Therefore I'm out of this forum. There are maybe 4-5 active posters on this forum who know anything about balance. Now minus 1. You clearly don't want any advice or discussion on balancing, because you are doing great job yourselves. Keep it up!
Bye Bye
Good luck and may your experience be better than mine was, when I go online now I just play witha few people who take things easy and enjoy the game.
This was true for diplomacy, but it is not true anymore...
I more than most advocated for LAN over ICO, but times have changed and so has the community...for at least a few weeks there will be a massive influx of players on ICO and many of them will not be even remotely close to the pro level...
Go online...take a chance...have fun...bring your friends...and don't let asshats or naysayers dissuade you...
After a month, the situation may revert back to the way it was and you will have missed your opportunity...
Now if more people had that attitude I am sure I would enjoy being online, I hate hyper competitive people that need to win at all costs...
Micropenis alert.
Since when have I let anyone see my penis? I had better make sure all the window blinds are closed and to check for hidden cameras.....
And I thought you were leaving, just seeking attention are we?
situation: mecha-lenin right, SP dudes and developers wrong.
proposed solution: SP people stop posting, developers start balancing.
acceptable outcome: happiness.
I'm not posting outside of this thread. When it dies, I die with it.
Unless I get bored. Then I will come back to life and haunt you mortals.
MECHA HAS DISCOVERED THAT THE UNDERLYING SECRET BEHIND TROLLING IS IT GETS YOU KARMA FAST AND HE SHOT UP FROM 4 to 24 KARMA POINTS WITHIN WEEKS. ITS THEREFOR NO SURPRISE THE RUSH AND HIGH FROM THE OVERDOSE HAS HIM ADDICTED TO TROLLING. THIS HAS MADE HIM MORE PRON TO TROLL IN SEARCH FOR FAST EXPERIENCE POINTS (KARMA).
Good post. No RTS has ever been perfectly balanced. Ever Warcraft 2 with two nearly identical races was not balanced. Devs can only do so much. Tweak this, buff that; it doesn't matter in the end, competitive players will find something else to break the game. Modders have a pair of aces in the hole the devs don't; they can add new units and structures to the game for free if they are needed to balance, and can make drastic role changes to existing units without worrying about breaking things. Modders can also 'afford' to release updates weekly or even daily if need be. Devs can only continue support as long as funding holds.
I have never seen a RTS survive post-developer support for long without a strong modding community. Community balance patches and mods are always at the heart of any older RTS' that still has a community. Even Blizzard's games, which weren't all that directely moddable, had amazing map editor support. DOTA, a custom map someone made, was so successful it created a new genre of stand-alone games.
Ironclad will release more patches, don't worry. But mods will always be the lifeblood of any game in the end. Just look at Vampire: the Masquerade; the game was basically released broken with no support, yet modders turned it into a cult classic RPG.
The developers (Ironclad) were going to say "Were done with Sins" after Diplomacy was released. Unless you all forgot about the damn near year long span that we haven't heard BOO from IC since Diplomacy was released. We had the 2 gig mini dumps that plagued Entrenchment, and Diplomacy both... Then something happened.
I would like to believe that it was a "Mod" that renewed interest in Sins, and enabled Stardock (With support, and advise from Ironclad) to create Rebellion. That "Mod" was The Sins Optimization Project. A Mod I personally Founded specifically to deal with the issues that were destroying Entrenchment, and Rebellion. Along the way in developing that Mod we found a lot of things the Dev's missed. Which is no disrespect of Ironclad. I can see how these things can happen considering the small size of the company. We also found a way to make more room in the games assets without destroying the quality of the game itself.
With that came the Diplomacy 1.32-1.34 patches that incorporated TSOP's fix's, and optimizations. Interest in Sins returned. Now we got Rebellion. That has all of the lessons learned from TSOP incorporated into it. More factions, AND better graphics, because WE made room for it with TSOP, and the extra optimizations that Stardock incorporated.
The point being is that Rebellion wouldn't even exist right now if it wasn't for a Mod.
Major Stress just took All of the credit.
ALLLLLLLL OF IT!!!!!!!!
Pbhead shrugs
LOL!!! No. I am not taking "all" of the credit ( Just a sizable chunk ). Seriously there are many who can take credit for Rebellion. I only played a very small part. I was just making a point about mods
Well it seems we cross a line....
Time for appropriate music:
The whole point in this discussion, ranting, flaming, or whatever you call it is that we need to treat each other with respect. All of us. It doesn't matter if you play SP, or MP. MP people respect the SP people. They are playing the game the way they want to play it. Same with the SP people. Respect the MP people, because they too are playing the game the way they want to play it. BOTH sides opinions have equal merit, and value. IF the opinions are expressed in a civilized, and constructive manor.
I'll admit some of the trollololol's were funny. There is nothing wrong with a little bit of sarcastic humor, but somewhere along the line it got way out of control. To the point of outright HATE all over the boards. Any potential new players would have said "Screw this nonsense! I ain't joining a community like this! These guys are total ass's!"
Think about it. If Sins truly sucked so bad. Would there be 3 expansions, and an active community that loves to get into heated debates over the game? Sure there are problems, but what game doesn't have problems now? I can list quite a few games that are in far worse condition than Sins. Plus those games game play just plain sucks.
C-Mon people Sins is not a bad game. Crack open a cold one, and chill out
If some day I decide to bring back "Guide to trolls", you're going to tier 1.
Guys instead of saying about trolling and other stuff we must write new posts about strategies and openigns for new people who bougth sins rebellion and dont know the basic?As i write in my post i got learn all about starcraft just reading the forums and made to diamond league easy.I think we must focus on that as soon as possiple.Thanks
Why are you censoring yourself?
He just doesn't want to offend us "degenerate imbecils"
Well, there is something to be learned from this.
What was happening on the forums then was a lot of MP "pro-players" saying how they had waited forever for balance fixes and resolving desyncs and they were "giving up on it". A lot of angry postings and pretty much just like we've been hearing from the 1-1.5% player base who feel they are the ones to proclaim whether Sins is dead or fixed or screwed or whatever.
Sounded just like what's going on now.
One person at the start decided to do something about it--Major Stress took a ton of time and effort to see how he could tweak the game with a mod to improve performance. Around the sdame time, Stardock started getting rid of some of the really bad desyncs--all while the "you guys suck" posts were spammed daily by the pros.
What Major Stress did beyond the mod though is he said, "I love this game, it's worth working on and being patient for" and he kept a POSITIVE beat talking about how to improve rather than griping and tearing it down. He didn't ignore issues or whitewash them he just decided to see if he could make it better.
Never swore, never called anyone on teh dev team an idiot or moron or worse and never wasted posts whining, venting or ranting.
Because of that attitude--not just the work, things changed.
If I owned Ironclad and had to read the dren that's posted up here daily, I'd put out a "My Little Pony" RP game just to piss off people for the crap they gave.
The fact that they haven't tells me that they probably value the players who really love the game enough to keep working on it. I sure as heck know they aren't doing it for the pissed off people.
You can actually point to things that need change constructively and get a lot better response. How long would you put up with your attitude if it was directed at you and your work?
Stick around, one way or the other the fixes will get in. In fact, if you get hold of modders and tell them what you'd like I bet someone will put it together for you even if Stardock can't get around to it as fast as you want.
Not to mention names, but the issue isn't Ironclad...
Also, Major Stress worked with optimization for performance, something the devs highly value...
The Pro players focus on balance, something the devs do not value as highly...
I'm not trying to discredit what you're saying, it's a good post, but you are kidding yourself if you think the situations are the same....I won't defend the behavior of 3 or 4 pro players, but they are not in the same spot as Major Stress was...the Major was focusing on an issue that mattered to the devs, the pros aren't...
Too much testosterone....
EVERY Sins player has the right to post if they find something wrong. If the MP balance is indeed broken. Then by all means Say Something! If the AI is being retarded. Say something! Something don't look right? Say Something! As people have been saying something for the past four years. Just be cool about it when you do say something.
During the time of TSOP it was the 2 gig dumps that had everyone in an uproar. No one Single, or Multiplayer could finish a game of Entrenchment, or Diplomacy without hitting the 2 gig brick wall. That problem is fixed.
Now we got a litany of new problems. Just let the dev's do their thing. I am sure by now they are well aware of the biggest issues.
And he gets some karma.
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