If it helps any, we could actually discuss the movie for say a change of pace!

The debate is on the factual validity of a pseudo-documentary made by that idiot Michael Moore.

This is part of what I'm talking about; the snide comments that either overtly or otherwise imply lesser intelligence on your opponents in this debate.

As for my view, you have it in the above statement, but I'll reiterate it here since you're such a naffing idiot that you fail to discern my view from everything I posted:

The factual validity of Michael Moore's pseudo-documentary Fahrenheit 9/11 is NAFFING NIL.

This further illustrates my point; intead of answering the damn question, you ridicule the questioner.

So I'll say it again:

Either incontrovertibly prove that I am a simpleton because I disagree with you, or STFU and GTFO, you naff bitch.

EDIT: Thought I'd also give a reply to this since it was posted within two minutes of my post.

1. You will, of course, provide incontrovertible evidence that the mustard gas in Saddam's possession was sold to him by the United States government.

2. Closing a forum for political discussion would be un-American, yes. Luckily, this is not a forum, but is in actuality a thread. Which of course means that it is perfectly valid and within American policy to lock, because this thread is rapidly degenerating into uselessness, as evidenced by BoobzTwo's continual ridicule of her opposition, in spite of the fact that she has provided zero evidence for the rightness of her views.

I'll also point out that the Off-Topic Forum is shared across Stardock sites, so not only are Sins players here, but Elemental, Demigod, GalCiv 1/2 players, WinCustomize users, and also members of JoeUser.

Case in point: there's at least 3-5 users from the JoeUser, Elemental, and Sins of a Solar Empire forums that have posted in this thread.

Since when is/are the American news service(s) trusted to present the facts in an objective, unbiased manner? I'll tell you:

NEVER.

And I'm an American, mind you, and as an American, I don't trust the news. OTOH, I trust the American news more than Michael Moore, since at least there are multiple sources you can piece together information from to form a minimally-biased and distorted piece of news.

EDIT: also like to point out that I don't trust anything that myfist0 has brought up in this thread, on account of him not knowing jack shit about what he's going on about.

Seeing as how he's a Canuck. And not an American. And this thread is dealing with American politics.

It should be obvious where I'm going with this.

LOL that doc is CANADIAN MADE. The 5th Estate is like your 60 Minutes.

I do not believe the books support this. Fidel Castro. 
 
I do not believe books support this. 638 Ways to Kill Castro

It is illegal at home or abroad … unless of course the USG says it is ok, go figure.

clicky link.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cddIgb1nGJ8

My first response to the invasion of Iraq was, "This is a mistake."... but I also assumed the government must surely know something they couldn't say publicly.  That does not seem to really be the case with what I have heard so far.

I still don't think it's clear what the urgency to go into Iraq was and that the "most favorable" interpretation of whatever suited their goal was what was motivated them to pick and choose their "facts".

So there's lots of room for debate and back and forth on who, what and why but it is all speculation as well.

On the subject of Iraq in the Saddam era--and looking back at it from the perspective of what was happening before 9-11--it was a threat to stability in the Middle East and world (though not for terrorism or even WMDs in particular).  If the protests and riots in the Middle East now occurred under Saddam, we already know exactly what would have happened to the protesters.  They would have been poison gassed back at their villages until ever man, woman and child was dead.  They would have been arrested, tortured and then executed and thrown into mass graves.

We can know with certainty this is what would happen because it is exactly was did happen to the Shi'ites and Kurds who revolted.  Remember the video of several hundred wailing Iraqi men and women digging in the dirt with their hands and fingers because they heard a rumor (untrue) that their arrested family members might have been buried alive in an underground prison there?

Iraq invaded Kuwait but what is not often discussed was that he also planned to invade Saudi Arabia--either by appealing to revolutionaries stirred up by him within Saudi Arabia after Kuwait was secured and then coming to "help" or simply by driving in with his army--which was the fourth largest in the world at the time.  The first serious ground fight of the war was U.S. and Iraqi Revolutionary Guard forces in a Saudi Arabian town--and we were in Saudi Arabia because the Saudi's expressly asked the US to come fearing they were going to be invaded.

The aluminum tubes thought to be for nukes and later it was concluded  were probably only for "conventional" weapons were not "stock" bodies for rpg's and scuds and the like.  They were casings for smaller rockets that would have very high thrust (and that equals larger payload and/or range).  These were not cheap casing of typical Soviet era designed weapons in use at the time.  These would have been faster, longer ranged and heavier hitting artillery/rocket shells capable of carrying large conventional payloads greater distances.  The sort of thing one would use for a deep advance chemical artillery barrage during an invasion.

Don't forget the nuclear power plant taken out in the 80's and during the Gulf War, "Human shields anyone?".

Project Babylon, financed and approved by Saddam, was Gerald Bull's "supergun" and would have had the capability to hit Israel with 4500 lb shells that could be fired up to low earth orbit.-- taking out Israel was part of the role Saddam stated on numerous occasions was his "destiny" (remember the scuds falling there?).  The gun likely would not have been used as Gerald Bull was dispatched by the Mossad and Iraq had little capability to work on refining the design further but it shows the intent and desire of Saddam.  It also would have been a serious threat to Iran.

So we know Saddam was inhuman in his treatment of his own people, was willing to start a war in the Middle East and to seize its major oil fields--toppling major governments there in order to do so.

I don't think Amercians would have supported going into Iraq after 9-11 but  that doesn't invalidate the fact that Iraq was a threat and danger in many ways and always had been.  I haven't heard any of the finger pointers and blame throwers even address the humanitarian issues and serious threat to world stability in their rants.

Saddam was a megolmaniac and a war waiting to happen...yet the same people who rail against us being there are often "all for" our helping topple the government in Libya--which is far less a concern to us here "across the pond".

People get worked into a frenzy on their selected issue and then that becomes the only issue that matters. Life isn't that simple.

'Caught lying' is a stretch.  Just another example of the clumsiness in storytelling highlighted in the second video.

As for that second video, I'm glad to know Linda Ronstadt's opinion.  And that Morning Joe thought it was worth quoting.  That's really helpful (was he angling for a date or something?).  I laughed at the rest, too.  But, at the time, and since, I was more interested in his policies and actions than his (lack of) public speaking ability.  Obsessing about the latter was, and remains, a frivolous exercise, a diversion, unserious.

And the 5th Estate 'documentary' was a rehash of all the truther idiocy.

I really hope you don't buy in to any of that, myfist0.  That you're just trying to be entertaining.

This thread makes me LOL 

I don't know why you guys feed the troll....

Trolls... you gotta love trolls... lmfao rofl

I guess the same reason for why 1 side of the highway has an accident and the other side has a traffic jam.