Though there are already Mod efforts aimed at creating an individual Babylon 5 and Star Trek mod, I decided to try and make something that there doesn't appear to be - a Babylon 5 vs. Star Trek Mod. This isn't a post aimed at asking for a team, unfortunately I can only work on the project every other weekend at the moment so I dont want to be in a position where someone else does most of the work whilst I sit back and delegate and I definetly don't want to take any resource away from the efforts of other teams on this forum. However, wanting to use higher poly-counts than it appears to be ideal for some of the other mods and also a desire to only use canon material that was seen on screen, this is what I've been able to put together so far, a Whitestar and Narn Q'Quan. The mod will have two factions with ships across the various races in the TV series in order to make sure only canon ships are in-game.
Hopefully this link works to the pictures of what's in game so far:
http://img31.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=whitestar.jpg
As mentioned, this isn't a post to try and build a team to work on it together because progress will be slow but if anyone is comfortable with how textures work in Sins, particularly with things like specular maps and luminosity, if they could get in touch/help me out with some advice that would be really appreciated. Not in terms of building the textures themselves more just guidance with working out how to make the specular and luminosity maps work most effectively. All comments and ideas welcome though too! Thanks!
I forgot to say in the original post that I am happy to release it pubilically either bits of the assets or the whole thing if people want it - all the models are built from scratch etc...
Nice I could finally work out the battle on youtube...
The Pics look nice. Can't wait to see more.
To be brutally honest i was never a big fan of mixing genres up like this. All ST vs SW, or ST vs B5 does is conjur up major arguments over "who is better". Last i checked we mod for fun. Not to fight over nit picky details, and which genre can kick whos ass.
If this is your thing i am cool with it. I like all sci fi be it ST, SW, b5, etc, etc. Just please dont use anything from SoA 2 in the mod. I would hate to see one of my excelsior models fighting an omega destroyer... makes me cringe at the thought.
I agree balancing such a mod would be hard. However, if you balanced them not to each other but to the original three races. It might be easier. The key difference you will probably want to look in to is Capital ship abilities. example sins of the 13th empire has almost no shields on ships but insane armor and health points. babylong the younger races has higher health but really low shields compared to the original races. If you take in to account damage types for examples. cylon and colonials have weapon type damage that affects hulls but not shields so it would be hard for them to win in a fight... reminds me of freespace having to gain the weapons later on in the game that do damage to shields. You think that because of shield the cylon and colonials from that mod would be at a huge disadvantage. however if you look at sheer physical damage to a shield it will wear out, and the damage dont by weapons from some mods to others does damage to shields and hulls while some only to hulls and some only to hulls. This may be one way to balance such things.
I am in no way an expert on modding or on BG, babylon5, ST,Sw myth or history so take that in to consideration. I am not suggesting you take information from other mods besides basic thoughts on how you can mod a ship or ability.
Babylon 5 vs Star Trek - Is like putting Battletech vs Robotech... two different genres sharing one universe, ugly, messy, non-proportionable... etc. B5 Ships have no shields and rely on projectile and energy weapons, Trek Ships have shields and rely on mainly energy based weapons (photon torpedo may be manufactured but in the end it's an energy weapon)
The two are great alone, but combined can only complicate the mod for balancing. One will always be better than the other, despite numerical or technological advantages...
Now say if you combined the B5 ships against the Nexus: The Jupiter Incident ships before discovering the Mechanoids and the Noah wormhole... that would be on part with each other... or Trek ships against ships from Nexus after they go through the Noah wormhole would be comparable (assuming you've played Nexus: The Jupiter Incident), just my two cents...
So this is basically spacebattles.com in Sins?
Why don't you just support the ST and B5 mods? I know certainly in the case of B5 they would appreciate another set of hands and eyes...
I would be interested to know how many polygons your Q'Quan has. We could use that for the b5 mod if its polycount stays within a reasonable limit (if you want to contribute). I cannot speak for the sharlin (not my model) and the avenger (base model came from Zvedochets) but the Nial, Tinashi anf Flyer model you can use freely. If you want to contibute to 'B5 - sins of the younger races' I would need the original model in collada format at best, including the textures so that I can adjust the rootpoints and size of the ship.
You seem a capable modeller so I would appreciate your help and if you would want to make Narn or Centari ships, it would not matter if you were slow in finishing them, because they will be done in the later stages of the mod.
Cheers
TobiWahn_KenobiB5 - Sins of the Younger Races
The Gallery has now been updated to include an Omega too. The writing of Agamenon and the EarthForce Logo have been flipped in the texture file already, unfortunately they came out wrong when I exported the model from Max hence being the wrong way around in the picture posted though this is no longer the case.
I appreciate the feedback, I agree balance is a big isssue so this might be a project I'll re-think or put on hold entirely but Major Stress don't worry I won't use any of the SOA2 models, as I said everything that I put in game is going to be created from scratch.
TobiWahn - I'll find out the exact poly count for the G'Quan and let you know when I am next at the computer I have with 3DStudio, this should be this weekend, and if you want it I am happy to e-mail it over. Alot of the polys come from the detail around the engines and the beams which can be optimized, removed or even re-modeled. Thank you for your offer of the other models you are using but as per the previous line, this is as much about me just improving my modelling/modding skills as anything else. Happy for you to use any of the models I make, or anyone else to have them for that matter just let me know if you or anyone want them. As for contributing to Sins of the Younger Races please feel free to use anything I make but at the moment I can only see myself making 2 Centauri and 2 Narn ships as thats all I can remember from the show but they're yours as and when/if you want them. I've also done something similar to the SOA2 team with making bespoke debris for the individual ships so you're welcome to that too if it's something you want to include in your mod?
Finally, at the moment I'm trying to make one of the first one ships just to see what I can and can't do with Sins:
http://www.isnnews.net/hyperspace/first/first-2_lg1.jpg
but does anyone know how I can make the "fire" spin as well as the discs in game? I've been able to get it to work using a mesh for the flame, which is textured, but this doesn't look as good as a particle effect, so if anyone knows how I can get a particle to rotate along an axis whilst maintaining its vertical integrity that would be much appreciated. Thanks!
You've got some really great looking models. I'm a new comer to modelling and seeing this kind of work as well as others on this site just keeps me inspired to be that good one day.
Just out of interest what era are you looking at in terms of star trek ships?
I've personally looked at just the non-canonical future ships for ideas. Ones like they are creating for the Star Trek MMO. Only because it's different from what has already past.
P.S. Anyone interested in what a Star Trek vs Babylon 5 fight would look like here's a nice video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLk0hhWBhEE
It's got alot of non-canonical things going on (like no shields), but it's still an interesting watch, I think.
Very nice Omega! How is the animation on the rotating section?
The Gallery has been updated again with more pictures of the Omega, some of the Worlock and the Centauri Vorchan.
The gravity section of the Omega works in the way BigBangTheory has posted a couple of times, by making it a particle effect, using the GS Ship shader pipeline effect and animating the mesh so it rotates.
TobiWahn - the polygon count for the G'Quan is 34,754 triangles.
Thanks ZRazor, Bloodember and Steiner for the model feedback!
Wow! Very nice screens!
Omega has always been my favourite ... but the other ships are peachy, too.
Great work! Looking forward to your mod!
34,000 tri's is just a "little" high for a game model. Especially if many of the same ships are on the map at once. Try lowering the count some. There are ways to do it without much loss of detail. Im sure most systems can handle a model that high in itself, but i am thinking of the lag 100+ of those 30k models will create even on the best of systems (taking into account all the other ship meshes, effects, and textures). The highest poly model in vanilla sins runs in the 10k range (starbases), and gets lower from there. The average capital ship is no more than 4500 polys (tri's). What detail a mesh lacks is made up for with textures, and bump mapping.
Not trying to knock the model, its a very nice mesh, but you dont want to limit any mod to only high end systems.
Hmmm, I think it would be an awesome model to use as a type of starbase. Those floaty dealies could probably pump out some massive evil.
Thanks for the offer. I do like the pictures very much, unfortunately, to not waste too much memory, I try to stay within 7 to 15 k polys for big ships and 2000 - 7000 for small to medium ships. If you can get the ships to this size, I would be delighted to use or models (and give proper credit!!!) BTW - How many polys is the Omega? That one ship would be a huge addition to my efforts, as it would attract masses of fans I suppose.
As I said before, you can use the assets of Sins of the younger races whenever you want in any way imaginable.
Regarding the debirs - is there on or more debris meshes for each ship? Or do some ships normally share debris? Personalised debris for the capships would be sweet! How do I do this?
Thanks again and good luck with your efforts!
I've done unique debris for every ship by creating individual explosion effects for each of them - this involves creating a new entry in the explosion entity file and then using particle forge to create new explosion effects with meshes attached, which in this case are the bits of debris. So if you want the ship to break into 6 pieces for instance you have 6 emitters each one a different piece of the ship and by applying rotation, speed, angle variance and varying start time the new debris is able to appear after the explosion effect and leave the mesh debris for as long as you set its life time. The modelling and texturing of the debris pieces are the most time consuming thing.
Very impressive trailer! Technological superiority Federation too strong, but ISA gave great battle!
Well done indeed! Kinda hoped I'd see the Minbari open jump points in the feds faces though, oh well.
New gallery featuring the Victory Class Destroyer :
http://img89.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=screenshot46.jpg
Has a working main gun effect too...
Here's some updated galleries, I've deleted the other two and organised the pictures better per race even though they all belong to the same faction for the mod purposes:
Omega (with new texture), Advanced Omega and Warlock:
http://img29.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=screenshot97z.jpg
EarthForce Nova and Hyperion:
http://img86.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=screenshot81.jpg
Centauri Primus and Vorchan:
http://img408.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=screenshot72.jpg
ISA Victory and Whitestar:
http://img29.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=screenshot17nm.jpg
Narn G'Quan and Th'Nor, Vree Xill, Bakiri Avioki and Minbari Tinashi:
http://img257.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=screenshot88.jpg
There's only a couple more ships to go and then the Babylon 5 side will be done!
lol
looks good as this mod been uploaded anywhere
Nope, I built it up piece by piece and it works with the latest update, however I don't think I can distribute it. I'd probably be murdered in my sleep by people on this forum if I did.
However I am posting up movies of each of the seperate factions on youtube in my Channel
http://www.youtube.com/derenek
So far I have stuff up about the CYKAD faction, the brotherhood between the Kadesh robotic drone armada from Homeworld and the Cylons from BSG. The other two factions r the Kushan Colonial Alliance, the Exiles from Homeworld, Ships from the SGC of Stargate, and survivors from the 12 Colonies of BSG. Then there is the Sith Imperium, Sith warlords escaped the rebellion in Star Wars and skipped into this galaxy taking over the corrupt Taidan Imperium from Homeworld and are now attempting to start a new galactic empire in the Milky Way galaxy. Pirates are Wraith Cruisers and Hive ships... I am looking for a working super star destroyer (executor) mesh and a borg cube mesh. I want to make those into motherships and switch other ships around. If anyone has free models/meshes that have working hardpoints and textures I'd love to get them to incorporate them.
I just finished my own modification that puts Babylon 5 against Star trek. It uses the ships from the B5 mod "Sins of the younger races" and the ST mod "Sacrifice of angels 2" . It's for my own use only
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgbF33JedJY
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