[Disclaimer: Stardock does not endorse or support this mod. This thread has merely been stickied so users can more easily direct comments or questions to the authors of this popular modification.]
Some time ago the modding community started poking around in the TA tech trees to see why the AI was reluctant to develop certain techs. We found that some weapons techs were categorised as PD, instead of Military, meaning that unless missile weapons were deployed, those techs would never be researched by the AI. Obviously, an AI that can't fight back isn't much of a challenge.
The idea behind this mod was originally just to get the TA AI on the right track as far as weapons are concerned. However as suggestions have been put forward by the community, more improvements have been made to the tech trees. Some features have been driven by my own need to fix annoyances.
For example there is the AI's passion for spamming factories or labs onto every tile, crashing their early economy. These basic improvements would get upgraded and then cost the AI even more in terms of miantenance and production cost, forcing the AI to run inefficiently with the production slider at far less than 100%.
So my approach has been to deprive human and AI alike of early structures that can cause economic meltdown, and in their place have Super Projects which allow for some single-planet focus.
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Recent versions
v5G:
v6:
v6A:
v6B:
For obvious reasons, updates to the mod are on hiatus until the community update is completed.
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For download links of older versions, see here.
Inspection of their tech tree doesn't show any cause for it - maybe it is just a coincidence, but it's a pretty strange one if so. Some of the other races have preferences for certain weapons types (Torians and mass drivers, for instance), but only the Thalans have stuck to one exclusively.
I have uploaded a new version. After playtesting, I've realised that the module requirements for some of the new starbase modules are unnecessarily onerous. So in version 4E I have scaled those requirements back a notch e.g. from Battlestations II to just Battlestations.
I have also compiled a list of most of the new modules in the first post.
Had to update again to fix module requirements.
Come to think of it, I don't remember seeing the Thalans research anything other than beams either. Will check on recent games, but it actually seems to help them as for the most part I have to counter mass drivers or missiles, which most races seem to favour at the moment.
I reduced the costs of the Terran and Torian progression techs a little and they seem to be happier now. I think it has more to do with me not putting as many points into their research as I do with the Altarians rather than intrinsic problems with the tech trees, but it works for my games.
Tangentially related to other research issues, I'm pretty sure that the cause of the Korath doing badly is their research tree - specifically the step from slaveling labs to xeno labs. I put in a new research line with exactly equivalent buildings and research costs but which upgrade automatically, and combined with AI 8 and high aggression they now militarize and start conquering incredibly quickly without falling behind (I also gave them a research super project to help at higher levels, but they haven't yet made use of it). If they beat me again I may even put them back on AI 7 and super annihilator and see if they can play as intended.
Looking forward to trying out 4F, especially since it should make starbases a bit less vulnerable (holding resources has been very challenging since installing this mod, now that *everyone* is armed).
Yeah the whole idea of Technology Progression was to give the AI a reason to hang around and pick up some vital technologies at each stage, but reducing the cost may help them to not stagnate too much. Moving technologies to a later stage may also streamline things a bit. Unfortunately I just don't know until I give it a try. Part of the reason I have so many versions is so that I can revert back if I do something which leaves a race completely hamstrung.
The next version of the mod will have Core Technologies V and VI for the Terran tech tree.
Core Technologies V is simply Research Academies and Space Weapons, making those pre-requisites for Technology Progression II.
Core Technologies VI is Invention Matrix, Medium Scale Building and Superior Hulls, and therefore makes those pre-requisites for Technology Progression III.
The idea there is make sure that the Terrans have the ability to boost its research before exploring the relatively costly weapons tech trees, make sure that first tier weapon trees are unlocked before continuing to TP2, and make sure that even better research buildings and medium hulls are available before proceeding to TP3, because we wouldn't want to get into the trap of researching Phasors and yet only have Small hulls to mount them on.
I have some work to do on the Yor tech tree so version 4G won't be up today, but I thought I would let you know what's coming.
Okay well now that I've checked out their AI playing style, the Yor have that annoying tendency to do what other races do with basic improvements - spam them until their economy grinds to a halt. So I have limited the number of collectives they can put on one planet, and that seems to help a lot (better collectives can be placed on more tiles on one planet). I've also given them an intrinsic percentage bonus to industry, which is good because bonus production is paid for at half the usual rate. Their Research Matrix also gives an intrinsic percentage bonus to research.
I've also introduced them to Technology Progression and Core Technologies. The Yor Technology Progression research is much lighter compared to other races, as I've only drawn off 10% of the TPs from techs which come immediately after.
Basically, the Yor suffer quite a bit from colony rush crash. They're now getting out there and colonising quite a bit more of the galaxy, but when they do they're spreading their population out. They get just one morale building and it's one per planet. They get one economy building and it's one per planet. Ugh, not one planet with a green approval rating. So they definitely won't grow as fast as the other civs. However, they will be dominant in manufacturing once they get themselves set up. Which I think should be their thing, considering they're machines and all that.
So I have playtested with the usual Huge galaxy and at a little over two years in the Yor are neck and neck with the Altarians in terms of the colony grab, nabbing 41 colonies to their 38. For reference, the Torians managed a paltry 20, I got 42, and the other Terrans managed 32. Not bad going for a race which usually sits in the corner and glowers at everyone else.
Yeah I may need to tweak the Yor back a bit as they've gone nuts and started taking over the galaxy with the extra points in Economy on their tech tree. I think I will also tweak the military and social bonuses back too, it's a little bit overkill.
Second game, Yor still quite strong. I've made a few small adjustments but I could use some external feedback so I've posted a new version.
For the past two games I've had the Yor set to Terran personality, which may have something to do with their expanding across half the map.
I have a question about testing,
What are the setting you use for mod testing?
Galaxy Setup
Opponents
I have moved Miniaturisation and Logistics techs around in the Yor tech tree because at the moment they basically produce swarms of heavy fighters. I've also made some slight adjustments in the Terran tech tree so that hopefully they'll go Invention Matrix and Medium Scale Building, so they don't spam so many heavy fighters as well.
Haven't got around to playtesting it yet.
Yor are still kicking serious butt. They have the pre-requisites to start researching Medium Hulls, but I'm guessing that when Military ranking is really high, it's hard to get the AI to prioritise military techs.
So I will think about moving their manufacturing techs one step to the right, and maybe alter their starting weaponry as well.
Question:
Will I have to download every version to get the best results or is there one download that gives me every single update in one package?
Each version has a ZIP file with the full mod for that version, just extract to a mod folder, point GalCiv 2 at it and start a new game.
I've posted a new version this evening, 4H. It seems to balance out some of the issues with the Yor becoming all-powerful, but it could just be that they had a bad start in my first playtest. Any rate, they're still a force to contend with.
Ah new mod.
But my question is if I need to download ALL of the versions to get the entire mod working?
Nope. Each version contains the full set of files needed.
Right well, the Yor are now stubbornly refusing to develop along the line of technologies needed for more advanced stuff. It looks like I need to set a higher AI value for those techs.
Well, setting a higher AI value just doesn't seem to cut it. I have the feeling that the duration a tech must be researched for, as well as the category it is placed in, can override the AI value for a tech.
So what I have done is to streamline the early Yor tech tree even more. For example:
New Propulsion Techniques, Ion Drive: Junked. Stellar Streams costs less to research and gives access to a Stream Drive. (Available after Efficiency Studies III.)
Xeno Communications, Universal Translator, Diplomatic Relations: When they figure out how to plead for us to stop killing them, then it's worth our while figuring out what to say back. (These technologies will be available to research after Space Weapons.)
Basic Miniaturisation: Seriously?! We have such a headstart on the other races as far as Miniaturisation goes, we don't need to bother with this right away. (This technology will be available to research after Space Weapons.)
Biological Studies, Soil Enhancement: Yes we really want to study the fleshbags and how they abuse their planets, after we have a plan to eradicate them. (These technologies will be available to research after Space Weapons.)
Technology Progression I on the Yor tech tree costs a bit less to research now because some of the technologies it used to unlock are now available after Space Weapons. The downside is that it only really leads to Extreme Colonisation and Collective Academies, that's it.
There are a few improvements that could be made in the Terran tech tree as well. The Yor seem to be fine now, apart from the fact that they can't open negotiations with other races for a good while.
The second stage of extreme colonisation technologies is going to be split off from the first stage. This means that races which start with the first stage due to a Super Ability, or have a discounted first stage (Torians) won't have the second stage immediately available to research.
Now on the one hand, it does make it less profitable in the short term for those races to colonise worlds before anyone else. On the other hand, it does stop them from spending weeks on an expensive technology so early on in the game.
Okay, I've now got the colonisation techs sorted out and can get back to testing.
Oh yeah, another thing which has bugged me for a while. I've decreased the cost of building Banking Centers down to 90. This places it almost halfway between the cost of Trade Centres (70) and Stock Markets (120) instead of being almost twice as expensive to build as Stock Markets.
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