There have been many suggestions that heroes are too weak, too all-the-same, need to level-up faster, need more variety of special abilities, etc, etc. I started one thread on that general theme months ago in the beta days.
My point now is that there are also just too many of these wimpy, bland heroes. And if they address the above points, heroes as a group could actually be too strong. Currently people use heroes as scouts and cheap garrisons, but what if all those heroes were real super-heroes ? Yikes !
When/if heroes get, well, "heroic", then getting one should be a big deal. Maybe not as big as getting a dragon in Elemental, but still a much bigger deal than it is now.
And if they have time to get fancy, I'd still like some heroes to be much better than others, like "heroes" vs "champions" in MoM. Then "heroes" could still be a bit plentiful, but "champions" could be the rare big deal. I know they have some of that now with the sovereign's kids & grandkids, but so far my offspring mostly haven't been up to expectations.
I've been thinking that perhaps each (or maybe just most?) hero should have a quest associated with them that you should have to successfully complete for them to join your faction.
I want "Fallen" race heroes
I like the idea that heroes start off better then your average individual unit and gradually get stronger. A "Warrior" heroe, IMO, should always be one step ahead of the default or average soldier or a small group of soldiers. They should be survivable, strong, resourceful, but not superhuman or invincible. I've tried to address this in the "Abilities and Traits Mod", if you haven't checked it out already.
Secondly, we do lack a good variety of heroes. This shouldn't be a problem because we can mod the game; we can add new heroes. I suggest that everyone here make one or two heroes and submit them to the "Community of Heroes Project". If half of the players did that we'd have enough interesting, fun, and unique heroes to go around.
We could even have a Fallen Heroes Modpack if we had enough heroes.
I agree they should start off a little stronger and have to improve but any heroes you pick up later in the game get killed in one shot by nearly any enemy spell. This is the major problem I've had with them. Even at the start of the game they die very easily. Maybe if the were kept as they are and simply have a way to purchase a resurrection for them in your capital at a special building or something we could at least bring our weak heroes back but at a price.
I don't think heroes should be simply "super units", but they do have to be better than individual units in the way they level up.
Regular units should automatically increase HP and combat stats, while heroes should get to choose stats to improve and some kind of special abilities (not necessarily every level).
Some heroes will still be better than others since they will have better initial stats and abilities and maybe different development options.
At the same time, some heroes will be physically weaker than most regular units since their ficus will be on non-combat skills like economy bonuses.
The point is not strength differences between units and heroes, the point is that regular units are just "sword man" or "archer" while a hero is an actual unique character, different from other units and heroes, and the uniqueness (not necessarily the power) gets bigger every level.
Then maybe every couple levels the heroes should have a list of special skills they could choose from instead of just stat increases. Every other level give them an option to add a new ability or increase one they have such as turning the +1 gildar per turn into +2. I also think the first hero you recruit at the start of the game should always be opposite gender from the starting sovereign to at least give you the change to marry. I've gone through the game and not found a single female hero before.
I will say I learned today while making a new sovereign that the pre-build ones can't be duplicated with the number of points we are allowed to allocate at creation. I tried to make a custom sovereign with the same stats as an existing one but just with a different appearance and I didn't have enough points to spend.
I would like to see heros give units in armies they command access to battle actions. Example: Hero A knows the Shield Wall and Charge Action. Units in the amry he commands (ranks highest) could select either of these actions or none each turn.
Charge - +4 attack, -2 defense for 1 turn, if start turn not adjacent to enemy unit. (must be unmounted)
Shield Wall - +4 Defense, -2 movement for 1 turn, if units equipped with a large shield (must be unmounted)
Calvary Charge - +4 attack, -0 defense for 1 turn, if start turn not adjacent to enemy unit. (must be mounted).
A player selects a battle action for his hero to learn at specified levels. The battle action's available are based on their inventory. A hero without a large shield cannot learn Shield Wall. A hero without a mount cannot learn Calvary Charge.
Edwin, I would like to see those abilities, but making them determined by a hero is a bad implementation. They should be inherent, assuming units have the appropriate equipment. Heroes could provide bonuses, though. That makes there be such a thing as generals. A general could grant, say, +1 attack whenever a unit is using one of those abilities.
Some minor nitpicks on the abilities themselves:
Charge is wrongish, there shouldn't be a defense penalty, logically. It would probably be okay being entirely positive.
It occurs to me that both charges would scale better if they increased attack speed, rather than attack. This could have balance issues, but I think it would do a lot to make tactics matter more.
Cavalry charge should require that you're mounted, of course, and less obviously a shield wall should require that you're not.
My thinking in having them determined by heroes is that only the heros (a general) would give units a command to use a shield wall or to charge.
An army without a commander (hero), or with a commander lacking the knowledge of when to issue those order would suffer. There units would not know when to properly charge or adopt a shield wall. They might know the drill, but would not receive the orders to use these tactics.
Thus making the assignment of hero's to armies more important. An army without a hero would lack the coordination and timely use of tactics that a skilled commander can use to achieve victory.
One easy way to implement "Commanders" is to add a morale bonus to each history and profession. Warriors and Generals give more morale then Merchants and Assassins (assassin = anti-social).
Funny thing to say for a "hobbit king" but I completely agree!!
It's true, Heroes suck pretty hard.
PROBABLY BECAUSE:
1. regular troops gain at least as much stats from levels
2.hero items are rediculous expensive and most hero items you find (equipment stash not soverign items) suck. It is easier to give a troop items then heroes.
3. heroes cant stack and therefore dont tier as well as troops. They become more worthless as stacks get bigger.
4. hero bonuses and spells dont tier either, even the ones that should. Chain lightning completly ignore the fact that a stack is eight guys not one.
I agree the current heroes are bland and not very useful... looking forward to the Master of Magic mod where they are unique and potentially powerful.
If you tend to go adventuring tree like I do then lots of heroes are a good thing, bland or not. You need them to go to the notable locations and one in every city is ideal, particularly when notable locations start piling up.
Of course if heroes had more style and character, and leveled up a tad faster, maybe with some better special abilities (though don't get rid of the tech, arcane and gildar bonuses), and there was cooler gear you could outfit them with... that would be even better.
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