The recent changes to Superweapons, along with recent discussion about which is best, prompted me to do some research on them. I tested each, noting the effects, recorded descriptions of each, and looked up old posts regarding them. The following summarizes each weapons characteristics.
First, the 1.2 changelog states:
TEC: Novalith Cannon Primary Effect: 3500 planet health damage, and 150 population killed. Secondary Effect: Cannot re-colonize for 2 minutes "due to strong bombardment raditation". Tertiary Effect: Trade Income is reduced by 50% for 30 minutes. "Trade Income 100%" (in red). Tertiary Effect: Population cap reduced by 40% for 30 minutes. "Max Population 40%" (in red). Target: Only colonized enemy planets. Cooldown: 360 (6 minutes) Antimatter: 200 per use. Cost: 8000 credit 600 metal 500 crystal per gun, 18 tactical slots. TL: 6000 credit 450 metal 375 crystal per gun, 15 tactical slots. (-25% cost, -3 slots). Research prerequisites: 3 Tier 2, 2 Tier 4, 1 Tier 6, 1 Tier 7, 1 Tier 8, Military tree. TEC Loyalists prereqs: only 2 Tier 6!, Military tree. Research cost: 8800 credit 1400 metal 2275 crystal TL Res. cost: 2800 credit 500 metal 800 crystal Advent: Deliverance Engine Primary Effect: attacking ships gain 25% increase in damage for 150 sec., "damage output 25%" (in green) Secondary Effect: Powerful spread of '50 culture' from the planet causing a temporary loss of around 10% allegiance Tertiary Effect: Shield mitigation increased 6% due to required culture research, and culture's presence. Adv. Loyals: also recieve 20% phase missile block. Add'l techs can also boost AL damage in culture. Target: Colonized freindly & enemy planets. Not neutral uncolonized gravity wells, nor dead roids (colonized or not). Cooldown: 360 (6 minutes) Antimatter: 200 per use. Cost: 8000 credit 600 metal 500 crystal per gun, 18 tactical slots. Research prerequisites: 3 Tier 2, 2 Tier 4, 2 Tier 6, 1 Tier 8, Civilian tree. Research cost: 8700 credit 1975 metal 2225 cystal Vasari: Kostura Cannon Primary Effect: 1250 damage to all structures (before armor and shield mitigation reductions) Secondary Effect: Disable orbital structures for 3 minutes Tertiary Effect: The planet acts as if there is a phase gate at the location for 1minute 30seconds. Target: Only colonized enemy planets. Cooldown: 360 (6 minutes) Antimatter: 200 per use. Cost: 8000 credit 600 metal 500 crystal per gun, 18 tactical slots. Research prerequisites: None! 1 Tier 8, Military tree. Research cost: 1800 credit 350 metal 550 crystal
Some additional observations:
The Novalith kills most planets with one shot. 2 shots to kill a HomeWorld (3 for fully upgraded HW in Rebellion). Multiple Novaliths can be a game winner if you methodically kill all. Starbase upgrades (ie: Aux Gov) can prevent planet loss.
Repeated staggered shots from 2 Deliverance guns on one enemy planeet, say every 3 minutes, will eventually bring allegiance to zero, and affect the adjoining planets as well. Providing they don't have offsetting culture! Shots stack, so its possible to have 100 culture bombarbing a planet (requires 5 unupgraded culture towers there to offset). But that 100 is divided by the number of outgoing phase lanes reducing effectiveness against adjoining planets. (At the maxi. -0.07%/sec allegiance loss rate = about 6 minutes for 25% allegiance, or 24 for 100%);(At the typical -0.04%/sec allegiance loss rate = 10.42 minutes for 25%, or 41.67 for 100%).
Three Kosturas shots in rapid succession will destroy extractors. It takes at least 5 shots to destroy frigate factories and turrets. About 6 shots to kill labs, trade ports and cap ship factories. Most structures have 5-7 armor. 5 armor reduces 1250 damage to 1000 effective damage. Most stuctures will exhibit around 900 damage. Since turrets have around 12 armor, they will exhibit damage in the high 700s for each Kostura shot. A single shot does little effective damage, unless it is followed by a fleet jumping through the temporary phase gate, and used to disable structures.
The Kostura only costs about one-quarter of the other 2 superweapons to research. And since it requires no other prerequite research, it can be completed much quicker. The Novalith and Deliverence Engine research are roughly comparable to each other in cost, and have fairly similar prerequisite research requirements. But the Deliverence Engine costs about 500 more metal, and it can be argued that the Deliverence Engine's cultural prerequisites are less useful. TEC Loyalist Novalith research costs only about a third, and the gun itself costs 75%, while taking only 15 slots, (so it is possible to put 2 guns at most planets).
Each gun costs the same to build individually (except TL), and they all have the same cool down and antimatter requirements.
[Edit] Rebellion has introduced new features affecting superweapons. For example: TEC Loyalists can now buy Novalith's much sooner, and for less cost. Also Advent Loyalist receive several new cultural boosts in the prerequisites leading up to a Deliverance engine.
I have updated this post to reflect those changes.
I am preaty sure you only need 1 tier 6 research for the novalith... and unless something has changed, the -40% max population is actually -40%... as in 3 shots reduce population to a maximum of 0.
Yeah, I can confirm you only need 1 level of Cyclotaurite Warheads.
Thanks, Yeah, its only 1 tier 6 research. I will edit the original post, and refigure the prerequisite cost. I'm not sure if the population reduction actually stacks (anymore)? I did look to see if it said -80% after 2 shots to kill a homeworld, and it didn't. But I also wasn't clear on the actual population reduction, so I will research that further as well.
Note that the enemy's cultural bonus (if present) will also be disabled for the time being.
This breakdown really makes me think the superweapons are mostly in line now.
Is the trade reduction (given a penalty of X %) a TRADE * (1 - X%) or TRADE x 1/(1 + X%)? I'm curious because if it is the latter, then how does the game handle trade bonuses??
I'm fine with novaliths reducing trade by 50% (as in half the trade is gone)...but, I have a problem with -100%, that is too powerful of an effect for 30 minutes...
the second option.
First nova reduces income to 50%, 2nd to 33%, 3rd to 25%, 4th to 20% and so forth.
It's worth mentioning that in order to effectively use the phase gate you need to drop civilian labs and research phase gate technology.
I don't think it does anymore, I'm pretty sure the last beta release made it non-stacking for trade income and population reductions.
If it's the second option, how does a trade bonus work then?? Arbitrate tariff uses the same type of entity modifier....does that bonus of "50%" then actually double trade? Unless its an overloaded function that treats positive and negative differently, I'm sensing a potential problem here...
Percentages aren't entirely consistent in Sins. Generally, negative 100% means it cuts something in half. Positive 100% means something is doubled. Then it gets really weird with the other percentages.
If you were able to afford superweapons, you probably have trade already (4 labs), so it's not like this is a big jump.
I believe the formula is (1+bonus%)/(1+penalty%)
I'm not implying anything other than he's trying to document the costs and research associated with super weapons. This is part of that cost.
isn't it a bit extreme to remove the kostura's anti-ship effect entirely?
No...disabling structures for a couple of minutes allows a fleet to get in and do its thing without having to worry about pesky repair bays, vasari hangars with phasic trap, point defense platforms, etc...kosturas make SBs very vulnerable by temporarily removing their support structures, and certainly remove a large amount of the defensive advantage any fleet would gain...
That kosturas can shut down superweapons from afar and allow your fleet to be anywhere gives them far greater utility than the other two superweapons...the only reason why novaliths and DEs compete is that those both have economic effects which, over time, are devastating...
Stop it Seleuceia. You are being "a Vasari hatin, TEC loving, number cruncher"! Er....logical I mean.
The Kostura was quite extreme to begin with. I think it's about right now.
What if I told you that I like Advent more than TEC? *GASP*
I am curious as to what people think about the -100% (or, I guess -50%) trade penalty...it seems a little high to me for a buff that lasts 30 minutes, but maybe I am mistaken? I like the concept, just a little uncomfortable with the number...
Just paraphrasing what Mecha-Lenin said to you in another thread.
As for the trade penalty I feel its okay as far as the amount reduced but the time is a bit high.
While it seems high both on time and acutal reduction, overall its not as overbearing as one might think. Usually trade get most of its bang from the trade chain. So, even if you reduce one or two planets by half its still only a slight drop in your overall income. Now, it can make a rather large difference if you are hit or hit someone who has a planet full of trade ports.
Even if its found out to be on the high side of things, I'd find that b/c its the only superweapon that does not directly effect your fleets performance, it needs that higher effect on what it does do well on. Ive said it many time before, I gladly trade its planet damage for some kind of fleet buff.
Oh I figured...it's all good
Not to mention Subverters are the way Vasari shut down fleets, and they're quite good at it. If the game lasts a long time you can then use Returning Armada together with Wreckage Auto-Salvage to fuel insta-armies: just add support cruisers.
Trade penalty duration for Novalith is ridiculous. Couldn't you eventually cripple an empire's entire trade network with a single cannon that way? And as if any TEC player only builds one if it's possible to fit more...
only lasts 30 min? i think? yes? so you could only reduce 5 planet's trade ouput with one cannon me thinks. 30 min effect, 6 min recharge., yes?
ya, your right. but it still demonstrate's sin's stacking.
Yeah, I double checked. The trade reduction doesn't stack. Its just a straight 50% reduction, no matter how many shots hit the planet. (Not 50%, 33%, 25% etc.)
And its not -100%, like the description implies. So it doesn't interrupt a trade line either. It is calcuated as 1/(1+x). I can verify that. But then I don't know why the population reduction isn't calculated in the same form - it makes the descriptions inconsistant. (BTW, I checked, the pop reduction doesn't stack either, and it is a straight 40% reduction).
And I should point out: the 30 minute penalties apply to whoever recolonizes the damaged planet! Freind or foe.
Good point Zombie, I was actually thinking you could just jump there without a phase gate present. I will edit and add mention of this as well.
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