SOASE 2 Suggestions:
i know that there have been several threads on the forums about suggestions but in this thread we are going to try to illustrate and write about a suggestion we make for soase 2, so that our suggested concept can get through and inspire StarClad
Yes, Im sure those were all balanced with deep, immersive units for each faction.(Sarcasm)
Yes they were in fact.
BFME is probably the best out of the three I mentioned.
Gondor played as a usual base line faction with good defence and decent offence
Rohan was an elite strike type with superior cavalry but weaker infantry and archers and limited siege capability (but daaamn those Rohirrim kick ass!!!)
Mordor was a swarmer, with free crappy orcs plus tougher monster units at higher tier
Isengard was a heavy offensive faction with tough uruks, lots of siege options and good upgrades for them
Both evil factions lacked walls for defense and were more offensive in nature, while the two good factions had walls for their castles and smaller barriers for encampments making them slightly more defensive in nature.Also each faction had access to a variety of Heroes that helped flesh out their options.
The balance was pretty darn good. BFME 2 (without mods) sucked in comparison.
Dawn of War I would place higher above Forged Alliance (simply because Supcom while an excellent very in depth and detailed RTS, also has a very steep learning curve due to all the unit and structure tiers and the hard counters that are present while being well balanced can still catch you off guard.)
But both of those games had a great variety of units that were immersive and balanced.
The fact you seem to think Warcraft 3 is the only successful RTS with four races shows you clearly have a skewed view of reality Sinkillr. Guess that explains the outrageous claims you've made on these forums.
Yes, I'm sure thats why these games sold so much.
Oh wait...
i say well done i like what u did, the super weapon is what i would love to see
on the other hand i don tget why you guys dont want new ships, sins dose not have a huge learning curve, play 3-7 batteles with easy ai and thats it you know the basics
Ah learning, I remember my first game, got curb stomped by the AI
Actually this game has a huge learning curve, the amount of time and effort needed to convert from a SP mindset and tactics to a MP one is huge. Obviously you wouldn't understand because you don't play MP.
They did. Obviously they were successful enough that each one got a sequel just like War Craft 3.... oh wait...
Well, after writing that I was agreeing with Sinkiller on one thing, I gotta say I disagree with him, too.
Another faction is fine, IMO. It's the adding of new units to the existing ones I'm not for. Again, small numbers (2-4) ships is fine, but not more.
Axxo4, it's not that I think there's a hard learning curve, it's that I think you can't introduce too many more units to the existing factions before you begin to overlap and make some useless.
My concern with adding too many ships has to do with balance interactions. The more moving parts you have, the more complicated balancing becomes. Also note that done sin Sins would surely be in a new engine, they'll have to rebuild it from scratch, so while there won't be as much designing, there'll still be a ton of programming.
Further, each roll will be forced to narrow or risk overlap at which point you get everyone forsaking some ships in all but the most extreme circumstances which isn't good.
Realistically, some forming of niches is inevitable.
Another option may be to have "tiers" like in Supreme Commander for each faction if there are that many units. I suppose the Titan would be the equal of the experimental units and the capital ships would fall somewhere in between.
Some units are used a lot early game and become mostly obsolete by late game, while late game units are better suited for specific roles.
I'd say Forged Alliance with some of the mods was a pretty solid RTS.
Problems I felt:
- I felt faction diversity was not too good
- 500 unit cap for large maps was really bad (some mods I think addressed this)
- Multicore support was improved with mods
- Experimentals tended to be changed a lot with mods so YMMV depending on which mod you used
Agree with Volt_Cruelerz. Everything is pretty well covered with as far as roles are concerned. At this point, all that is needed is balancing, which is a serious PIA.
UnleashedElf, tiers wouldn't solve it, either. Actually, it might make it worse. There were definitely units in SupCom that you didn't use anymore once you're economy was strong enough to support a higher tier.
what? lol u just gota use common sense while playing MP and i did play it in the early beta days corvette spam. sinkllr the fact is when most ppl buy this game they dont go to MP , they first play allot of SP and when they can beat the ai they head to MP there are more ppl playing SP then MP so i dont see ur point at all the ration is probably 99% SP to 1 % MP so get serious
On the other hand, adding more ship types wouldn't really harm online multiplayer because people would refrain from using the less useful ship types anyway.
Precisely.
What I mean is, some units are meant for early game. They will be scuttled later on. Then later on you'd want late game units.
Each unit would have a use - at some point in the game. Early game units have a purpose - an inexpensive expendable early game unit, as do late game units.
Eh, I'd rather have the "each unit would have a use - at all points in the game".
Another option in games like Age of Empires would be an "upgrade tier". That is to say, for a price tag, you can "upgrade" your unit after researching an unlock to upgrade the early game units into something more powerful.
That is the real difficulty associated with adding more ships.
The fact that they all have to be balanced relative to each other and that they all need a useful niche.
They (kind of) did that with this game, too. Heavy Cruisers are, for all intents and purposes, a heavier version of Light Frigates. So there's a research unlock for each faction's LF that adds an ability to it that's unique from HCs.
They also did similar with SupCom2... though I feel as though that game as a whole flopped on its face in comparison to SC/SCFA.
That is the real difficulty associated with adding more ships. The fact that they all have to be balanced relative to each other and that they all need a useful niche.
I could care less about story or units. Here's what SoaSE 2 really needs:
Scalable multithreading
64bit support
Multi monitor support (ala Supreme Commander)
Doesn't Stardock publish the star swarm engine? Maybe Ironclad could work out a deal to use that as a basis for the engine. It scales all my threads and eats as much ram as I'd let it. And multi-monitor support like the first SupCom would be freaking amazing. Seriously, if they released rebellion in the exact same manner as it is today, with these engine overhauls I'd buy the game again. Not saying I would mind the Reapers (or whatever) making an appearance, but what this game needs is a new engine. However, I know that Ironclad is small and I think all steam ahead is on Sins of a Dark Age. It looks great but I have 0% interest in MOBAs so I just can't wait for them to finish with it already lol. I need more Sins - no other Strategy game will ever compare!
Edit: To a lot of you wanting more variety of units, hero units, more upgrade teirs, etc..try out E4X mod. It has all that and maintains balance. By far my favorite mod for Sins and I've been playing since like 2008ish? Distant Stars used to be the best mod but I don't think that was ever ported over to Rebellion, nor was it as fully realized. The work GaoFan is doing on Interregnum is fantastic as well.
[quote who="Wintercross" reply="106" id="348429]Oh wait...
They did. Obviously they were successful enough that each one got a sequel just like War Craft 3.... oh wait...[/quote]
I wonder what the best selling PC game of all time is? Just stop posting, you're embarrassing youself.
As much as I hate to have it be a necessity, I think that the existence of titans dictates either tiered units or at least late-game upgrades to units. As said before, when I experimented with doing that to capitals, it wasn't well-received, but perhaps doing so to frigates would be better. There simply comes a point where frigates are invalidated by titan AoE.
Perhaps the solution isn't to buff frigates but rather to nerf titans or at least their ability to hurt frigates. Capitals can't annihilate SC with impunity. Why should titans be able to outright destroy all frigates in front of them?
Bring down titans from titans to supercapitals and we'd be in a much better place.
Just get rid of titan AOE and make every titan like the Kultarask or Coronota. Boom, problem solved.
I've only skimmed the last page so i'm not sure if this has been suggested, but a cloaked ship class (i.e. submarine) would be cool. maybe even with anti-ship and anti-planet versions (or just different abilities, weapons, and/or upgrades).
Naturally, you'd need a destroyer class ship to detect them.
Kultorask? No. Coronata? Better, but not far enough IMHO. I just never wanted titans in the first place.
Also, it appears that you cannot revoke karma that was given accidentally by fat-fingering your screen. I liked it more when you had a confirm dialog...
There are many great features available to you once you register, including:
Sign in or Create Account
