There's one thing that I've always found awkward in Fallen Enchantress: the way the "city defenders" system worked. It could use a lot of improvment.
Basically, naked peasants with lightning hammers feels weird, doesn't give any choice for the player to make, and in general isn't very interesting. The point of having city defenders is to make every city invasion difficult and epic, a certain resource commitment. But giving basic peasants the best 1-handed blunt weapon and no armor frankly doesn't seem a very interesting way to implement city defenders. They feel out-of-place as a militia.
Also, I don't see why a level 3-4 city (or even level 2, why not?) couldn't have dedicated, decently-equipped professional defenders - Town Guards, or whatever name you want to call it. In other words, it could make sense that with the right buildings, leather-clad spearmen, swordmen or archers could be spawned to defend the city instead of those weird peasant militiamen.
In general, though, automatic weapon upgrade just doesn't cut it. Lightning hammers and such magical, costly artifacts doesn't seem like the sort of thing town defenders should have. They should wield spears, bows, halberds, maybe broadswords. Lightning hammers are especially bad because they're so level dependent, it doesn't make sense to give them to units that will never go beyond level 1.
I don't have a clear solution; maybe it's just a matter of making all city-defender units pre-designed (without haviing their gear upgrade with technology, only with city level : for instance, city level 2 defenders would have leather and spear, level 3 defenders would have leather and boar spear, level 4 chain and pike, etc.). Maybe a better solution would be to tie all city defenders to (tech-dependent) buildings that can be built in the town, so that a well defended city requires the sacrifice of a few turns.
All in all, though, a redesign of the city defender system would be beneficial to the game. And since I've done it myself partially when I tried modding FE, I know that some of the solutions aren't too costly to implement.
True. I always wondered why their armour did not upgrade to the best available and researched? That would give them a real kick along.
As it is, their power ratio to field troops changes a lot as the game progresses, which is not what is desired I think.
I don't like the "best available" concept either, though. Plate is an elite troop thing, not a town guard standard issue uniform. Especially since the best plate is a magical artifact (champion's plate) and I think groups of champion-plated city guards would be worse than peasants with lightning hammers.
But having access to leather and chain in some circumstances, and spears/boarspears/mundane pikes depending on city size and maybe technology would be a good idea. I'm not asking for 100% realistic, but something a bit more credible.
I would like to see cities/conclaves get wall improvements.
I could see conclaves having magical troops, and forts having higher trained troops.
A Summoner sov should get a special free city summons.
A Beastmaster could get a trained, armored war bear. and add a prowler per city level.
A wealthy sov gets + 2 stacks of mercs every battle.
Only Ironeers or races with the Master Smith trait should get metal armor for their militia.
Tarth gets extra archers.
A General's militia could be + init.
To be honest, i don't necessarily want something super complex or time-costly. I would be satisfied with a system where the automatic city defenders are replaced with a few chains of buildings+upgrades, which is quite simple to implement in a few hours with the current mechanics. That would allow greater control over the type of defender that shows up, both for the devs (no more lightning hammer peasants) and the players (*I* choose to invest in heavy town guards or not, or cities archers, etc.)
Well at the very least it would help reduce the steam roller effect in the game. I agree city defenders certainly need to be overhauled.
Not for LH yet obviously but just in case you're not aware there is a mod for FE that adds some armor to militia:
https://forums.elementalgame.com/437988
Probably not quite what you're after but in the ballpark.
Unrest should also impact city defenders- more unrest, the fewer you get, or the less HP they start with.
Mercenary defenders would not be impacted (if you created such a thing)
One of the Fortress level-up choice lines should be a city defender gear and ability upgrade.
That's a pretty good idea.
Like the OP says - why not tie stats / equipment of militia to city type and buildings in the city?
With a war college, smithy, and adamantium mine, those might be some pretty hardcore defenders.
A mercantile city with markets and banks would have mercenaries. A conclave magically skilled / buffed or additional summoned troops.
-> The more advanced the city, the more badass the defenders... but in a way that makes sense.
That's an amazing hack. It should be integrated into the base game. And adapted a bit it's totally what I'm after.
That's an amazing hack
Heh, it is isn't it
Clever "solution" from parrotm there.
And yeah agree, it's a good minor boost to milita that works well. Brad take note just steal this mate.
I would like to see more city buildings producing defenders. A smith might appear with a big hammer. The cleric might turn up from the shrine. The alchemists guild should send some alchemists with some scary exploding things. Some lumberjacks with their axes, etc...
This sounds pretty fun.
More than that, it replaces that silly and horrible "best 1H-blunt weapon" system, and instead gives more believable town defenders that don't end up geared with ultra-rare artifact armor and weapons.
Very clever and fun idea!
I have an idea for City Defence and I've been stewing where to put it for a little bit now. It all started with the problem where the AI would continually get full health units EACH time the city were attacked, EVEN in the same round!, whereas the player would LOSE his city defense altogether in the event of two sequencial attacks.
Here is the system I have thought up:
I would like to see a two columned UI page before every combat where you are defending a city from assault. The system would grant you X number of points to put towards city defenders at the start of a battle, the first column showing who you've selected. In the second column, a list of currently available units (perhaps non-available ones greyed out so you have something to look forward to), and some info on each as to how many of the type of unit you can field. (example: 3/3 militia and 2/2 archers). Also including of course more detailed information when hovering or clicking the unit. I think it's VERY important to give the player the ability to CHOOSE how you want your city to defend itself.
As to the number of points, I would think that each time a city were attacked, it would be guarenteed a BASE number of points, but that base could be increased by obtaining techs/buildings/spells/etc and have an additional increase/turn up to a CEILING. This would reflect sequencial attacks versus prepared defenses. Naturally, the points must be LOST in the killing of the defending units for those points NOT to transfer over to the next sequential attack in the turn.
example: If I've got 3 archers in a city, I DON"T want 2 more as city defenders. I'm going to want to select some militia (say 3/3) to back up those archers instead. I should have that option. During course of the battle 2 of my militia die, but I am victorious in fending off the enemy. However, they attack again with another force the very same turn. Now I would only be allowed to select 1/3 because the other two have died and have to be replaced over time. I am forced to change my strategy of defense. Also, since I have lost defense points, I have fewer points in which to select defenders.
In this way, city defenders can become unique aswell. The town guardian, for example, can be added to this list of available units. Completing the cooresponding building grants you X additional points (enough for a guardian (1/1 selectable...and maybe there is another building or tech that allows yout to increase that to 2/2) and unlocks the guadian unit. If you want to spend those points on fielding him, than it's your choice, however you can use those points in other ways too.
Maybe even the Govenor Hero could give bonus points to global city defense.Maybe the Defender Hero could give bonus point to the city that he's helping defend.
We could even take this farther. Say you REALLY want to keep a city and you're just not in a tactical position to defend it. (Especially now with razing being INSTANT again). There could be an option to hire mercenaries to your cause before a battle (perhaps up to 2 can be hired so the info would display 2/2). Attach the unlock to a tech or building or something so that it's limited in early game and has to be worked towards if you want to exploit that aspect of city defence.
Stuff like that. Stuff that puts the CONTROL of the game into the players hands. I know that this would be a HUGE change to a game where defending units are meant to be a SMALL part. Problem is that defending units are becoming a HUGE part of the game. Often times my milita alone is enough to slug off other factions units. Granted, they can still have trouble with champions but my point is that if defending units have HUGE impact on the game, than they should also become a HUGE aspect of the game.
Kinda hope SD reads this one and is willing to comment how LH has changed in this regard and whether or not an idea such as this would have any merit.
I don't want to see city defenders with top gear. Militia with Boreal blades doesn't do it for me.
They should upgrade, but be limited. I think that a good place would be one tier below current tech, and limited to non-magical equipment. So if you have plate and Yew longbows the Militia Archers would get chain and regular longbows. I would also like to see more variety; militia might not all use the same weapon; maybe even in the same city some have spears, some swords, and others have axes.
If any of you played the Master's Affliction mod for FE, that's what I want. Simple improvements you can build that add specific defenders to your cities. Research unlocks improvement upgrades, e.g. Town Guard > City Guard, which upgrades their equipment and adds to their numbers.
Conclaves had access to mage towers which gave mage defenders, and fortresses had some higher tier mounted defenders.
It doesn't quite add defender customizability, but it does allow the player to choose how much defense they need, and adds some differences between defenders for the different city types.
I agree with the OP in general and Ashnal in particular. There needs to be changes made to city militia and city defense. I've also played the MA mod and agree that the solution there works well. However I would only add one more point. Make militia start tactical combat in defense/fortify mode. This will give low initiative defenders a higher defense for the first turn of combat.
I totally agree with this idea.
It's so annoying to see glass cannon militia floating about. At least let them have some leather armour after level 3 (city). I do agree with others though that the furthest they should get is chain/light plate, but that should also be with some restrictions.
It would be nice if conclaves get mages instead of archers and magic weapons instead of normal ones. Towns should get the standard weapons, without the magic ones getting in the way.
Fortresses already have a number of defensive boosts (walls/castles/siege units/etc) so won't need special changes, aside from the armour bit.
The point of the innate city defense, in lieu of any more substantial evidence, is to have random citizens grabbing whatever weapons they can scavenge up for a last minute defense. Which basically means make-shift weapons from items not made for purpose or hunting equipment (knives, bows, etc...). There is no reason or expectation that random citizenry should be experience in fighting, have any sort of armor available, have a random selection of weapon types available for you to choose what they use, or a decent weapon for fighting another human.
At best you could make the case that a Conclave should get staff users instead of Archers, and Fortresses might be expected to stock enough low-tier armor/weapons to outfit a militia slightly better. Beyond that there isn't much of a case for improving the system beyond wanting hardier AI cities when you assault them over or a way to cheese out having to build and pay for stronger garrison troops.
I'm not against the idea of stronger AI cities, but if you're going to make a reasonable argument then you've got be realistic about your goals and expectations.
One might also consider picking a city defense upgrade each time a city levels. The choices could be meaningful if they fit with research posture, for example.
I also wish all cities could build walls.
I think each city structure contributing something to city defenses is an elegant suggestion.
I'm very pleased with the continuing evolution of this game.
I agree that city militia should be stronger, but IMO, there should be limits.
After all, they are supposed to be the defense of last resort, "citizen" militias taking up arms because the professional soldiers are out of town.
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