I envision space combat like this:
1. 2D plane(3D plane like in Homeworld ads no value at all, it just makes you look at tiny dots all the time)
2. turn based combat because that's the best kind of combat in terms of tactical depth, emphasis on visuals and fits perfectly in a space game, X-com and many other games have proven time and time again the benefits of a turn based system.
3. just like in Might & Magic Heroes 6 your skills, researched technology and types of ships determines your battlefield setup when encountering enemy.
4. you don't give orders one unit at a time and then each unit performs an action, but you give sequence of orders, a plan of action which is then executed in a single turn for all the units, of course researched technology/tactics and types of ships determining which options are at your disposal
5. then, at the end of battle, you have an option to view the whole thing uninterrupted from start to finish and post such battles online. Also you would have an option of fixed camera vs free roaming.
6. but for all of this to work and feel great, animations, effects and graphics need to be top notch with dynamic lighting and shadows, sharp textures, particle effects, volumetric explosions, etc.etc.
Basically, you would feel like you are watching Battlestar Galactica
I really believe you would have a hit if combat would be like this instead of the underwhelming, tedious affair of Sins of a Solar Empire.
Great list, to all of that I would add different civilization combat perks, just like each faction in MMH6 and similar games has different perks. This would be a great starting point for making each civilization unique.
*ignore my reply to this*
This is a Strategy Game - not a tedious shoot-em-up.
Stardock have made improvements to the Combat Box, we await to see what - but this will never, not a zillion years, ever be some quasi shoot-em-up. Its a Strategy game, and will stay that way. Lots of shoot-em-ups out there if someone has withdrawal symptoms - but this isn't one of them.
This doesn't make any sense, are you saying that XCOM Enemy Unknown and MMH6 are "shoot-em-ups", whatever those are?
That's just ridiculous, it's like you haven't read the post of the topic at all.
So is the only acceptable form of combat for a strategy game to you 'unit A with strength X moving on to unit B with strength Y, roll the dice and do a little bit of maths to see who wins'?
Having more involved combat mechanics than what the Civ or Galciv games offer takes NOTHING away from the strategy part of the a 'strategy game'.
Ignore Zydor. He's spewed this BS multiple times on the forums now.
If he only knew as much as he thinks he does.
I, of course, know for a fact that combat will be real time and deep!
A XCOM or Elemental style tactical combat would be poor way to represent combat between starships. Personally I'd like to see positional tactical combat such as with Starfleet battles or Sid Meier's Ace Patrol. Other than that a RTS or order based system works better for space. Heck just put a simplified version of Sins for tactical battles. HOWEVER, we are talking about Stardock here and currently they some of the best game designers in the industry for strategy games. So we can expect that whatever they come up with it will be awesome.
I think anything that would take longer than 1 minute to complete, would be a huge time sink. In any thing over a med. map you will eventually have several fleet and planetary invasions going on in any given turn, would just add to much extra time. Having said that, someone mentioned that Star Dock got the rights to Star Control... So since I loved that game on my 3DO I'd be okay with that type of combat system, as long as the auto resolve wasn't too harsh.
You should probably go play X-Com again.
The action point system makes a huge difference. It is positional, facing is of great importance and having action points available for reacting to enemy movements is how you avoid getting slaughtered.
Individual unit control in a 4X TBS is just terrible though. It severely limits the scope of fleet sizes unless you end up in an absolute nightmare of a grind late game.
OP- Your other thread on this topic was locked. Why did you create another?
Because, obviously enough, He Is Right. Therefore, any efforts to suppress The Truth is a conspiracy by the Illuminati to keep the masses downtrodden.
Basically the same logic any zealot uses. Just applied to a game rather than religion.
Doesn't pretty much any turn based game have auto-battle option where you don't even enter combat screen.
I loathe people like you who use such option but still, you can escape from actually playing the game.
No, the most important thing is for the combat to have good animations....everyone knows good animations trumps gameplay every time.
Still, if a mod locks it, it's because they don't want the thread on their board. Re-posting it again is a no-no.
not sure if you're familiar with the franchise. Mid to late game in galciv2 each turn can take an hour or more depending on a variety of factors, from planetary management, star base construction, etc.etc.etc. That is the game, managing an empire and conquering the galaxy, I think any major focus on forcing the supreme leader of a species (the player) to give tactical advice to his ship captains would be tedious late game, early game it might be fun when each ship/fleet is important, but late game when your computer is at risk of crashing because you have a ridiculous number of ships and fleets moving about, fighting each of those battles would be impractical. If you really want a space ship fighting game there are lots of them out there I really enjoyed X3 maybe that one will be more your speed.
I can't imagine late game with dozens and dozens of fleets, managing each small ship on a tactical grid. That ain't Galciv.
So what does that have to do with anything if an option to do auto-battle exists?
People who want every battle(if the animations and graphics are good enough to be constantly enjoyable) can have them and people who don't want any battle can have them, problem solved.
Simply put, this does not solve the problem - and it's pretty damn obvious why.
There is only two real possibilities: that the AI can run the auto battle as well as the player, and not.
If the AI can play out the battle entirely without your input, the tactical battles are trivial fluff. Time filler - maybe shiny time filler, but filler. Why waste development resources on inconsequential fluff, when they could be spent on other things?
If the player can do significantly better at the tactical battles than the AI, they are no longer optional for games beyond the easiest levels. Ships are expensive, and if you can lose fewer of them by controlling the battle, you will. Even if it's painfully bad, you will have to do it to stay competitive.
That's a brief paraphrase of a Frogboy post from before GC2 was released, as to why it would not have tactical combat. I haven't heard anything indicating the logic has changed any.
I think GalCiv2 concept of being a passive observer instead of having tactical combat like in MMH6 is completely outdated and would hurt the game.
Hello Hortz. I see your obsession with animations hasn't abated at all.
The strategy layer is the core of GalCiv. Anyone expecting super duper tactical combat with movie quality CGIs as gameplay... yeah, suuuure.
Dreamland ------>
This^ As a fan of Gal Civ 1+2 all I would like is the combat box as is but with updated graphics better camera controls and angles and a option on the fleets so that they stay in a set formation during combat other than that dont mess with what made Gal Civ 2 a great game and genre leader.
if we want to make a more control-able combat without consume our time in a long tactical battle, there is an option to be consideration.
My idea is to make the tactical combat just like in Galciv 2, where it happen automatically. But we can prepare a lot thing before the engagement begin. Like prepare the formation, choose strategy, etc. Then after that we let the AI doing the job until the end of combat.
Yes, he is still the same.
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