Ironclad Games and Stardock Entertainment are very pleased to announce the release of version 1.5 BETA for Sins of a Solar Empire: Rebellion. This new update will be available as an opt-in Beta via the Steam client ahead of its final release so that we can get feedback from users on the changes.
NOTE: THE V1.50 UPDATE WILL BREAK SAVE GAMES!
[ Graphics ]
[ Gameplay ]
[ AI ]
[ Misc ]
For those playing in single-player, you can simply tweak the gameplay.constants file to turn off superweapons. Just look for this near the top of the file (use Notepad or Notepad++ NOT Word).
cannonsPerGravityWellRatio 1 cannonGravityWellRatioDenominator 4
We investigated an option to toggle Titans, but it was going to take a huge amount of work. If you don't want to play with Titans, your best bet is to use a mod.
That's cool, as long as the phase lanes issue is fixed as is the AI's inability to properly colonize vacant planets I'll be happy.
Phase lanes are fixed internally and we're testing some AI adjustments.
Then I am happy.
Turchany, you're giving a whole lot of situationnal pros and cons to make the Vorastra sound better than the Ragnarov.Sure, the Ragnarov can't fire backwards and the Vorastra has micro phase jumps, but unless you somehow manage to jump your fleet into the gravity well directly behind the Ragnarov, you can't avoid being hit. Its specialty is long-range bombardment and you will have to face it head-on and take the hits to the face until you close the distance and get behind it.
Knowing that, I'd much rather face the Maw than a 2400 damage Explosive Shot because at least I can try to limit the movement of the Vorastra with Iconus Guardians and have my ships fly away from it.
I am sorry, but it is clear to me that you never faced a human enemy using Maw not on autocast.
You cannot impede on the movement on the Vorastra in any meaningfull way. Micro Phase Jump makes about every Titan cornering strategy, Repulsion included, quite worthless.
You also most likely wont make it on time to save your fleet. A human enemy with some skill will simply:
Even if you pound the Vorastra with everything you have, you never will do enough damage to put it in danger.
And now... after most of your fleet fell victim to the Maw..... it is your puny Ragnarov + lone survivors against the entire Vasari fleet.
Have fun.... dying.
On a side note... it should be noted that the Vorastra actually has more Frontal Firepower than the Ragnarov. Only with abilitys, the Ragnarov can beat the Vorastra. Add 1 or 2 Kortuls who drain your AM and goodbye.
This is nice and all, but unfortunately only true, if the targets are standing still. Which i doubt they are against semi-competent human opponent.
Otherwise quite a different scenario is very likely>
....
Trigger Maw.....and....
...nothing happens. As the frigate you targeted moved to the side and is not anymore directly in front of the titan, Vorastra tries to realign its position to get the target back into its "sights", instead of sucking in all the other ships around. If the target keeps moving, the titan will continue to realign ad absurdum. Eventually enemy ships start jumping away one by one, their clumped formation breaks and the window opportunity to get them all is gone. Now the ability might finally activate at last and youll get some kills, but its definitely not the slaughter it could be, if it activated the exact moment you pressed the button.
Bottom line, its nowhere near as reliable as you make it sound it is, its not jump, activate and BURP 60 ships (pre 1.50 obviously) gone every single time. Not even against AI, so for sure not against humans.
A smart human execution takes arround 1.5 seconds. There is not remotly enough time to save anything, this is the reason it was nerfed.
Again.... the Titan first is brought into alignment and then it micro jumps and triggers Maw.
Because it is better.. Try it online in a skilled team match and you will see which titan kills you before you even have the time to realise what happens
QFT.
I always faced skilled players use this ship, only 2-3 times a medium or lame player.
@PAT_22_ I never said Vorastra is a 100% I win button, I saw many times maw fail to execute, against AI I experienced it myself, but it can be learnt how to use it well and boom, enemy fleet is gone before he even selects his ships to move them away from each other, and the Vorastra frontal damage thingy is another one that makes it better in that case, add in desperation and the low-antimatter need of it's abilities... if Ragnarov is low on antimatter (faces dunovs or kortuls) it is a giant fragile cannon that will be destroyed very fast by Vasari bombers. Try doing the same against a Vorastra and tell me if you succeed as a non-Vasari player.
I say again, try it against skilled players and you will understand, I would prefer to go against the Ragnarov as I have a SLIGHT CHANCE TO KILL IT. The same is not true for the Vorastra, it is almost invincible, you will never catch it and destroy it due to it's unmatched mobility (even bombers are too slow for catching it) and the overall Vasari fleet superiority without risking to lose all your fleet for this titan only, not a good exchange.
Smart human execution is to move your ships the moment Vorastra enters the gravity well. There is enough time to do that, while the titan does its realignment.
And OFC you do the alignment before using MPJ, however you cant do it 100 percent perfect if the targets are in motion. The frigates can move so fast across the front of the titan that it will lose that alignment that half second you move the cursor to click the target...
Finally, the reason it was nerfed was clearly the whining of the MP community. If the devs felt it was OP themselves, they would have nerfed it long time ago, perhaps even before the release last year.
I don't even know why we are arguing about maw when the real problem ability is desperation...
just one thing, who said he can only select 1 frigate to use maw on? I'm sure a good player will find a ship that will cross maw alignment line after a second and targets that ship and starts the rampage.. it needs big bad luck if you can't find a ship to start maw on...
You said it yourself Turchany in your previous post, that you saw many times "Maw fail to execute". And that is really my point and all that matters - compared to likes of Dissever, Chastic Burst and other titan AoE abilities this one is nowhere near as reliable, thus its high lethality made sense.
@Seleuicea> Maw was nerfed, so its Desperation problematic now what is next?
I told you before you lot wont be happy until Vasari are nerfed to hell. And here we are, despite changes to Desperation, Maw, jumping Orkies and buffs to TEC Loyals you still complained about no change to phase missiles and bombers - even before the patch was actually out, so you could at least try those new changes out and see, whether they are enough or not.
Real time strategy games should be balanced to PvP play and modded to your personal preference.
lol my full fleet wasn't annihilated at first try maybe next time. No, I was referring to MY GAMES against AI, and I am a poor Vasari player so I guess it was my fault my Vorastra wasn't aligned well before the jump and I was just messing around, I am sure skilled Vasari players are not such idiots like me when using maw and almost never fail. Well it won't be much of a problem with this extreme nerf.. 15 ships are not that much of a loss. And God save us from a level2 Maw...... Who the hell will kill that high level Vorastra, seriously?
This topic is a bit outdated with the 1.5 patch so maybe we can continue to write our thought about the beta Or complain about Desperation now
Noone asks Vasari to be nerfed ridiculously but it is not a question VASARI SHOULD BE AS GOOD AS OTHER RACES. Who thinks otherwise fails to understand the main goal of this game, 3 races with (almost) equal chances of winning. It was never true (Advent lol), Vasari was always inherently the best, now it is starting to get close to being balanced but still (very?) far from it.. Maybe the nerf of phase missiles would put them in a reasonable power position, but as Yarlen said there are no plans to change those ridiculous bombers.. I don't know, have they ever played against a human using vasari bombers? Maybe as Advent? And could they keep their capital ships or titan alive for more than some rounds of bomber phase missiles? I will never understand.. These changes are good (though Maw is ruined with this hard nerf..) but still I don't feel both Vasari factions to be as strong as the other 4, and it isn't an unimaginable thing to ask at least not the two strongest should be the Vasari.. Why not giving another race a chance to be almost the strongest faction? Sometimes I feel Vasari is a favourite of this game and they don't want it to be changed....
Oh and btw the hard nerf of wail is another exaggeration, made that useless too like the maw, so now AR may be even weaker than AL, have anyone tested it? what are your thought on this comparison of the Advent factions in this beta?
i will bring up the rock paper scissors argument for this (TEC>VASARI>ADVENT>TEC) . most people that cry about vasari are hardcore advent players. advent being overly reliant on shields get their ass handed to them by phase missiles so its no surprise they cry VAS OP every chance they get. TEC are resistant to vasari technology and weapons. evident in there higher hull hitpoints than shield hitpoints making them more resistant to phase missisles. and advent absolutely POUND the TEC with their beam damage and plasma. same way with phase missles. they just dont ignore shield liek phase missisles do.
another thing is that vasari there ships are QUALITY OVER QUANTITY. when you make a ship with vasari its meant to last. On average vas ships cost more. more money (crystal and metal as well) and more fleet supply. easiest example. scouts. TEC and advent scouts cost 2 fleet supply 200 creds and no crystal or metal. VAS scouts cost 225 creds AND 20 metal. Advent and TEC both have some way the lay drones on an enemy planet. (lingering presence for advent.). vas scouts DO NOT have an ability to lay drones. it can sit in phase space in a grav well at the cost anti matter cost per second. but it is useless as hell. it DOES have the ability to take neutrals though.now lets talk about the points NOONE talks about. where the vasari face-plant hardcore. (no ability to watch what is happening in a specific gravity without being there like TEC and advent scouts.) inability to effectively kill enemy structures namely starbases.. im mostly referring to fighting TEC loyalist. i still remember playing an FFA game. i was VL one of the other humans was TL. it was endgame only the two of us left. he was completely dug in on ALL planets. dual SBs mine field fighters heal platforms EVERYTHING.id go in with a maxed fleet. mainly bombers and oversears plus lvl 10 titan. and i had no way to kill his SBs. i could crank out enforces. but he had his titan there with maxed group shield and red buttons. so those would be toast and highly ineffective. Id bring titan in to shot at themtitan would run into enough mines micro jumping or not that i couldn't stay on his Sbs long enough to cuase any dmg plus he had hisfleet in a way i could maw it effectively ( hint hint for those that cry about maw). basically no ships i had ,or could make, would kill his star bases without obtaining unacceptable losses. the point being vasari have nothing like ogrovs or adjucators to deal with this exact situation. they do have assault nanites on the rankulas. but these are cumbersome to use. die alot and regqurie a cool down before making more. nothing in the VAS arsenal can effectively deal with this. the kostura cannon didnt disable his healign long enought for me to kill anything either. (proving my point that TEC are resistant to vasari.
another place they are lacking is how quickly there repair stations repair. a pathetic 15 per seconds without an ability to upgrade. TEC start at 20 per seconds and can be upgraded to a whooping 40. advent start at 30 and have no upgrades to them. (i think synergy gives them shield cant remember been to logn since ive used advent) meaning the vasari have the worst repair station in the game which at first glance doesnt really matter until you need to repair a ship quickly and dont have oversears yet.
another thing is you should expect the vasari to be better in the military department like they are. the other 2 races are specialized in different ways. the ADVENT are evil with culture and there abilities are the best in the game (repulsion being the easiest example) and TEC are economy and brute force. like i said. VAS are the supreme military but are lacking in these other departments.
also. ill be making a post on how to fight maw sometime. (its not that hard) il also go over how well the races REALLY are.
Turchany, Turchany... your reasoning here is mind-boggling.
So you failed using Maw properly - so OFC it had to be your fault and you´re being idiot - not a chance it was actually Maw being unreliable and not completely easy to use....not just to you but in general, as i am trying to allude here
And then i guess you watched your fleet being killed by Maw, or saw someone else´s fleet going down to succesful Maw attack - and now OFC your logic is, it has to be down to Maw being OP, not a chance of you being idiot this time by failing to scatter your forces and put them in motion to minimize your losses...
You know how it looks like? That you decided that Maw is/was OP and you will use every excuse to support that claim as its convenient to you.
I know you dont like Vas Loyalists, as its sooo easy to play them, but pretty please. Overcome your distaste for them and try play for just for them following month or 2. Use Maw as much as possible (its unreliability is the same as pre 1.50) against skilled players and then report back and we can have conversation again on this topic.
No, you just got some of the nerfs you asked for and before even trying the game out to see how they pan out, you already complained they are not enough. Do you even wonder Yarlen refused to nerf phase missiles/bombers so far? Why should he? You did not even bother to play the game before doing judgments, thats hardly makes you trustworthy, when it comes to game balance. It only confirms your bias against Vasari.
@Urfullofshit> finally someone seeing it from my side as well...
I think Unity Mass should do chaining damage...
I think Maw should strip planets...
I think the Novalith should crack a planets core destabilizing the orbit causing 50% of it's resource asteroids to fall out of orbit and be lost and for mass depopulation and culture loss....
Seems more logical that novaliths would just vaporize the planet into plasma.....how convenient that we have plasma storms in Sins....
What have I done?
As a competitive multiplayer, I realize that the Coronata NEEDS to be buffed. I'd suggest giving it larger increases in health and weapon damage per level, or reducing its cooldowns and antimatter costs.
The Coronata already got buffed, and it technically got a little buff to its ultimate in this one. I think we need to judge the impacts of a weaker Eradica and Vorastra before deciding any other titan adjustments.
Awesome idea man, but when they add those now planets in the DLC, the ferrus planet needs to turn into a magnetic cloud, not a plasma storm.
In my opinion Goa, its a great titan, but just can't kill much without dying. The antimatter/cooldown should be implemented with the HP so as to not make it an Eradica mkII, but be able to utilize its powerful abilities more often.
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