As a long time Star Control fan, wanted to give my feedback on the fleet battle beta.
That's it for now. Thanks and keep cranking away!
WOW Starkillr, Great Post I agree 100 percent.....
Only think I would add is to have available the original ships as an option... You know tracking missiles, stealing crew and "fighters"
I look forward to the updates!!!
Thanks
So good. SO GOOD.
Regarding audio and such. We switched to a new audio system literally a week before the beta (it was supposed to be finished a month previously but it took longer than expected). So most of the audio isn't in yet.
Asteroids are not going to cause damage going forward.
Agreed about the excessively wiggling. What was supposed to be subtle turned into "Hey look what we can do!". We're toning it down.
The wrap around of the original games was just a different kind of barrier. It feels like more freedom, but actually isn't.
The last I saw Stardock was planning on having many types of maps, including the original wrap around map they call the "Interstellar Space" map. So, in reality, SCO will have a lot of map variety where SC2 only had one map.
This is just the map they are using in the early beta.
One expects that the combat map would have limits on its area, but the wraparound allows the map to feel like there's no 'barrier' per se. Sure, you can never get further away from an enemy ship than the wraparound allows, but that's the only real limit - you never get the feeling of being cornered against an artificial barrier (or slamming into one) that the current fleet battles map presents. Which, as people have stated, gives the advantage to the slower bruisers. Attempting to fight them with the faster ships feels less like the hit-and-run battle of past Star Control games and more like being in a cage fight with a tiger. Particularly when that barrier starts contracting.
While I'm here, I'd also agree with the OP that a lot of weapons just don't feel all that impactful and different. Some do, some feel like they're just retextures of each other (what is the difference between Tywom Bolt and Scout Shot, for instance?). Now, this in itself isn't necessarily a bad thing: Star Control 2 certainly had plenty of weapons that were very similar to one another, and the ships that had those were generally distinguished from each other by their secondary weapons and by other parameters. There is, from what I've seen, enough to indicate that similar rules apply to SC:O ships thus far, so this could simply be a case of "haven't had enough experience to properly judge", but it does feel as if we're seeing the same general concepts being repeated as opposed to things that are truly unique.
It more takes an unbeatable advantage from the faster ships than it does give the slower ships any kind of advantage. Without some form of barrier (I think of the wrap around screen as just another type of barrier), the faster ship can choose to never fight if it doesn't want too.
I had a suspicion that might have been the motivation. However, the current approach feels totally artificial and creates the situation where the slower beat ships can corner the faster ones up against the barrier, and even without the pilot of the bigger ship deliberately pushing the smaller ship up against the wall, it's all too easy for pilots of faster ships to miscalculate where the wall is and fly into it without warning because of how the camera operates, as long as the slower ship is on the inside.
If you need a stalemate breaker to prevent those indefinite keep-away scenarios, just make it, well, a stalemate detector. If a certain amount of time passes without damage or permanent status effects (such as VUX limpets) being inflicted by either side, the game decides which side is likely playing keep-away (probably most likely to be decided by maximum speed, but special abilities that involve movement might also be considered) and considers that ship to have warped away and forfeited.
(Wrap-around screens are not a barrier in this respect: a wrap-around does not prevent keep-away scenarios except in situations where the slower ship has the ability to strike a target anywhere within the combat area, and generally the attacks that do provide that capability are slow enough themselves that they can be dodged anyway.)
The current artificial barrier is, I think, a cure that is much worse than the disease.
Pretty sure the original ships aren't an option due to the licensing agreement.
(I asked for clarification in another thread, but didn't get a response. Don't know if that's because my post wasn't seen or whether it's because it's something they don't want to talk about.)
Drax, the current BETA map is just one map. The one they decided to use for the initial BETA release. It is intentionally a "boxing ring". If you remove the planet, this is the "serious dueling arena". The map can be much bigger than this and still achieve it's primary goal of forcing faster ships to fight. Even twice as big as it is now, you couldn't run away for so long that it would annoy the slower player. Much bigger than that and the barrier would start to become irrelevant. So the maps can be about twice as big as the current one while still being small enough to prevent "griefing" by the faster ship, or even just boring you to death with a long drawn out fight.
So this map is, intentionally, "the smallest map". They plan on having a lot of different maps. For example, this map might be the one used in the adventure game if a fight takes place in orbit of a planet (or maybe this map with the barrier 50% farther out). If you are traveling through a nebula and encounter a hostile ship, that fight might take place in a nebula cloud map with wrap around edges. In the full game, I would imagine that the map you wind up fighting on will be a representation of where you were when the fight happened.
While i agree with everyone else that there should be no barriers, if the maps do indeed get bigger and it works well, and if it represents the star system that you will be in, i might give it a try. But it would have to work really well to feel natural like in SC2
Exactly my concern wrt "generic" ships being dressed up like i already mentioned here reply #2
https://forums.stardock.com/486074/page/1/#3696037
As to the "perfect balance in SC2" They either completely ignoring what worked in Star Control 2, or and let's hope it's the case, the beta is very unfinished ? Let's hold thumbs it works out in the end.
This is exactly what it comes down to, people already are longing for the SC2 ships because they were so well and uniquely designed, making custom ships just would'nt compare to the well designed ships from sc2, we need developer ships and that's it, take away the custom designing by the player.The uniqely designed ships as was done in SC2 was interesting in every aspect and equally functional.
They had Life in them, Character, the genius was in each and everyone of them, i really am not a fan of spamming ships and fancy dressing the same concept. it kills the spirit of a potentially unique and exciting design which in turn affects gameplay in every respect.
The wrap around map of SC2 is a type of barrier, and the last thing it feels like when you teleport from one side to the other is "natural". It does feel as though you have more freedom, but it also feels strange and doesn't work anywhere near as well as a barrier/wall/arena.
You have to do something to make it work as a game, an open map with no containment doesn't work for a lot of different reasons.
I guess what i meant by natural was that the fact in SC2 it worked, taking all the elements that made the game feel balanced the wrap around map played it's part in making the game feel that way, and gave a sense of unlimited freedom.
However I have yet to give my final verdict on the new barrier concept seeing that we have not been given the bigger maps yet and there is still tweaking to be done, so not bashing it down yet...
All the best to the team i'm sure they are doing their best to get this to work as it should.
Yes, it does feel more free even though it really isn't. It is still an "end of the line" for the faster ship, in a way, but can still be "gamed" to bad effect. "Dancing on the edge of the neutral zone", in Star Trek terms. It works, just not as well as an arena.
In open space speed rules, and even a slight speed advantage means that ship has complete control over the situation. Exchanges of fire take place only when and where the faster ship chooses. Since the only objective in a 1v1 duel is to win the fight, the faster ship will stay at range and only briefly enter the edge of its range to shoot. If it both faster with a longer range weapon than the slower ship, you will never even get to shoot back at it. We call this the "Klingon Sabre Dance", and on an open map it is a "game killing" tactic that makes it no fun for the slower ship which has almost no chance of winning. This is just a single example of the issue, "griefing" is another. If I am in a faster ship and just want to annoy you, there won't even be a fight. I can just stay away from you until you get frustrated and leave the game... just to be a jerk.
I hear what you say, but until i have played on a bigger map and the tweaking has been completed cannot give any opinions on how well it compares to sc2's universe in the "fun,exciting and balance factor" so the benefit of the doubt is still out there, i might like it, or not ? will have to wait and see.
Also just to mention in the wrap around universe the slower ships did have their advantages in a different way, that is one of the way's SC2 made each and every ship exciting to man, the bigger slower ships, their weapons for instance the mycon's fire was powerful and wide, and it could soak up the enemie's weapons as well by firing in the way the projectile is approaching from the enemy, as well as it's ability to regenerate crew made up for it's speed disadvantage.
Now what would happen a lot of times is with the wrap around universe, was the element of surprise, you'd be going so fast in your speedy ship that you would be by accident bump into an asteroid, that would deflect you close to the slow ship, together with the gravity of the star in the middle, would pull you into the big slow monsterious ship's radius of fire and boom, it's over for your little speedy ship, that's one aspect that kept the gameplay exciting, unpredictable as it should in a good surprising way, with anxiousness, tension, excitement, adrenaline and the unknown factor, all wrapped up in one.
While full 3D freedom was never really going to be possible in a game like Star Control, the wraparound, to me, has always felt like it's simply a crude representation of the battle-space being a sphere rather than a square. The idea is that it's assumed that a ship isn't going to simply try to run away (in the full game, this is represented by the warp-out mechanic), so a ship that goes full-pelt in one direction is actually looking to perform a loop to come around from the other side. It's an abstraction, but far more believable than battles occurring in a sphere of bad that for some reason starts contracting if a matchup goes too long, but returns to its original internal diameter once a ship is destroyed and a new one warps in (through that sphere of nasty) to replace it. It's also more fun - at least to me - than being damaged or destroyed by a barrier that you didn't see until you ran into it because you went too far in one direction.
Problem is that the crafting system does allow players to put a long-range weapon on a fast ship and break this balance. Which is part of the reason why I'm inclined to agree with Ur-Quanian that trying to make build-wars a thing in competitive multiplayer was probably a bad idea.
When it comes to the keep-away-to-troll scenario: I've already presented another way of handling this. Give the game a means of recognising which player is controlling the terms of the engagement, and award the victory to the other player if enough time passes without damage or permanent status effects being inflicted by either side.
Check out the Oort cloud.
Custom ships are not available in ranked or unranked and will only be available in custom games, which are not yet implemented.
One of the advantages of the barrier is exactly what you were pointing out, any other method limits ship design by the needs of the map. The "tournament barrier" allows for the widest range of ship designs to function within it.
There is no truly great answer to this problem that anyone has ever come up with. But you don't want "realism". Realism is the faster ship being in complete control of the situation. Realism is most weapons facing aft, or ships that fly backwards all of the time. Realism is definitely not what gamers are expecting in a space ship game.
Gamers want space ships to fly like airplanes, and that has to be forced because it is not natural.
The Oort Cloud is actually fairly diffuse. From what we know, passing through the Oort Cloud is much like passing through the Kuiper Belt, except that it's spherical. There's a higher density of asteroids, dwarf planets, comets, and other bodies outside of the area that has been "swept out" by the planets, but we're not talking about an impenetrable ring/sphere of death here.The edge of the heliosphere might be closer, but that shouldn't be expected to damage any military-rated ship. Voyager 1 left the heliosphere a few years ago without noticeable damage, and that should be more fragile than any Star Control ship.
Custom ships not being available in competitive multiplayer is good to hear, and allows Stardock to make ship design that ensures that slower ships have tools to deal with faster ships as a general rule.
And I don't think that the things you say are 'realistic' actually are. Now, one 'fly like airplanes' aspect is that ships have a maximum speed they can accelerate to under their own power, which isn't the case in space (well, until you reach relativistic speeds, anyway). However, even if you consider physics where maximum speeds less than c are a thing, I don't think that translates to "most weapons facing aft or ships that fly backwards all of the time". Sometimes, in Star Control mechanics, yes, it is advantageous to be able to fly away from a pursuer while shooting back. Sometimes, however, not being able to fire your best weapons in the direction that you're heading can be a substantive disadvantage.
Now, faster ships can be expected to control the terms of the engagement... to an extent. In Star Control 2, though, this is generally resolved by giving the slower ship some advantage to offset it - a long-range weapon that allows them to continue engaging the faster enemy at longer range than the faster enemy can engage them, protection against similar long-range attacks being fired back at them, a means of hindering their opponent's mobility and bring the playing field back in their favour (some more effective than others - which is part of why the Intruder is cheaper than the Avatar...) or some other means of punishing keep-away tactics (a Podship, for instance, will just heal up... which is balanced by the Podship being so slow it usually can't play keep-away itself). These factors can, in fact, allow the slower ship to dominate the battlefield: sure, the faster ship generally has the choice of when to engage, but when they do so, they need to take the risk of flying into the brunt of the slower ship's weapons and defenses. For the faster ship to engage, it usually has to enter the slower ship's threat envelope.
(Noting, again, that some ships do hard counter others and in some matchups this doesn't apply, but the odd case of one ship hard countering another is okay - this is the general rule that applies to SC2 ship balance. There are equally matchups where the faster ship just doesn't have a realistic chance because it doesn't have the ability to damage the enemy ship without taking damage in turn and the slower ship is just more able to take the damage: a lot of matchups involving the Avatar fall into this category.)
So a ship that's faster usually has other disadvantages that means it has to be able to choose the terms of engagement in order to have a chance. Hit and run, try to get into the enemy's flanks (if that matters) and wear the big ship down in repeated engagements where you need to be lucky every time, but where the enemy may only need to get you into their sights once in order to wipe you out. The wraparound map allows this. A ring of death that contracts when the game decides a match has gone too long does not, particularly when trying to win the attrition game with a ship with a low damage output against something with a large crew.
I consider the situation where the faster ship is largely able to control the terms of the engagement, but where the slower ship is that much better armed and armoured (including crew size as "armoured" here) such that the faster ship is taking a risk each time it engages, to be reasonable. In order to win, the faster ship has to engage. Therefore, in order to win, the faster ship has to take risks and accept the potential that they'll make a mistake that the slower ship can exploit.The problem that you seem to be so concerned about is when somebody decides to be a douchebag and refuse to engage at all, therefore drawing out the match indefinitely rather than accepting that their faster ship isn't going to be able to beat the slower one, going out in a blaze of glory, and picking a ship that can beat their opponent's ship. However, completely changing the parameters of the game in a completely unrealistic and, IMO, unenjoyable fashion just because some players may decide to be douchebags is, I think, killing the patient to cure a disease. Having a mechanism for the game to recognise that a stalemate is occurring and punishing the player responsible for the stalemate is, I think, a much more elegant solution. Maybe we could compromise and have the ring of death appear if a certain amount of time occurs without damage or permanent status effects being inflicted by either side to prevent those "I can't win fairly but I'm willing to drag this out until you resign" scenarios. But if the faster ship is able to get in, deal damage, and get out on a regular basis, then I say that they're playing the game and their ship as intended, and should not be punished by giving the enemy ship a barrier against which they can be pushed up against - let alone one that begins to contract because it takes a while to wear down a large, durable ship.
Ugh, quoted when I meant to edit. Is there a delete option?
EDIT Well, since this double-post is here anyway, let's try to make it somewhat constructive:
So, I've been thinking on what conditions COULD create something like what is presented in the current "cage match" battle arena. The requirements for something that could be abstracted into that arena are, I think, the following:
1) A roughly spherical area which cannot be crossed in realspace without taking damage. (This area may be an ovoid that is approximated into a circle on the 2D map, or it may be circular or ovoid in one two-dimensional plane and shaped differently in others, with the assumption that ships mostly prefer to remain in the two-dimensional plane where the area is roughly circular.)
2) A gravitational body inside the sphere.
3) A 'safe zone' within the sphere.
The one and only naturally-occurring situation I've been able to come up with so far that could vaguely approach anything like this is when a solar flare or other intense source of charged particles hits a magnetosphere strong enough to keep most of those charged particles out: this might create a situation where the inside of the magnetopause presents a refuge while attempting to leave exposes a ship to damaging plasma and radiation. I think this is still a reach for a number of reasons (you should need a pretty serious solar flare to present a real threat to a military-rated starship, and such structures usually have a long 'tail' on the far side of the magnetic body) but it could present a more realistic scenario than a magic ring of asteroids.
I still think, though, that the 'cage match' style play is spoiling the game for many in the name of stopping a few douchebags, and I certainly hope to never see it in the story mode without a good explanation as to why.
Asteroids are the traditional "walls in space" within this genre. It's an arcade game, not a starship simulator. I had suggested a "hyperspace bubble" as an alternative, an "interdiction field", but that is limiting in some ways as well. If we made real warships in space, most of their weapons would be facing backwards. If we have equal ships except that your weapons face forwards and mine face backwards, you almost can't win that fight.
The barrier is needed because the fight itself is unrealistic. Nobody would ever fight to the death in the middle of empty space for no reason at all. Your natural instinct is to stay away, and safe, as soon as you start to lose or have a significant disadvantage. So that is what most people will do. It isn't only about "refusal to engage", there really is a lot too it. For example, as you again mentioned the ships can be designed to work on an open map. The Mycon works on an open map. But if you rely on ship design then your ships will all be very much the same. No fast ships with long range weapons, no slow ships with short range weapons... and those are just the two most obvious restrictions.
An objective removes the need for a barrier. The barrier is only needed when the only objective is attrition, destroying the other ship. But in a 1v1 duel in open space, that just won't work without containing the faster ship or designing all of the ships to work on an open map. Designing all of the ships to work on an open map makes them all pretty much the same, there would be very little variety.
EDIT: I should also mention that the current map is about the smallest "boxing ring" you would ever want to use. I would think the "standard map" would be about 50% bigger than the current one. The current map is so small that the contracting ring really doesn't even make much sense on this map. Larger maps might have that ring, that contracts down to about the size of the current map. The current map, with the planet and gravity removed (and I still like just a straight "energy barrier" wall in space better than the asteroids) is really a "serious tournament map". A "standard map" might be about 50% bigger than this, and a "large map" might be twice this size. These larger maps might contract after a time limit, but the current "small map" doesn't even need the contracting ring. The current map is very small, and the planet/gravity at the center making it even smaller and denying the center to the slower ship. The planet/gravity is hurting the slower ships a lot right now, it is taking up the space they want to control without providing a slingshot to give them something back in return for that, which is probably a part of why none of the ships are actually slow.
I feel that the ring / screen wrap debate will be with us for a long time...I trust the developer to find a balance.I would like to point out other issues:1. I just got blown out by a Scyrve ship that fired through a planet I was hiding behind (not nice...)2. The Scryve weapon also hurts you when you are near it and not on it ( which I find annoying)3. It is not comfortable for me to use a keyboard and a mouse to play. I would like to play with the keyboard alone4. I fined it hard to aim. In SC1 & SC2 we only had 3 diagonal positions in each quarter (0, 22.5, 45, 67.5 & 90 degrees) here we have many. So, when we are zoomed out and I need to rotate and fire, it is harder to see where your ship is pointing (maybe I am just getting old...)5. The ships seem balanced --> I liked the fact that every ship in SC2 had at least one ship it could never beat. You needed to know exactly when to use it or else you would lose the match. Here any ship can fight any ship.6. Camera doesn't give you enough margins --> I keep hitting those damn asteroids
Hope this helps!
I am mostly with Johny on this one, i don't understand the need to change an already winning formula that was in SC2, into something that would be second best, realism is very important, the gravity and way ships behaved was realistic and again it worked extremely well in SC2. Also i don't like the "balance" to be tampered with, it was perfect in sc2. i'm still all for the wrap around style as it allowed for a lot of surprises mostly keeping the exciting factor at high.
The slower ships did have their advantages as already mentioned. a tweak here and there to keep the "idiots" from flying infinately would likely be all that is needed (although it never really bothered me, at the end i always found a way to destroy their ship. the hassle of "catching the fly" did not repell the fun factor)
20th-century warships and fighter aircraft have almost invariably had more of their offensive armament facing forward than backwards. The invention of the synchronisation gear that allowed a machine gun to be fired forward through the propeller threatened to give Germany air supremacy in World War 1 until the Allies figured out their own methods of equipping fighters with forward-firing machine-guns, and experiments since with fighters firing their main armament in other directions, such as the British Defiant in WW2, were all failures. (The Germans did have success with upwards-firing Schrage Musik installations, but this was a supplement to the forward-firing armament, not the primary weapon.) Warships generally had the greatest firepower in broadsides due to practical limits imposed on hull design, but designers still try to pack the majority of the primary armament to also be able to fire forward if they can. Even tanks are generally designed to fight an enemy in the direction of their primary movement (which is what I would define as 'forward' for armoured vehicles that are capable of reversing): exceptions, such as the Archer, are also imposed by technical limitations, and for the Archer it was highly impractical to be firing its main gun and moving simultaneously (the gun would recoil into the driver's space...).
I really don't see considerations for space combat overriding the advantages of having your weapons facing in your primary direction of travel. In fact, if anything, they'd be stronger: in terrestrial combat, velocities are limited by various drag factors that are largely proportional to the velocity relative to the common reference frame of Earth. In space, this isn't the case. Any weapon fired by either ship will have the velocity of the firing ship in addition to the velocity it would have when fired from a stationary ship: in practice, this means that firing backwards offers no advantage in effective range or time to target over firing forwards to compensate for the practical complications of not being able to shoot at a target you're flying at. One possible advantage to firing backward at a pursuing opponent rather than firing forward at a pursued opponent is that it might complicate the pursuer's ability to engage in evasive action without breaking off the chase, but when ships are powered by reaction mass thrusters of some description (as seems to be the case in Star Control) this may be counterbalanced by the fact that those thrusters are probably more difficult to 'harden' against enemy fire.
So, history (particularly aeronautical history, which is what space combat physics are likely to be closest to) has shown that forward-facing armaments are superior, and if anything the physics of space combat appear to reinforce this. (Caveat: In situations where engines are relatively weak compared to gravity and ships mostly operate by orbital mechanics, pointing a ship directly towards an enemy ship might not be the best way of getting closer to it, and in these circumstances ships would probably want weapons able to cover as many directions at once rather than focusing forward. However, this does not appear to be the case in the majority of any Star Control battle map)
Now, you may be thinking in terms of Star Control physics, where projectiles do not necessarily gain the velocity of the firer (they do in some cases, such as the Kohr-Ah FRIED, but there are also some very clear cases where they do not such as the Mycon plasmoids). Even here, though, game experience does not seem to hold to your hypothesis: the Spathi Eluder, while a good ship, is not unbeatable, despite having high speed and agility, above-average durability, and a good rear-firing weapon. In fact, the statistics of the Eluder ameliorate some of the disadvantages coming from having their primary weapon: the Eluder can turn quickly allowing it to move into firing position, turn around to point its rear at the enemy, and commence engaging in the Spathi's second-favourite tactic (their favourite, of course, being not fighting in the first place). Ships with slower turn rates would not be able to pull this off as efficiently.
Melee is a bit 'gameified' in the sense that there would be no advantage to the player in warping out over going out in a blaze of glory - the ship is gone for the rest of the map regardless. Unless one player decides to troll the other by dragging out the match, this works: the player with an unwinnable matchup just does what damage they can before bringing up another ship. My proposal, however, would allow for such trolling to be punished (by assuming that a ship that does nothing but run away will eventually just warp-out) without throwing out the baby with the bathwater by turning the simulated freedom of the wraparound map into an unrealistic cage-match. (Having an objective - most likely the planet - would also serve to limit keep-away behaviour.)
Faster ships generally having shorter-range weapons, to me, is something that makes sense from a realism perspective as well as a gameplay sense. Longer-range weapons are likely to be bigger. Bigger weapons require more space to be mounted on a ship, which in turn requires bigger ships. Bigger ships are likely to be slower.
Furthermore, the SC2 model still allows for long-range weapons on faster ships, since it also has a number of slower ships that are able to protect themselves against being plinked at by such weapons, such as point-defence systems, shields, and other defences, while often still having a means of shooting back. While ships that are slow and have short-range weapons, such as the Avatar and Intruder, have means of reducing the mobility of the enemy ship.
I'd agree that, from a believability perspective, an artificial energy field would make more sense than an unnatural asteroid field, but at the bottom line, to me it's less enjoyable than the original formula. And from what I've seen of other people's feedback, that appears to be the majority opinion: there are a few people praising the restricted map, but a lot more saying that they prefer the original wraparound style.
Given that SC2 appears to have managed a high degree of variation between ships despite having the wraparound map that you claim limits ship design, it appears that the only real advantage to the cage-match play is to limit trolling behaviour - and I think there are ways to do that which doesn't punish everybody for the sake of the odd troll.
I don't want to repeat things I've been saying for the last two years. You should read my earlier posts here to understand the true nature of the situation. What I am saying is based on about 40 years of actual experience with this subject that comes from a table-top game called Star Fleet Battles, and in this case a concept we call the Kaufman Retrograde. It is counter-intuitive and most people have a problem with it at first. You like using real world military examples, there were more real-world military people involved with SFB than any other game that has ever been made. We worked this all out pretty completely over the last 40 years. There is a whole lot more too it than just the greifing issue. "Speed is life", and there is absolutely nothing a slower ship can do to catch up too a faster ship that does not want to be caught.
Designing the ships to work on an open map is VERY limiting and exceptionally difficult to do. I know because I have already done it, most of my games that have real-time space combat use open maps for the realism of it. I really wouldn't recommend anyone else trying that, almost all roads in that direction lead to disaster unless you know exactly what you are doing. There are very few ships in Star Control, and designing 3 dozen ships for an open map would be simple (although with very limited designs and throngs of people endlessly arguing for things that couldn't be made to work be added too the game) if the ones that came with the game were going to be the only ships. But with the editor, a tournament arena is by far the best solution to the retrograde for Star Control. Any design works within the arena, on an open map most ship designs will not work.
From what I understand SCO is still going to have the original wrap-around map. It's going to have a lot of different maps. So instead of just the arena, or just the wrap around map, there will be many maps in SCO. It's not like they are only using this one map, both types will be in the game. In Fleet Battles you can choose to play on the wrap around map if that is what you want. It is variety, instead of the same map being used for all battles as was the case in SC2.
And the wrap around map is just another type of barrier, SC2 did not have an open map.
There are many great features available to you once you register, including:
Sign in or Create Account