In my opinion, the biggest issue in War of Magic is game pace. Some things we can improve. We can speed up the early game, we can even out the progression of spells, armor and weapons so it doesn’t feel like they obsolete older versions too quickly, but are still worthwhile upgrades. But the tech system is a giant pace imposing beast that cannot be avoided.
Which is unfortunate, because conceptually I like the tech system in War of Magic. It fits with the rule of 5, and I’ve been using the “breakthrough provides random options” in other parts of the game to provide some design consistency and make the systems feel like they all belong to the same game.
The big problem with the system is that there are 5 tech categories and the research cost of a tech is determined by how many techs you know in that category. The more Military techs you know, the more the next Military tech you are about to learn will cost. The reason for this is that since the player picks the tech after research is done, the game doesn’t know what they are going to research until it’s over. So it can’t have tech specific research costs.
We thought about a lot of ways to improve this and keep the current system. What if we have the tech’s research cost go toward the next tech? What if we have the tech cost be the highest amount and then allow the player to recover research they don’t spend? What if we give an option when the player has enough research to discovered one tech but he can choose to continue researching to get to others?
But in the end they were all flawed and too confusing. So we got out the torch, some kindling and marshmellows and said goodbye.
Then we made the Fallen Enchantress tech tree which includes the following.
1. Tech screen- A tech tree screen where players can plan out their research goals. Distant techs can be selected and the game will automatically queue up the research path to get there.
2. Tech based research costs- Now we can have the best armor tech in the game cost much more than the first weapon tech (previously if they were both the 6th military tech you picked they would cost the same amount).
3. Allegiance prereqs- Techs that are only available for certain allegiances, so even though there is only one tech tree in Fallen Enchantress the Empire and Fallen have different branches to follow. In general kingdoms have extra defensive military techs and empires have extra sorcery techs. There are civilization techs that are unique to each, the kingdoms get cooperation which leads to resources that improve their population growth and the empire get Domination which allows them to work their people to death. (we may update this to allow race specific techs for modders)
4. Random techs- Some techs have a percentage chance of showing up for a player in a game. Every time you start a game your tech tree will be slightly different. You may start a game and have masterwork armor as a tech in your tech tree (25% per game) that you can research at some point to be able to craft better armor for your armies. You may have a tech that allows you to recruit some unusual creatures. Some that grant access to spells that aren’t normally available, etc. This is one of my favorite features because I enjoy looking at my tech tree at the beginning of my game to find out what options are out there. It may change my research plans, it’s like dynamic faction strengths. You may play the Ironeers over again, but in one game they have 3 extra military techs, in another they have an extra adventuring and sorcery tech, etc.
5. Autolayout- The tech tree draws itself and its lines automatically. This was needed because the tech tree will be different every time, so it must be able to lay itself out programmatically. The good news for modders is that they can add techs to their hearts content and they will be automatically added to the tree right where they belong.
6. Cross category prereqs- Techs that require techs in other categories. You can’t rush to big weapons in Fallen Enchantress like you can in War of Magic. You need some civilization techs (blacksmithing) before you will be able to produce metal weapons and armor. You need Literacy in the civilization category before you can learn the adventure tech Ereog’s Journals.
Won’t don’t techs do now? They don’t spawn resources, monsters (monster get tougher over time, but it doesn’t matter what techs you research) or champions (though it takes techs to recruit them). In general everything is on the map at the beginning of the game.
We will talk about the world later, but this is a part of the new design. Explore the world, because you have to find out what’s out there, it isn’t going to be given to you as you research techs. If you don’t have metal near your starting location you may need to find someone to kill to take it (or look into the other 4 ways to control the world). You can’t always come into the game with a plan, you have to adapt a plan based on your starting condition. Techs are a big part of that.
These changes sound excellent! I especially enjoy the random techs that may or may not be available each different game. A 4x space game called Sword of the Stars uses this mechanic to perfection... almost. I would suggest to avoid making these random techs something very significant to say a strategy or as an overall tech you "need" to have. Eg. in Sword of the Stars there is a tech that may or may not show up which allows you to build Cruiser class colony ships which greatly increases the rate at which you can terraform a planet as well as how much infrastructure your new outpost starts with and how much initial population you have. Generally what one would do is research up to that tech to find out if they in fact got that tech. If they didn't get it it was back to the main menu to start a new game. Now the chances of having this tech available to you were still very high but why leave something that important and useful to chance?
One other idea I'll splash in with this. Would it be a good idea to link certain units to certain techs ala Civilization? I enjoy being able to equip my own units but it doesn't really make sense to field some units with only a couple pieces of armor (also I really wish all the special equipment techs were rolled into one tech). Generally when I make a unit I will use every piece of armor that is available while keeping the pieces uniform (ie all leather, all plate etc..) The only time I make anything different is if I'm making a scout but I am finding even that is not worth the time/resources as hero's make the best scouts in that they can pop goody huts and go on quests and whatnot as well as use items some units can't. One final request, and I'm sure others have brought this up but, we need to be able to upgrade already trained units when we research new armor/weapons.
I'm really looking forward to FE!
Can we have an option to choose not knowing what the random tech will be. Personally I would like to be surprsed so I will alwasy toggle this to Random Unknown.
I welcome the changes in title post, but I still see that tech tree is affected by only spending points. Can FE be more innovative than that? I sincerely hope so. I have some good brainstorming 2 years ago in this forum, I still want it this day. Derek, hope that you hear me. Source: 5 Unique playstyles by making each individual tech tree individually viable Can I play a game that I put every single research point just into 1 of the tech trees, and still be extremely competitive to other players? What if individually, each of the trees is almost completely balanced and competitive, yet the play feel completely different? What will my kingdom look like if I do that?
The main issue with proposed tech tree is that the tech tree looks bland. And most likely your kingdom will looks like mine, with just minor differences... Need drastic change!Source: Tech research: Situational, Unlimited and Random tech (Updated & excerpt)
I suggest major change to the concept of tech tree
Core tech is available to almost everyone, and is researchable via the mundane(& boring) acquisition of research points. But the acquisition on all other (comparatively more powerful) non-core tech is sometimes linked to player’s Acheievement, which representing competitive edge and the strategic decision/effort of the gamer. Gamer needs to think/plan to get achievementNon-core tech does not further branch out to other core techs. They are dead-end techs, this kind of avoid the issue of upgrading Exposive Archery lvl1 to Exposive Archery lvl99 by spending more research more research point on it. However, even they are called dead-end, they can upgrade to level 99 if you use ii enough times (or use it to acheive something, e.g. kill 99 enemy using the Exposive Archery skill). The progress of these none-core tech is Achievement based.Core tech can also be Acheivement based, but they can only have top level of 10, for example. For Core tech, most of these Achievement based bonus (or level) is Ranked. Amongst all 5 players you are the player that owned most number of Archers, you ranked #1 then you have Archery lvl 10 for all units that get this skill. Instead if you Ranked #3 in terms of number of archers, you got Archery lvl6Simplify the tech tree, don't need 200 tech with 90 branches. Yet, make the tech tree a game/competition; instead of 'hey I got moe research point, where should I spend to get a new toy?'Pre-game Option: Tech picks vs Magic book picksIn MOM, you allocate spell books to make certain colour of magic stronger or weaker when you design your race. Now in FE pre-game screen, you have say 20 books and you’ll need to allocate the book picks amongst Spell research AND Tech research. If you put a lot of books in to Population related tech, you will be certainly weaker/slower in other aspect of spell and tech research.There should be an option to randomize, or choose a default set of book pick.In some games, you may have powerful technology; in some other games you may have more powerful spells. Tech & Spell research will then become one of the variables on how you customize your game.
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