I must confess that I actually thought I hated this man and everything he was about until I started experiencing an overload of inaccurate and fictitious information the USG keeps pounding out and calling it the truth … so I decided to try an independent review of what I thought I knew and didn’t really. So I never watched or read anything Moore was involved with but I was more than willing to tell you how screwed up he was. So I rented the movie from Netflix and watched it … and I was amazed.
I have watched it twice now and I cannot find one shred of much information that is not factual or accurate. Beyond some idiosyncrasies in his sense of humor (they are funny); he presents very valid arguments and backs them up with documentation and interviews. He brings to light many of the things I have discovered in my own research into deceit, terrorism and the USG.
When I was a liberal (before I knew better) the only accurate information had to come from another liberal else it was a lie??? Later when I made my second mistake and became a conservative I learned the error of my ways … the truth could only be had from like ilk … so imagine my confusion when I called the neolibs and neocons for what they are and went independent. Suddenly, I have no source of valid information at all now (seemingly hehehe). I have had no success at all trying to walk the moderate tightrope between all the sharks without one side or the other dragging me down, go figure.
As far as Democrats/Republicans are concerned, their only care about the independent majority is how many they can acquire each election. But no matter which side is the best recruiter or who gets most independent votes … matters that concern the moderates will largely be ignored or sidelined and the neo-politicians will go their own course virtually unrestricted and completely unaccountable.
I think the media is doing a damn good job at turning the word "conspiracy" into an automatic "nut" where people are conditioned to put the 2 words together and therefore any information supplied or questions asked are laughed at and waved off. Look at any article by the so-called reputable media about conspiracy theories and all are automatically biased using words like quacks or nuts. Definition of CONSPIRE transitive verb : plot, contrive intransitive verb 1 a : to join in a secret agreement to do an unlawful or wrongful act or an act which becomes unlawful as a result of the secret agreement <accused of conspiring to overthrow the government>b : scheme 2 : to act in harmony toward a common end <circumstances conspired to defeat his efforts> By this definition, the USG theorizes (NOT PROVEN) that Al Qaeda conspired the attacks of 9/11. I challenge anyone to find a YouTube news clip or news paper article that uses the term "Conspiracy Theory" when describing an investigation into Al Qaeda and 9/11. Find me one article or video clip that ever used "Conspiracy Theory" when describing legitimate investigations. Popular Mechanics Debunks 911 Myths Lets just start with the title using Myths Now what do most Americans automatically think of when hearing or reading the word "myth". Personally I think of ghosts and unicorns. "an unfounded or false notion" or "a person or thing having only an imaginary or unverifiable existence" as websters puts it. So upon reading the title of the article, ask yourself is this objective or biased. CLAIM vs FACT
Webster's "Claim" 3a : to assert in the face of possible contradiction : maintain <claimed that he'd been cheated>
Webster's "Fact" 3: the quality of being actual : actuality <a question of fact hinges on evidence>
So upon reading the titles of the sections, ask yourself is this objective or biased. Can a person not state that all the information supplied under the "Fact" sections are also only "Claims"?
Red "Claim" vs Green "Fact"
Purpose – Color is ubiquitous and is a source of information. People make up their minds within 90 seconds of their initial interactions with either people or products. About 62-90 percent of the assessment is based on colors alone. So, prudent use of colors can contribute not only to differentiating products from competitors, but also to influencing moods and feelings – positively or negatively – and therefore, to attitude towards certain products. Given that our moods and feelings are unstable and that colors play roles in forming attitude, it is important that managers understand the importance of colors in marketing. The study is designed to contribute to the debate. Findings – Findings of the study are that managers can use colors to increase or decrease appetite, enhance mood, calm down customers, and, reduce perception of waiting time, among others.
Purpose – Color is ubiquitous and is a source of information. People make up their minds within 90 seconds of their initial interactions with either people or products. About 62-90 percent of the assessment is based on colors alone. So, prudent use of colors can contribute not only to differentiating products from competitors, but also to influencing moods and feelings – positively or negatively – and therefore, to attitude towards certain products. Given that our moods and feelings are unstable and that colors play roles in forming attitude, it is important that managers understand the importance of colors in marketing. The study is designed to contribute to the debate.
Findings – Findings of the study are that managers can use colors to increase or decrease appetite, enhance mood, calm down customers, and, reduce perception of waiting time, among others.
Ask yourself to think about the first ten things that pop in your head when you think of red. Then do the same when you think of green. Objective or biased?
Starting on the first page and Popular Mechanics views of anyone that questions the "Claims".
Is this not how the media describes terrorists?
Only by confronting such poisonous claims with irrefutable facts can we understand what really happened on a day that is forever seared into world history.
"Is the fact of this group’s growing presence on the Internet a reason for studying it in a course on 9/11? Sure. Is the instructor who discusses the group’s arguments thereby endorsing them? Not at all. It is perfectly possible to teach a viewpoint without embracing it and urging it. But the moment a professor does embrace and urge it, academic study has ceased and been replaced by partisan advocacy. And that is a moment no college administration should allow to occur."
And I haven't even started in on the content of this article yet.
I am not taking a microscope to Michael Moore, all I am saying is he is a liar and to not believe anything he says without taking it with a grain of salt.
Who is Popular Mechanics?
Visit Popular Mechanics Customer Service Page and click on "Contact Us" Editor and you will see an eMail popularmechanics@hearst.com. Now google "hearst.com"
Ever hear of William Randolph Hearst? Just do a google search and you will find links with The Rockefellers, Illuminati.
Over the next few years Hearst became the owner of 28 newspapers and magazines, including the Los Angeles Examiner, the Boston American, the Atlanta Georgian, the Chicago Examiner, the Detroit Times, the Seattle Post-Intelligencer, Cosmopolitan and the Washington Herald. He used his newspapers and magazines to campaign for an aggressive foreign policy. As a result of distorted and exaggerated reporting, Hearst was blamed for the war between the United States and Spain (1897-98).
“You furnish the pictures and I'll furnish the war.” William Randolph Hearst
“You can crush a man with journalism.” William Randolph Hearst
HOLY CRAP and I just started
Hearst upset the left-wing in America by being a pro-Nazi in the 1930s and a staunch anti-Communistin the 1940s.
Governments are a necessity if there is to be any cohesiveness to one’s society, just like the religions. It is just too easy to blame the American people for electing the idiots when all we did was elect people who told us they were going to fix everything, just like the religions. Then after the people have served their sole purpose (to elect would be liars and thieves) … they go about doing ‘whatever’, and we go about ‘assuming’ they are going to do what they said they would but don’t. We ignore their actions and go about daily life angry and upset most of the time, just like the religions. It is just too easy for most to attack secularism and ignore religious manifestations of the same things. For example … Historians distinguish four different manifestations of the Inquisition: (There are many other examples too)
The Great Jewish Revolt (66-70). Zealotry was described as one of the "four sects" at this time. The zealots (Jewish rebels) have been described as one of the first examples of the use of terrorism.
Most religions have both dualistic and gnostic elements which are often at odds with themselves. It seems that religious folk have no problems dismissing outright anything (everything) cruel and inhumane the religions have (still are) sponsoring as long as there is the “built into the system” that God’s will makes it right. Substitute USG for gods in the previous sentence and you have well, just what we do today, anarchy which is the desired effect.
quote who="Sinperium" reply="275" id="2939677"]
"It has been said that democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried." -- Sir Winston Churchill[/quote]A lot of things have been said about a lot of things, that are wise, but that doesn’t make them true (or not) … is that not the purpose (that’s politics). There are in my mind no real preferences for type of government as it is totally up to the miscreants (or not) in charge (USG in our case) to live up to their own ideals which virtually never happens. America is a perfect example!
Regardless of how you feel about the book, the point is valid. People clump together and look for a "savior like them" to whom they can give absolute power in order to make people by force do what they want. That's evil.
I am not sure of your point unless it is that many Brits are capricious in demeanor and rather un-educated … they are not alone there?
In a perfect world, we would all live in harmony and coexist content in our own joy. It isn't now and never will be a human-made "perfect world". We have to work within the imperfect--that's what we are.
My quotes weren't to prove anything just to point out that the limitations and liabilities of government and people have been long understood by many--it isn't a new thing.
I just like a Churchill's quotes--he has some real gems for a cantankerous curmudgeon--and I thought it was funny that people in England can live there oblivious to who he was. Of course here, kids don't really know who Nixon or Reagan were either.
If the world soccer cup is being played in the final game and each team accuses the other of cheating regarding the final and winning goal...what do you do? You turn to a referee.
Imagine going to a game being played at an equally passionate level by two teams with totally different philosophies on what was fair and how it should be played and just saying, "Well--we'll let it work itself out."
As long as people are different and imperfect--which will be as long as we are here--we need a referee. Government is the only referee we have been able to come up with.
I've been around the world a few times and known a lot of different people and can tell you now that if we leave it just up to individuals to govern themselves, that many individuals think it's perfectly fine to be the roving motorcycle gang from Mad Max and to take whatever they want from you.
So going on about "all government is evil and pestilence" isn't any kind of solution to anything--it's all we've got at the moment. The American Indians had tribes--some of which worked together and some that didn't but nearly all had in common the values of treating the earth and nature with respect and care, to not take more than you need, to share from abundance, etc. Yet at the same time these tribes almost completely (with the exception of a very few) believed in kidnapping and killing members of other tribes for glory and goods.
No society that's yet been on the earth has avoided violence and the need for governance at some point in its existence and I am always suspicious of people who want to eliminate the status quo by means of compulsion and even force so they can have it their way. think about it--what do you think the very corrupt people who make up governments and make laws now would be doing if there were no laws and governments?
SO.... Many.... TOPICS
SO.... Many.... TOPICS ... I know, whew ... how would you like to try and filter much of this nonsense and try to respond to them all
Supposed to be 9/11 though if I remember?
I'm primarily just hitting the "United States is the Great Satan" outroar here and just suggesting that there are no angels on either side.
I am very aware of Hitler and the parallels in some aspects of our contemporary society but its a big difference in pointing to similar methods and saying, "We are just like Hitler."
When we are having jack booted thugs kicking kids naked into gas chambers after having shot there parents in front of them and conscripting young women as teens to serve as breeders for perfect babies and exterminating ethnic populations then you can say, "The United States is as bad as Nazi Germany.". We're not there yet. Fascism doesn't automatically equal "Hitler".
If you make the point that we are slowly tolerating fascist-like methods in the US--I completely see the parallels and have actually toldd to my own kids about that very thing. My view is that a lot of the voices crying, "Fascists!" would be happy and even advocate communism as its replacement.
The one value we still have at least a loose hold on now is that we have constitutionally recognized emphasis on individual freedom. Teaching people revolution doesn't mean they understand liberty. That's a tool used by tyrants as well--which is why I mentioned some of them. Hitler and Mao and Stalin were all revolutionaries and addressing action against some real injustices when they began.
Here's a saying I have at home, "If you go around convinced all is darkness and devote yourself to looking for it--you always find it.".
I listened to your video above and what she said about the founders intending the people to be the patriots--that's exactly my own point. What's at issue is when we say, "Take action!"--what sort of action are we advocating?
myfist0, ran across this and thought of you ... we have the same problems here too, hehehe.
You gat to love the educational system ...
Alright, this is just offensive.
Does anyone know if there is a way to block JoeUser forums from my feed? Or maybe even just a specific user (not naming any names)?
I just can't take anything you say seriously after reading this. There is absolutely nothing equivalent to the Night of the Long Knives or the Night of Broken Glass in US history. Now, normally, I try to keep my language clean on these forums, but you are either:
1) A fucking idiot,2) Have some dumb fucking ulterior motive, or3) Are a fucking idiot.
To trivialize such dark aspects of history is to do a disservice to all those who had the misfortune to live through them.
I am reporting this post to the forum administrators, and I truly hope to never hear from you again.
Awesome video. Funny as hell
LoA's post was almost as funny. I love online temper tantrums
As to my Popular Mechanics post. That would be like Cheech (PM) asked to give evidence about Chong (USG) and we the people take it as gospel. ROFLMFAO
My last thought here--I'm not blind to history repeating itself--that's what 80% of my posts are referencing. Yes, Americans could--given the right set of chance and circumstances--become like the Nazis--as could any country.
Where you jump off the diving board though is when you attempt to definitively say, "I see it--it's happening right now!".
It's subjective, speculative and fanciful to go, "Hmmm--someof our troops acted badly in some circumstances"..."Hmmm...we may have economic interests to have troops there--not just moral ones"..."Hmm...some of our politicians are corrupt and affecting our governement"...
Ah Ha! They are becoming a full-blown fascist state and its happening tomorrow--rebel nooooow!
This sort of thing isn't debate or discussion--its just inflamatory and reactive. it isn't a chain of logic and evidence--it's circumstantial and speculative.
It also is exactly the sugar that conspiracy nuts and crazies feed on.
And MyFist0--I do fully agree with you about the pairing of "Conspiracy" and "Nut" being automatically associated--sometimes there are conspiracies and not everyone looking at them are nuts. We should question everything and demanding clear explanations and transparency is never a problem. And, sure, the press isn't helping greatly in this.
Another of my sayings: "Australians would be sooo cute if it wasn't for their politics."
Moved thread to a more appropriate category.
Personally, I might just have to relocate to Australia soon, based on the predictions of the upcoming nuclear holocaust.
This is for all those who fear not the new nuclear order of which Iran will be the ceter of discussions.
It seems that reading on their own is too difficult, maybe the picture method will do it ... it works for the other children who know everything ... too. If you think there is some magnanimous reasons from the USG to “HELP” save all those idiots from themselves … and that “OIL” has nothing to do with things … think again! Bin Laden was never even charged with the murders of 9/11 ... because there was not enough evidence to charge him ... but as is usual, the USG knew better ... so they did what all 'good' politicians do, they lie through their teeth after all the sheeple will not question THEM? Is it safe to presume that Iran is in a bad way?
Is it safe to presume that Iran is in a bad way?
Seems a bit far-fetched. Most of those "US Military Bases" are not US bases at all. There may be a US military presence there, usually a logistic mission at a foreign military/civilian airport. The presenter would have one believe these (outside the war zone) are packed with soldiers, armor, and artillery. Most (as in the majority) of these sites are leased from the host and can be closed/removed at the their pleasure. Telling the intended audience that 20-30 (in some case fewer, much fewer) US military personnel at many these sites wouldn't be as dramatic I suppose. Some folks entertainment is another's gospel I guess. Doesn't everyone get their opinion from you tube these days???
Iran may be in a bad way, but I believe it has more to fear internally than external.
The clip was actually put together to demonstrate the “moral” reasons the USG and the Coalition of the willing has for wreaking havoc in the Middle East. The film also showed well, I guess you will have to watch more to find out, hehehe. I only mentioned Iran because its fate has already been sealed. I am not supportive of everything Ron Paul has to say, but he was spot on here. I am using a lot of YouTube lately, because people on JU have such a hard time with words of more than one syllable ... so I am trying pictures.
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