Finally got the game for Christmas yesterday (Woot me! ) Installed it, upgraded it & started playing. Started small with a "Random Small" game.
Long story short I played for roughly 4 hours till I dozed off about 3am. Started up again this afternoon & I'm about 2 hours further into the game & the AI just threw about 200 ships at me on 2 different planets!! It'll be a wipe for me but I'll use it as a learning experience.
I'll explain "MY" gaming style and someone please tell me what I need to change.
In all RTS games I pretty much build up my defenses & $$$ before I really do anything. I kept the pirates (for the most part) off my planets & anything that came near me was quickly "dealt with". I guess in a nutshell I'm a defensive person first then I "make my move" when I feel I'm ready. Should I be doing less defensive work & put more towards offense early on in the game? I know I'm still learning everything but any tips/hints would be greatly appreciated.
Not sure what else to describe here but I'll be more then happy to offer up any info you'll need to help me play better at this game.
Thanks!!
Your problem is that you're building too many defenses too early. Try instead to expand quickly and build a strong fleet. A colonizer cap (Akkan Battlecruiser, Progenitor Mothership, Jarrasul Evacuator) is extremely efficient at expanding. Just keep colonizing worlds to get a quick dominance on your foe. Against the AI, LRFs (Javelis LRM, Illuminator Vessel, Kanrak Assailant) are a very good ship to use; build many.
For actual defenses, Repair Bays are easily the best. They're cheap and extremely efficient at keeping a fleet alive. If you have Entrenchment, an upgraded Starbase with repair bays can handle a good-sized fleet. Against pirate raids, the best bet for a defense is a capital ship with a few repair bays. The ship can easily handle any pirate raid, and gives a lot of levels!
Thanks, SS! Redoing this map with your tactics in mind. I have 1 question for you. When you say "Repair Bays" for actual defenses, what are you speaking of? Your not talking about the repair platforms themselves are you?
Also...not sure if the AI is "cheating" or not but when I got into the game, I immediately created 2 colony frigates & sent them to 2 different planets. As soon as I got to each one, there were approximately 3-4 LRF already at each planet. How could the AI have created those, and got them to each planet, so quickly??
Thanks again!
What you encountered are the defensive militia that are randomly generated at each planet. They aren't controlled by your AI opponents- they just stay there and attack anything that comes in.
Btw, congrats on getting the game. Any chance you'll be joining us for MP (after you practice up a bit?)
Starting by turtling doesn't work in any RTS game I can think of. Repair bays and platformes are the same thing requiring 1 or 2 military labs to research depending on which race you choose.
The behavior you talked about isn't cheating and is completely normal behavior from the ai. The ships you refer to are neutrals that make you work a bit to take your new colony. Asteoids have a few ships ice worlds have a bit more, volcanic planets have more than ice worlds and terrain planets have quite a few neutrals. It's a good idea to send a bunch of scouts out to get the lay of the land and plan your planet aquiring strategy.
My first impression is that you're not capturing enough planets before you hunker down and start turtling. If you want $$$, the best way to get them is to capture planets. It can be very tempting to build expensive structures like trade ports early on, but this doesn't make economic sense until later in the game. It always depends on the map, but in general you should ensure you have at least 2 planets for every 3 your enemy controls.
The first thing you'll do when a game starts is dispatch scouts. You need to know the map layout; where is the wealth, how well is it defended by militia, and where is the enemy. As you start to get the whole picture, you should be formulating your strategy. Which planets are you going to take, and how are you going to take them? There are only two reasons to stop capturing neutral planets: either you need to recall all your units to the fight, or there is literally nothing (accessible...) left to colonize.
As far as defenses go, your best bet is always with your fleet. Turrets and hangers are exorbitantly expensive, particularly if you need to buy tactical upgrades to build them. You will almost always get a cheaper and more effective defense out of your fleet, and it is capable of moving from one planet to another. The best static defense to support a defensive fleet is always the repair bay. In fact, a single level 1 capital ship with two repair bays will defeat any pirate raid, even at maximum danger levels.
Contrary to popular opinion that it's a rush game, this is the first thing a player does in Starcraft: get defenses up at choke points. Although its pacing is different, Sins is in many ways more aggressive than Starcraft because there is a much greater rivalry for resources in the early game. In Starcraft, it's very common for most of the expansion sites in a 1v1 to be untouched over the course of the game. This is untrue in Sins; unless players started very close together it's more likely that virtually every planet will have been colonized before the game's end.
These are called neutral militia. They inhabit the neutral planets at the start of the game, and must be eliminated if you want to claim their planets as your own. The number and type of militia depend on the planet. Asteroids are always very lightly defended, ice and volcanics have low to moderate defenses, and desert and terran planets can be moderate to extreme. The neutral militia will attack anyone, including enemy AI players.
You can colonize the planet while militia are present, but any siege frigates in the militia will immediately begin bombing it. If you kill the siege frigates, you can colonize the planet and then build turrets to kill the remaining militia. This is a favourite strategy by multiplayer gamer and if well played can defeat any militia force.
I may give MP a shot in the near future, Yakov. I just hope I'm not overwhelmed by playability of everyone out there & get frustrated quickly due to inexperience. Nothing worse then getting into a MP game & getting slapped around then never wanting to play the game again.
Darvin3/Elonin....thanks for the info. I'm anxious to give these tactics a try & see what happens. The dispatching of scouts, I learned back in my Command & Conquer days. Just to "see what's out there". The way I've got it running now is about 5 Javelis LRM's & a Akkan Battlecruiser that shows up about 1-2 minutes after my scout. Then shortly followed by a colony frigate.
Stay tuned all!! Thanks again!!
I am talking about the repair platforms. If you're TEC or Vasari, they can be researched with only one military lab. Advent takes two labs, but are a bit better with healing. These are especially good defenses, because you can plant two and quickly repair a fleet within a minute.
Those are the planetary miltia, as Darvin said. Militia are always unupgraded TEC ships. With Asteroids, you can kill all of them and colonize. To quickly colonize, clear out all the siege frigates and LRFs, colonize, and built a turret. The turret can usually clear out any remnant militia, and saves an enormous amount of time otherwise killing off their durable ships. If the planet has multiple Kodiak Heavy Cruisers, you might want to build two turrets and a repair bay. Afterwards, scuttling the turrets will give back some of the much-needed resources.
EDIT: Also, you really should look at the Multiplayer replay topic and download some of the replays. It's extremely helpful watching what some of the veteran players do, and can really improve your playing style.
Well although many people do rush, Turtling is not a bad thing to do, It's fine if you like to do it
And in Entrenchment it is sometimes a better choice to turtle up in the beginning.
All RTS games have "Rush", "Turtle", and "Boom"
Agreed. You can learn a lot more a lot quicker by watching people who have done it a lot longer than you ever have. Simply because people are WAY better than AIs in this game.
I think that there is a third and fourth: It is not profitable to colonize any more planets (I.E., they all are right next to enemy strongholds, or they are just SO FAR AWAY that the income reduction from distance makes them not worth the time or the development resources, in the long run. But thats rather rare); the planets that are still neutral have absolutely no strategic importance whatsoever.
It may be fine, but in MP, rushing is far more popular, it can sometimes be the only chance someone has to destroy an enemy before theey become TOO heavily defended (I.E., a fully upgraded SB over every planet and all tactical slots filled)
just a side point, if you are using the Akkan (or any other colonizer capital ship, the Mothership or Jarrasul) you dont need the colony frigate, just make sure to put a point in the colonize ability for the colonizer capital ship
You kidding me? That's one of the best reasons to colonize a planet. Getting a foothold near an enemy is one of the best things you can hope for early on! Maybe you'll get driven out and have to abandon it, but 9 times out of 10 if given the chance to take such a planet I'd go for it!
Minimum loyalty is 35%. Even at that low number planets are still worthwhile investments. Lower priority perhaps but worthwhile all the same. That free logistics space is also worth something in and of itself.
However, as I said "accessible" might be a consideration. If you've got nothing nearby to take the planet, it might not be realistic to trek towards it or to build a dedicated force for that one purpose.
Always depends on the map. It needs to be really isolated to be not worth my time and energy to grab it.
That's because the random map generator for 3v3 and larger tends to put players very close together (often 3 or 4 jumps distance) which encourages a rush. It would be different if the maps were different.
Good advice, SS. Thanks.
Discovered that as I progressed through the game. Good point!
I redid the initial 2 player map last nite, actually tweaked the AI down to "easy" & played again taking all the advice here. I did much better, especially since I was not so concerned with getting a whole garrison of turrets initially. I turned the pirates off (or so I thought) but there was still a whole system chock-full of 'em. But they never attacked me. I have about 80% of the game done. Will have to take out the pirates & 3 more planets & I think that'll be it.
How long does a average game take? I thought I was moving along fairly quickly but I'm still at over 3 hours with at least another hour to go. I'm not complaining mind you...this just adds playability in my opinion. I'm just curious to know if I'm going too slow or what.
Stay tuned!!
Even when pirates are disabled, there can still be a pirate base with enemies. They won't attack unless you enter the base, so it's not necessary to defeat them. However, bombing and colonizing a pirate base will give an extra 3 credits per second.
A typical game in multiplayer usually lasts about 1-2 hours. In single-player, it's dependant on the size of the map and enemy difficulty. Defeating an Unfair opponent on a Small map can take about 45 minutes, but other games can last hours.
when you got your feet under ya and want more try this mod
https://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/335474
You don't have to defeat the pirates to win. The pirate base is usually ignored anyways, unless it happens to have strategic importance. If a planet is strategically valuable, all bets are off as to how far a player will go to acquire it.
Side note...I'm starting another game after winning the last one. Do I have to set up my player' name, pic & colors each time I play?
nope
Well, could you please elaborate as to how I get passed this?
Also, I was told by Ryat in another post that to watch replays of games I must find replays made with the version of the game I'm using (v1.181). Could someone please finish Ryat' post & let me know where I can get replays of games using v1.181? Thanks
well, it should be set once you do it the first time, should be set to map selection automatically when you select Single Player
there will be times when you reload the game (obvious) or get some of the x-packs (highly recommend)
as for the replays, I not sure where they are on the forums, I know mine wont work because I play with the DS mod on all the time
Well, at any rate, as to your general strategy..
I was at one time a player very much like yourself. In virtually every RTS game I have, I turtle. Since I started playing sins, I've adopted a new strategy: Expand as quickly as possible before hitting the enemy line. Once that occurs, entrench said planet and create another fleet to colonize the worlds I missed earlier while I colonize the other border planets with the first fleet, but I never have it go more than two jumps away so that it can return quickly should the border become endangered. (Later in the game I get phase stabilizers up because I play as Vasari so I can go however far away I want and still return more or less instantly)
My point is, learn to expand quickly. I originally played as TEC, and they were okay, but I then tried the other races. As it turns out I expand far faster with the Advent and Vasari than with the TEC (I can't stand the Akkan in any way shape or form, so I never get it). The result was that thanks to the Progenitor and Jarrasul, I was able to expand fast enough to defeat normal AI's (to begin with I struggled with easy ones). Then over time I've gotten better and now I can kill unfairs with relative ease..
In the thread, Behind the Times (in the general discussions forum), I explain what I did to defeat a heavily and almost insurmountably defended enemy. Now, this was done using Entrenchment, but the same principle applies. If the center of the line won't give, try to flank them. If that flank won't give, create a second fleet and put pressure on the opposite flank. This forces them to split their forces (making the first battle easier, and causing some lag before the troops arrive for the second one, allowing you to push a planet or two in before they arrive). Now, since you have vanilla, entrenching is far harder, but it can still be done. The point of this is, put pressure on them at all times and don't let them know where you are going to attack. When you do, be swift and wipe out the colony and begin establishing your own before they arrive. Once they do, attack the other flank. Rinse and repeat.
Also, once you decide on a dominant race, tell us so we can give you specific information on it..
This works in the campaigns in the other RTS games. It tends to be your only choice. When it's skirmish mode, though, I think it's actually normal to do an initial rush, even in most other RTS games. And then that's followed by a turtle; at least when you're playing a tough AI with lots of resource cheats. Heck, in most of the CnC series, what I would do is play 1v2 vs. hardest AI's, and immediately rush one and knock him out. In RA2 I was playing 1v7, all hardest. Um, yeah, I turtled....
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