On another blog, a fellow JoeUser asked the following questions and made the following comments:
I am irritated with the closed-mindedness of organizations with causes. If there is only one way (YOUR way) to reach God … why are there so many divergent paths and religions making the same claim? What makes you think it is even conceivable that a paper trail in excess of 2000 years could contain much resemblance to the original fictions?
I am sure you have heard of the test that goes like this: Get a group of 10 people in a circle and whisper a statement to one person. Then they whisper it to the next and so on. There has never been a valid documented case where the original statement bore much resemblance to the 10th person’s statement. This is simply explained with the fact that people are different and they think ‘differently’. Organizations do not like this concept which they classify as ‘self-serving individualism’.
I must be a fool (as you are want to tell me) because I do not believe that the concepts of lying, deceit and conspiracy, power struggles, suppressing the masses, limiting real knowledge, murder, deception and intrigue are new to this century or any other for that matter. But of course, religious theology was not susceptible to human contamination … of course. I believe these concepts were in existence long before recorded time. Why would this befouling of the truth affecting all of human history, exclude ONLY Christian Doctrine? Only mind dead robots could believe this absurdity.
whatever. I'm just trying to get you to stay biblical and stay away from those RCC commentaries that are steering you wrong.
I wrote this blog a year ago and it addresses what's going on here.
http://kfc.joeuser.com/article/397680/Nothing_But_The_Truth
I didn’t mean my age specifically, I was referring to the fact that I spent years trying to prove that there is a One God … but I failed and miserably so. Your God doesn’t dwell in my heart and my mind will not release what I have discovered and believe to be the Truth. “If this strength requires that you take up the gospel, so be it … as long as you can tell right from wrong. The truth of things can only be found in man’s heart (and brain) and requires no subjugation of our innate ability to experience and understand the world around us.”(Copied from an upcoming post “A Knight’s Tale … under movies)
That is exactly what I've done. I've tried to take those passages you gave; add info, opening up the whole picture of the Early Chruch and what the Apostles were doing at the time.
I didn't ignore what you wrote...those passages you gave are fine, but they tell only part of the whole.
Lula posts:
But we are to keep holy the New Covenant Sabbath.
It's true, we are NOT under the rites and ceremonies of the OLd Mosaic Covenent, but we are still bound to keep the Ten Commandments and the Natural or Moral Law. The Third Commandment has 3 parts which the Jews were to keep all three.
The New Covenant Christians must keep only one part of the Third Commandment, the part that has to do with the Natural or Moral law and that's what the Apostles and the Church did.
The answer is Scripture shows the Apostles and the early Church kept the LOrd's Day holy by worshipping Creator God on Sunday.
Even though the ceremonial laws of Moses was abrogated, we are obligated now, as was always, to worship Our Creator God. This is a precept of the Natural Law which was obeyed from the days of Adam to the days of Abraham and by the Jews themselves for 400 years before Moses brought the commandment naming a specific day for the Jews.
The Apostles' changing from the last to the first day of the week does not change the vital and unchangeable principle of the Third Commandment to keep the Sabbath holy namely that one day in 7 shall be given to the worship of God. We must do that.
You keep insisting that I show the command in the NT...all the while the command is there from God in the Third Commandment which has never been abrogated.
While the Bible does not say, "thou shalt keep holy Sunday", it does give positive evidence that Christians worshipped on the first day of the week, for they were not obliged to observe the Sabbath of the Old Law.
But when an attempt was made to impose the Jewish Sabbath upon the convert Christians, when they were not obligated to observe it, St.Paul wrote Gal. 5:10-11 and Col. 2:16.
What I'm saying fits ... it fits the whole picture of the changing of the Sabbath which involves keeping holy the Lord's Day.
KFC Posts:
The Church is indeed still under the Ten Commandments but not under the rites and ceremonies of the Old Mosaic Covenant.
The Protestants are under the Ten Commandments too, although they may think they are not! As BT often says, Go figure!
The Ten Commandments and the Natural Law go hand in hand as the Ten are an expression of the Natural Law which God has written in every man's heart and which every man can know if he listens to the inner voice of reason and conscience.
The Ten Commandments apply to all men and all times.
The Jews could not perfectly observe those laws becasue they did not have the Grace that Christ brought. Now, with Christ the Church is under Grace and therefore we Christians can, by God's supernatural grace, keep all the Commandments if we desire to do so and use the means of Grace which are the Sacraments instituted by Christ.
FASTING.
Quoting KFC Kickin For Christ, reply 275Show me anywhere in the NT where it says that we are to Keep the "Lord's Day." I've already given you ACTS 15 where there were ONLY two requirements for the Christians coming into the faith as far as the Old Covenant was concerned. 1. Avoid idolatry2. Avoid sexual immoralityNow I'll give you the scriptures that show that we are NOT under the OT law when it comes to the Sabbath.. Paul wrote in Romans 14:1-5Him that is weak in the faith receive but not to doubtful disputations. For one believes that he may eat all things; another who is weak, eats only herbs. Le not him that eats despise him that eats not; and let not him which eats not judge him that eats for God has received him....one man esteems one day above another; another esteems every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind. He that regards the day regards it to the Lord and he that regards not the day to the Lord he does not regard it. He that eats eats to the Lord for he gives God thanks; and he that eats not, to the Lord he eats not, and gives God thanks...Basically what Paul is doing in v1-12 (more than the above) is giving us the proper attitude Christians should have toward each other in debatable areas of conduct (things that are not clearly stated to be wrong). God has received both the weaker and stronger believer. Speaking to the Galatians who were trying to adhere to the Mosaic Law (Old Covenant) he wrote this in 4:9-11:"But now, after that you have known God or rather are known of God, how turn you again to the weak and beggarly elements where you desire again to be in bondage? (OLD LAW) You observe days and months and times and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain." He's telling them that they are not acting like heirs of God and are being influenced by the Judaizers observing the days and festivals of the Jewish calendar. and my favorite verse that is very clear.."Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us which ws contrary to us and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross. Let no man therefore judge you in meat or in drink or in respect of a holyday or of the new moon or the Sabbath days. Which are a shadow of things to come but the body is of Christ. Col 2:16-17False teachers were insisting on abstinence from certain foods (RCC did this on Fridays with no meat) and observance of certain days.
THIS is what you conclude from these passages? I can't see where these passages have anything at all to do with false teachers.
Slamming fasting and abstinence!
We've already established that there was turmoil and difficulties between the Judaic Christians who still kept the Jewish fasts abstaining from types of food forbidden in the Old Law and Gentile Christians that didn't. St.Paul had his hands full trying to get this all worked out. That's what these passages are concerning.
Fasting and abstaining from eating certain foods is an act of true religion as is almsgiving and prayer. Fasting and abstinence was a disciplinary act of Jewish Faith under the Old Law and is now an act of Christian Faith under the New Covenant.
Quoting KFC Kickin For Christ, reply 275 teachers were insisting on abstinence from certain foods (RCC did this on Fridays with no meat) and observance of certain days.
Yes, maam.
The Church instructs the Catholic faithful to follow the example of Christ St.Matt. 6:1-6, 16-18, St.Mark, 2:20, 9:29 and the Apostles Acts. 13:2; 14:23; 2Cor. 2:27. The Didache tells us the early Christians practiced regular weekly fasts on Wednesdays and Fridays.
I understand what you're saying, and in general I agree. However,
As I read your comment, it made me think of the verse highlighted.
I esteem Sundays above the others. Evidently you don't.
I'm thinking of Genesis and the account of the Creation. 2:3 "And He blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it; becasue in it he had rested from all His work which God created and made."
Take this as a start and put it together with other Scriptural passages and it's possible to come to understand God commanded the observance of a certain day and the Apostles chose Sunday as the day to be sanctified.
Ha, ha, ha, yes you do!
That's your agenda!
There's adequate proof...just look in a mirror...you are the proof....God created you. He gave you life, an immortal soul, a conscience, intellect and free will.
Good point, I don't. But I do know something about spiritual warfare and that's what is being waged here.
Some Scripture for thought...St.Matt. 16:26, "For what doth it profit a man, if he gain the whole world, and suffer the loss of his own soul? Or what exchange shall a man give for his soul?"
Also, Ephesians 6:12, "For our wrestling is not against flesh and blood, but against principalities and powers, against rulers of the world of this darkness, against the spirit of wickedness in high places."
As I've said before... our eternal destiny is all about choices.
and this is what I'll agree to.
I've said enough on the rest. Believe what you want.
I also know how old the Earth is within a couple of billion years or so how about you? I understand what it actually means to stare at the remains of a human being found in the Americas that is over 10,000 years old. Take a minute and think about that??? Have you ever actually looked at a real encyclopedia I mean beyond looking at the pretty pictures because you are too much for me? How does some of this stuff fit into your idea of the universe???
None of the articles I researched seemed at all interested in your religions … but just because they state things that do not agree with your AGENDA, they too are at war with you … somehow??? Here is an article that sums up this stuff pretty well (last 100,000 years of the History of the Earth).
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/paleo/ctl/100k.html
I am so out of here … I give up on you too.
Did you see this in today's news?
"But Bernhard Müller, editor of the Catholic magazine PUR, dismissed the clerics' reaction as grossly hypocritical. He alleged that the pornography scandal at Weltbild had been going on for at least a decade with the Church's full knowledge. Müller said that in 2008, a group of concerned Catholics had sent bishops a 70-page document containing irrefutable evidence that Weltbild published books that promoted pornography, Satanism and magic."Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/11/06/publisher-owned-by-catholic-church-reportedly-selling-porn-novels/#ixzz1cyW0IVxp
I'm telling you, this is rotten through and through. It never ends. How can this even remotely be "Christ's church?"
Yes.
Yes, what's happened in the German dioceses is very disturbing and horribly disgusting and truthfully I'm glad, really glad it's being exposed.
All those involved are committing grave sins against the Commandments of Almighty God and dissenting from the precepts of Catholic moral teachings.
Sin has been around since the Fall of Adam and Eve. Satan is having a field day.
Christ likened His Church to a Net. He said it would contain good fish and bad fish. So we don't condemn the whole Church for her bad fish, just as we don't condemn a whole family if one child went wrong.
Satan is having a field day attacking Christ's priests. Some priests resist the temptations and snares of the devil and are holy and some like these are going wrong, very wrong. I have never defended the conduct of every individual priests.
The CC is the true Church of Christ even though not all of her individual members, priests or laity, are true to her moral teachings.
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