn't have this issue, and only needs to charge up to 35 to put down a platform (and that passive boost is always in play). So the Marza is better suited to going after high priority targets and making it stick rather than trying to play a flighty harass game.
Since TEC is the fastest race (quickest to get capital killing dps, and quickest to get an economy up) as TEC you need to know when to go economy. If you scout your enemy thoroughly and you notice that he/she isn't able to put a lot of pressure on you early on, then you can quickly build an economy even if you are on the front lines. This can pay off hugely in the long term, and you should always be pressuring the enemy, and always trying to fleet cap and maintain a good economy.
I've tried this before just for the hell of it, but it didn't work out really well...you are right, the raze planet is AM expensive and the akkan isn't all that bad at laying siege...
I definitely will never pick a Marza as my opener on ICO, but as a 2nd ship I've had it work for me...the biggest reason why I pick the Marza is that I generally open with a Sova...at that point, getting an akkan 2nd isn't nearly as useful as opening with one and I really don't want to pick a Kol...
:'( The Kol really needs some lovin'.
Kol is, in my opinion, the worst capital ship opener in the game. I think every other capital ship has at least some redeeming quality or niche tactic, but the Kol has nothing. It really needs to be brought up to the level of the Kortul.
Considering its one of the best looking Caps... its sadly skin deep.
It does become highly competitive when you're up against strike craft heavy opponents if you can put a few levels on it, but that's really situational.
The major problem with the Kol is its totally dependent on AM to be of any real use, which is a problem no other capital ship has.
Except for the advent battleship. That ship is truly terrible. At least the Kol has flak and can slow a ships speed to zero. I would say a Kol is a good opener for a lrm spam, as flak will thin the fighters and the slowing the enemy down with the kols special attack is good to get those extra few seconds of dps to take out a capital ship.
Plus a Kol is great against the vasari. Its hilarious when they try to SB your planet and the kol just snipes it dead in one hit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGC09B810Yk
lol @ musical smack down ^
Love the song and yes
Everything YOU know is wrong.
nuuuu... you!
Radiance has detonate AM which is one of the most useful abilities in the game...that ability single handedly carries that ship...Kol isn't carried by anything...it is a bitch to kill once it hits level 6 but other than that it really contributes very little to your fleet...you are better off building frigates for the extra DPS as DPS is the only thing a Kol really gives you...
Flak burst is a very debatable ability...in theory, you'd think it would help protect LRMs from fighters, but in reality you are probably better off with simply more gardas or a Sova with fighters and heavy SC...when it comes to shooting down bombers, they have too much HP to make flak burst useful...at lvl 3 you might find flak burst work against Advent bombers (and maybe TEC) but Vasari bombers are just too damn resilient...add on repair cloud from skirantras and the fact that scrambled bombers will disappear before you destroy them, and flak burst really comes out only marginally helpful...
A double tap with lvl 3 flak burst can do some damage, but your opportunity cost is so high that you almost always have a better choice other than a Kol...
Like I said.
Thank you Seleucia for actually providing a counter argument.
A Kol is a much better investment than the advent battleship and here is why.
The Kol is very effective when combined with a LRM spam. Warp kol in(warp it first to close range, the enemy will think you are giving him/her a present and allow it to close range, usually), and engage the enemy fleet. warp in lrms and have them make a beeline for the enemy cap. kol is absorbing damage (something it is good at! wow) and can snipe the enemy cap when it tries to move(most effective during a turn). LRMS get a bunch of time to kill the fleeing capital ship. cap ship dies fast, since the TEC are going to have the most firepower in the early game. The Kol lives because that is what it does, and you just forced your enemy into a retreat. Flak burst is a great ability, its ability to defend a fleet against a bomber spam isn't debatable, I've done so many times, and I have seen many others do it as well. The kol levels up, and now it can start putting ability points into flak burst if you need to.
Now lets compare that with the advent battleship.
It has no anti-strike craft abilities, and it can be easily kited to avoid any use of the detonate antimatter ability. Detonate antimatter is damage over time, you won't be able to pump out the dps. Also, the battleship has no defensive options against fighters later on, which means that it is only really created for cleansing brilliance. Detonating the antimatter of carriers isn't going to happen, the ship won't be able to catch them, and is only useful against enemy capital ships.
This argument assumes players are reasonably intelligent. Players who aren't will let their carriers get destroyed, and they will let their caps sit there and get destroyed by detonate antimatter. A clever player can easily avoid this ability and therefore nullify the effectiveness of the ship. That is why the advent battleship needs some attention. It is tactically only useful for cleansing brilliance.
Here is a reasonable suggestion to improve this battleship.
This ship could be improved by making its taunt ability more effective. Enemy players couldn't redirect the focus of their ships until the taunt is finished. This would be a great way to reduce enemy player fleet effectiveness and a nice addition to the advent fleet. If this ability affected fighters as well, that could give the advent a different form of anti strike craft capability. Since the taunt is limited to a certain number of targets, this would never become unbalanced. This could be a milder form of fleet control when compared to repulse.
aww, come on. you got to admit it was a good troll.
but seriously. Ima numbers kinda guy. I play with numbers.
once you run the numbers... you find that at low levels, the kol has only marginally more not-dieing power than the radiance, and at higher levels, the radiance beats the kol... by like a factor of 2 thanks to advent shield mitigation and its passive armor.
radiance doesnt have AM problems. Kols will have am problems even if they have culture bonuses and a lv 6 donov near by.
GRG is a JOKE. the speed decrease is pathetic. the damage is pathetic. 1050 damage? more like... 1050*.35*.75*1/(1+.05*armor)
Detonate am, removes am, does damage directly to hull (skipping shield mitigation, armor bonuses, and armor), and acts as a disable.
as long as the enemy ship still has AM left... detonate AM ends up doing more damage per second than GRG, even if the kol had unlimited am. and it doesnt.
7 lv3 flack bursts to kill a max research vas bbr iirc.
anyone that builds a radiance for cleansing brilliance is prolly a nutjob. maybe if you stack it with malice. maybe. less damage than a missle barrage, and very tricky to aim. Radiance is MUCH more usefull as a cap disabler with its detonate am, than as a ultimate ability user.
Radiance's speed is 525. carriers speed is 450. do the catching math.
I honestly havent played much with taunt since the patch, so i cant comment on it.
but kol<radiace<almosteverythingelse
Uhmmm excuse me but your argument above, Sareth, seems a little biased. For the Radiance example you clearly describe a battle against a clever opponent (moving caps away from detonate AM, kiting etc) and yet for the Kol battle you describe it as if playing against a retard. No clever player is going to focus fire on a lvl6+ Kol and certainly not anything lower. There is no point doing so. The opponent is going to blast the hell out of those LRMs and then giggle at the Kol's attempt to do enough damage to overcome basic repair abilities/mitigation/armour to destroy any vessels. I personally would love to see the Kol as a good choice. The ship looks great and could have potential. I lobbied during the 1.2 Beta to have GRG turned into an interrupt and at least buffed further. And Flak Burst too. With Finest Hour slightly nerfed for high end Kols, I would like to see low end Kols buffed to a decent degree.Might happen in Rebellion but we will see.
The Radiance can shut down enemy capital ship abilities while dealing damage that's comparable to GRG, and it has a passive defensive ability that's comparable to adaptive shields. Not defending the Radiance as an opener, but it's still worlds ahead of the Kol.
Anyone who starts construction of a starbase when your units are sitting right there is being extraordinarily careless. Heck, just shadow the constructor with a squad of bombers and you'll get the same effect.
Flak burst works wonders against large forces of strike craft (like 30+ squads), but you won't see that until significantly later in the game. Against smaller forces, you won't get your value out of this ability compared to basic attack damage from an equivalent expenditure of gardas.
Sareth, in your scenario you're talking about the power of the LRM, not the power of the Kol. The Kol simply doesn't bring anything to the fight except a good chunk of HP, so a good opponent will ignore it, clean up your LRM, and then finish the Kol off afterwards. You'd have gotten way better value out of anything else, particularly if you were smart about it.
hey guys i only use Kols as my opener capital ship and i find it works amazing and if you know how to use it right Kols can pull major pownege against Vasari and they eat Advent capitals for breakfast
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