Unbelievable.
Talk about shooting one’s self in the foot. For me, Windows 8 has gone from bad to worse.
So now, in the ARM version of W8, there will be no possibility of installing a third party browser, per the MS blog (1). So, for x86 systems, free access to all browsers. For tablets with ARM, “No soup for you!” and no “Come back one year.”
MS forgot it said quite the opposite in the past (2). Asa Dotzler won’t let MS forget the page they disappeared either (in the pdf below). Bless you, Mr. Dotzler!
So, third party devs who want to make software for Windows RT, and only create Metro apps for that and thus MS shoots itself in the foot which seems to be in its mouth. So Mozilla and Google climbed on board in expressing their concerns regarding the limitation of user choice and limiting innovation (no surprise there)… and this kind of limitation will prevent MS from the European market, and will probably cause even more litigation. So much for the “ethical company award” it always touts.
MS claims the reason for doing this is that those apps cannot be ported as is because of:
“commitment to longer battery life, predictable performance, and especially a reliable experience over time. The conventions used by today’s Windows apps do not necessarily provide this, whether it is background processes, polling loops, timers, system hooks, startup programs, registry changes, kernel mode code, admin rights, unsigned drivers, add-ins, or a host of other common techniques. By avoiding these constructs, WOA can deliver on a new level of customer satisfaction: your WOA PC will continue to perform well over time as apps are isolated from the system and each other, and you will remain in control of what additional software is running on your behalf, all while letting the capabilities of diverse hardware shine through.” (4)
“commitment to longer battery life, predictable performance, and especially a reliable experience over time.
The conventions used by today’s Windows apps do not necessarily provide this, whether it is background processes, polling loops, timers, system hooks, startup programs, registry changes, kernel mode code, admin rights, unsigned drivers, add-ins, or a host of other common techniques. By avoiding these constructs, WOA can deliver on a new level of customer satisfaction: your WOA PC will continue to perform well over time as apps are isolated from the system and each other, and you will remain in control of what additional software is running on your behalf, all while letting the capabilities of diverse hardware shine through.” (4)
Thus, as M. Bormann points out at gHacks:
“This highlights that it is not only about blocking web browsers, but all classic software from running on ARM. What Mozilla and Google criticize is that these restrictions do not apply to Internet Explorer. Other software companies might criticize that it is also not applying to Office, or other first party software that Microsoft integrates into Windows RT. The question here is if the new APIs are as restrictive as Mozilla and Google make them sound to be like.” (5)
You know what? I’ve stopped caring about Windows 8. It’s a lost cause, and just getting worse.
If anyone could have killed the idea of the Windows Tablet, it was only MS.
Sources:
1. http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/asa/archives/2012/05/firefox-on-windows-o.html
2. http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/press/2006/jul06/07-19PrinciplesPR.aspx
3. http://lockshot.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/windows-principles-document.pdf
4. http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2012/02/09/building-windows-for-the-arm-processor-architecture.aspx
5. http://www.ghacks.net/2012/05/11/no-third-party-browsers-on-windows-rt/?_m=3n%2e0038%2e516%2ehj0ao01hy5%2eiyk
If I read this correctly....
Aren´t you gonna be able to use, say Palemoon, Chrome or Maxthon as your webbrowser if you "Upgrade" to 8 ??
Edit: Feeling bit stupid...this is all about tablets isn´t it
You'll be able to run 3rd party browsers if the software devs build it for that version of windows 8.
This is about Windows 8 RT, and tablets. In the larger sense though, it's about an "Epic Fail" in the making. MS is definitely at war with Google's Chrome and Mozilla, but excluding them from the OS is like banning steak for everyone because babies can't chew it... not an exact metaphor, but you get the idea.
[quote who="Heavenfall" reply="2" id="3151555"]You'll be able to run 3rd party browsers if the software devs build it for that version of windows 8.
I'm afraid not... because -
If you take a look at the Source articles, I think you'll come to another conclusion.
Yes, all classic applications cannot be run on windows on ARM (now windows RT = WinRT), they must be modern - new api. Firefox can develop new version for this windows version. The IE you will find on it is specially developed "modern" using new API. No developer is banned, no software is banned. The problem is that MS software appears to use special API, which they have said they would not do. Mozilla then said they can't compete with that so they won't develop one.
edit:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1001_3-57431236-92/microsoft-bans-firefox-on-arm-based-windows-mozilla-says/
This is unacceptable behavior... and will cause MS to lose market share where they need it most: The tablet market.
Why make it hard on devs? This is absolutely counterproductive behavior, and incomprehensible... and the anti-competitive approach will cost them in Europe as well.
Ubuntu is beginning to look better and better every day. I'll keep 7 just the way some are keeping XP and no damn upgrade for this person. Makes you wonder what 9 will be like or....if Microatuff is still around by then.
To put it in away that even Doc would understand, Microsoft is playing the part of our Doctor and giving us pills to take to cure our ills, if they don't work the only other course of action is to switch to Apple.
I guess this is their way of boosting sales of Win7.
It's also MS's klutzy way of moving to (copying) Apple's closed ecosystem - they're salivating over the prospect of taking a cut of everything that runs on WOM once it's all funneled through the Windows Store.
I'll be sure to let the birthday boy know... so, like what runs on WOM besides the Skins Galleries?
Hasn't Apple been doing this for years?. Closed systems. Why when MS do it they get vilified but when Apple do it they get called forward thinking. I mean who cares?. People will still buy it because that's what people do. Instead of whining and bitching complain with your wallet. MS is allowed to do anything they want with the software *gasp* they develop. If you don't like it, then by hell don't bloody buy it, That's how you express your dislike, Not fill the net with outraged blogs and forums. Sheesh
to find again
I'll take a wild stab at this: because Microsoft has always been an open system that allowed many freedoms when developing stuff for it. Apple has been a closed system forever and everyone is used to it... and I'm sure most of the people in these forums like being able to customize and develop things in an open system (this is in a "WinCustomize" forum, right?). All of a sudden if MS decides to follow in Apple's footsteps, it will alienate a lot of their users. Those users who enjoyed the open system will either 1) be pushed to Linux if they haven't already 2) Just go convert to Mac anyways 3) Stick with MS and jump through all these new hoops out of brand loyalty...?
Yes, Microsoft can do whatever they want in regard to their software, but the current direction they are taking will alienate many of their users AND developers. Time will tell if they will gain enough to make up for it, but it certainly doesn't look promising. In the meantime, said going-to-be-alienated users have a right to complain... and will surely "vote with their wallets" when the time comes.
I uninstalled the Customer Preview.... that's the end of Win 8 for me.
Too many Windows features were stripped out for my liking, but the worst thing?
That Metro UI by default, that's what convinced me to never buy Win 8.
Sure I could use Winstep Xtreme and/or Stardock apps to make it usable, but why bother?
I can do all of that on a perfectly usable OS that I've already paid for, Win 7, so the expense becomes unnecessary.
We at WC are not the only ones who feel this way. The mood over at Majorgeeks mirrors ours... Win 8 is an abomination.
And I can bet that this is a mood that is mirrored worldwide across many walks of life.
You hit the the nail right on the head, Cap'n.
Bloody waste of time and effort W8 is... and an ugly one as well.
I have no problem with using 7 as long as it lasts... and when it ends, fine. There's always something else.
I remember saying similar things about XP when Vista was about to be released. XP is still a perfectly useful OS and should remain so for quite awhile. Even without SD developing for it.
Survival of the fittest. What works you keep (XP and 7) what doesn't work you throw away (Vista and 8).
I begrudge MS nothing. They're welcome to do whatever they wish. Customers will vote with their feet, one way or the other.
Yeah, I'll stick with Win 7 for as long as it's operable/supported, but I'm also looking into Ubuntu for the future as well.
I recently downloaded Ubuntu 12.04 to play with. I figured it'd make sense to become familiar with it well before Win 7 becomes obsolete.
The other idea I've had is to get a Mac Mini to use with my pre-existing hardware and run OS-X. That seems to be the best, most cost effective way to enter the world of mac and learn it.
Hopefully MS will learn its lesson from Win 8 and return to a more traditional OS for desktop PC's in time for Win 9.
Did you do a dual boot or have you got Ubuntu on a separate HDD?
Best to do Ubuntu as a dual boot (you can, if you want to try it first, run it from a zip drive)... because then you can install Wine and run Windows apps through it. Problem is, not all apps are 100% compatible.
At present I have it on a zip drive and run it from there. However, I have to make some hardware changes later today and I'll then run it from a partition of its own on an internal HDD I plan to put in.
Yep, that's the plan, to dual boot it and install Wine to take advantage of some of my Windows apps. I have played with Ubuntu in the past, but it has been a while and I'm not overly familiar with it as yet so will need to acclimatise myself to its use all over again, but then that was the idea... become proficient with Ubuntu long before Win 7 becomes totally obsolete.
I tried to install it on a flash drive but it didn't take. Still have the downloader though. BTW - excuse my ignorance but what is Wine? An Ubuntu flavor?
I'm not sure why that would be.... possibly a space thing [not enough room]? Thing is, if you still have the dowload you can install it on an internal partition on your PC, which would give you more options for use, etc.
Wine is a software interface that allows you to run Windows apps on Ubuntu and other Linux Distros. It is usually available on the Ubuntu site and other Linux home pages. Majorgeeks may even have it.
Three good sites:
http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/
http://www.winehq.org/
http://ubuntuforums.org/
You can install and uninstall Ubuntu with the windows installer (Wubi) makes it a bit easier, Uvah ... and you don't have to stuff around with your hard drive
http://www.ubuntu.com/download/desktop/windows-installer
"I tried to install it on a flash drive but it didn't take"
http://www.ubuntu.com/download/help/create-a-usb-stick-on-windows
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