Hello friends old and new!
After a lengthy hiatus, I've come back around to enjoy some GalCiv2. While playtesting my Major Minors, I remembered a discussion in another forum about playing a game by democracy. It never went anywhere, but I thought I'd bring it up here. The basic concept is that I'd play a game and post reports, and the participants would discuss and vote on the course of action. The exact details and pace of the game are up for discussion.
I think it would be fun and I'd like to give it a try. Anybody else interested in such a thing?
Edit Oct 10, 2010: After some discussion, the game is on! A new topic has been made, so if you're interested you can find it here: https://forums.galciv2.com/398308
Sounds like an interesting concept... I might be interested in joining, and I'd certainly be interested in reading; your previous AARs were excellent.
I agree, you should. I'm not the best player, so my advice would be nothing special, but I would love to read it.
Thanks qrtxian! I've always wanted to put together another write-up. If this one takes off I think the game play might be slower, so maybe I'll work in a side game and a more traditional AAR.
NikolaiOmega - You'd be perfectly welcome to join if you like. I see this less about just coming up with the best strategy and more about taking the role of a guiding council - a galactic senate or circle of advisers. More what-should-we-do as opposed to how-exactly-should-we-do-it.
Make sense?
I've seen this work before (with Civilization rather than GalCiv II), I'd be interested to chime in! I guess we do need at least a few people following the thread and giving their opinion on what to do next
Great idea!
Good response so far. I'd definitely like to give it some time and see who else checks in. In the meantime, maybe we could toss some ideas around. This being a first attempt, the details need to be sorted. I'll toss out what I'm imagining to get things going.
Objective
Fun. To guide a civilization on a epic journey.
Galaxy Settings
- Custom Race (we/you can decide characteristics)
- Big Galaxy (Huge/Gigantic/Immense - you decide)
- Enough, but not too many planets (Just not all abundant. Would rather not manage 300 colonies.)
- No Super Abilities (Flexible if there's an uproar, but they've been bothering me and I'd like to turn them off)
- 8 custom minors (modded to colonize and act intelligently)
- 6-9 majors
- Tech speed slow-normal
- Victory conditions? (I usually play all except ascension)
Council Interaction
There are certain limitations on just how much control the council can have, based simply on practical constraints. I'm thinking that we'll set up the galaxy and custom race, decide generally what kind of civilization we'd like to have and what our long term goals are. After that, reports and discussion/voting come at regular intervals - say quarterly, with the quarterly report and UP meeting. Special sessions could be held to address emergent issues that would need a decision - say the outbreak of wars that might require council attention or a plea for peace during wartime.
As mentioned earlier, I'm envisioning a guiding council deciding things like ethics, direction, war and peace, and relations. Research would be a topic, though it may be more practical to dictate focus rather than every tech. Establishment of wonders, capitals, trade goods and the like would certainly be another set of issues. What I don't see is micromanaging such as voting on going all-factory or dictating exact tactics and fleet direction.
That's a basic outline for now. Nothing is set in stone, and I appreciate feedback.
thanks!
Provisional responses:
Race: Preferably doesn't use one of the more alien tech trees like Yor, Thalan, Iconian, etc. as I am not as familiar with them.
Immense galaxy, 9 AIs
All victory conditions but ascension (if it matters)
Council interaction: Agree with the suggestions made, but with two caveats:
1. I would prefer some input on tactics at the "grand strategic" level - for instance, figuring out where to prioritize in a two-front war
2. Add "game-changing mega events" to the list of emergency council settings (it's not mentioned but I assume they're enabled). The "super tourism" event can be ignored, for instance, but the Dread Lords shouldn't. I'd also include major 'normal' events such as the "PQ explosion" that makes many more planets habitable.
Also, I think ethics should also be a matter of general focus (like techs) rather then calling a meeting for every ethical event, as that could get quite tedious. Setting policies such as your decision in your Gaian Expedition AAR to always enslave the pre-industrial natives is what I'm thinking of.
Edit: Indifferent to SAs. I've never played without them as it makes the races less distinctive but in TOA that doesn't really matter.
Here's what I think.
- Custom Race- focused on research and economy, tech tree similar to Terran (would prefer a different one), Super Trader/Breeder/Diplomat/Hive if supers are used
- Immense Galaxy
- It can be difficult to obtain a perfect mix of planets, but try. I used Abundant Habitables, Uncommon Planets, Abundant Stars in my last game, and it was okay, maybe a few too many. Turn down the stars or habitables to common or something like that.
- Would prefer super abilities, I think they make the game better, but not a big deal.
- 8 custom minors (modded to colonize and act intelligently) sounds great, I would love watching them have a chance for once, but make sure they only colonize a small amount.
- 9 majors
- Tech speed normal
- Victory conditions- all except ascension
As for the other stuff, I agree with what's been said.
Sorry for the late reaction - the forum bug that doesn't show you that there have been new posts at a glance doesn't help, will keep that in mind for the future
- Custom Race: something close to the Terran tree would make sense, looking at the posts above. Altarian?Definitely focus on economy and at least some on research, to make our lives easier...
- Galaxy: no preference as I have more experience in anything up to large size
- Super Abilities: slightly in favour of using them but could definitely do without
- 8 custom minors (modded to colonize and act intelligently): Yes please!
- I would have gone with 6 majors but happy to agree with everyone who voted for 9
- Tech speed: normal
- Victory conditions: all except ascension
Further input: I too would like to be involved in discussing strategic matters or whenever there's a game-changing major event. I agree that ethics should be an overall direction (so up to you Tolmekian to stray from that general direction wherever you think it makes sense) mostly driven by the alignment we want to reach in the end as it's important for alliances and unique techs.
I want in. I came back to this foeums just for this, it sounds awesome,it sounds like an RP, and i love RPs.
ObjectiveFun. To guide a civilization on a epic journey.Galaxy Settings- Custom Race: Don't really care, i would like that some of the backstory of the race will be released one it has been decided upon. - Big Galaxy (Huge/Gigantic/Immense - Agree).- Enough, but not too many planets (Just not all abundant. Would rather not manage 300 colonies.) Agreee.- No Super Abilities - Don't really care.- 8 custom minors (modded to colonize and act intelligently) Yes.- 6-9 majors Six is best i think since we are going to have 8 minors that can colonize- Tech speed Slow is best in big maps.- Victory conditions? (I usually play all except ascension) Agreed. Council InteractionMicromanaging is out of the table i agree, i also agree with everything else said.
Also, i think we need to define what the council can do other than decide on whats happening now. Like putting forth a request to start or end a war even though thats not on the agenda.
Also Tolmekian as the prime minister or president should be given authority to veto an order, maybe he can only use it 3 times or something like that.
Glad to have you, LordCarlos! I like RP a bit myself, and I'm certainly open to the idea. I'll be doing a lot of in-character stuff with my reports and all and the council can join in as they like.
I think we're all on the same page for the most part. The council certainly has a say in strategy and everything else. My comments were directed at micromanaging, which we all agree is simply impractical. An update on what we've got:
Race - I'm thinking a kind of human, with the Terran tech tree. That's what I'm familiar with and seems to be preferred. It could be hard to get consensus on exact details. Should I make something up and show it? Well, I'll do it anyway. The council can always reject it.
Galaxy - I've been doing experimenting and I think I've got the settings. Any thoughts on extreme planets? I usually go frequent, but for these settings occasional might be best (level 2 of 3)
Super Abilities - Now I'm thinking of using them. Races are designed for them and it gives the majors one more bonus versus the minors.
Minors - I've been doing quite a bit of playtesting by using cheats and having the computer autoplay 3-6 years so I can observe how they act. I like what I see so far, but they may be a little robust - some of them outcolonize the lagging majors. Just a little more tweaking and they'll be great.
Majors - How bout 7 or 8? Minors should be suitably minor, but my tests do show some crowding.
Tech - Mixed feelings.
As for LordCarlos's wondering about what the council can do, I'd say anything you like. The council won't be restricted to decide only what I ask about or to give input only at the quarterly reports. You can request any info and I'll post it - or have one of my ministers do so for you. You can use the time between updates to have any discussions or put forth requests or call a vote if you like. I think an open environment in which the council has plenty of say would be most fun for you.
I do like the veto idea. Maybe it could be overridden or otherwise limited. I like to think I wouldn't wield it too often or too strongly, otherwise it could limit your involvement. Maybe it wouldn't work, but you can decide.
I think we're almost ready to move. We'll start the council with 4 members, but others are welcome to join. I'll drum up the custom race. If anyone has any last thoughts about the setup, now's the time.
On the topic of the veto, we can limit the number to vetos we can use for the whole game, that will help to avoid abuse of power.
On extreme planets i think that there should be some but not many, uncommon maybe, depending on how many habitable planets there will be. We need them just for the sake of some of the super abilities and starting techs, so that they don't become useless.
I vote 8 majors, pre-selected so that there are two of the alignment we plan to pursue and three of the other alignments, which should achieve a nice ethical balance for play. Randomized races would also be fine, though.
I would, to be frank, like to veto the veto as, while I may do my posts in-character, I'm not really interested in role-playing and wouldn't like suggestions vetoed just to fit the feel of being a cabinet member/imperial advisor. That said, as the man on the scene (as it were) Tolmekian should have the final say (unless there will actually be attached saves so the council can know exactly what is going on... not that I'm in favor of that idea).
Prefer extreme planets to be one level lower then habitable planets.
Edit: Also, vote for the Arcean tech tree for the custom race. I've wanted to try it out but have been intimidated by their speed penalty. If we go with a different tech tree, I won't object, though.
I don't like this veto thing. Tolmekian should be equal in power to everyone else when the council is in session.
I agree with qrtxian's balance idea for the majors.
Extreme planets should be a factor. We should have enough that being able to use them would be an advantage, not a waste of research, but not an insane amount like in the Gaian AAR.
Don't care too much about the tree, I'll leave that up to the others. I do, however suggest a Terran-like tree, as I'm sure more people are familiar with its structure.
Fair enough. We don't need any kind of veto thing. I couldn't imagine shooting down a council decision anyway. I'm pretty happy to do as I'm told, more or less. My input comes down to exactly how things get done.
I'm sold on the Arcean tech tree. It's pretty close to Terran, with some tweaks. I've only played Terran and Yor, so it'll be a nice change. Other than that, I'm getting ready to go. I got the minors set up, now it's time to get that custom race done. Probably post it tomorrow then we should be ready to start up. Oh yeah, I've got an idea for back story, so I'll get that ready, too.
The Tolmekian Federation
The Federation is comprised of several minor races which banded together to resist the growing influence and military might of their neighbors. The architects of the Federation, the Tolmekians, are an offshoot of humanity. Originally a colonial expedition, they suffered a systems failure when passing a wormhole during hyperspace travel. Out of control, they entered the wormhole and emerged into unknown space. It was all they could do to direct their ship to a nearby inhabitable planet and establish a base.
The Tolmekians found themselves in a difficult situation. Their damaged colony ship left them scrambling to maintain critical functions as they worked to regain their bearings. What they found was shocking. They were unable to locate earth or any familiar signals. Soon after, their exploration of the surrounding star systems showed signs of several unknown races. Alone and surrounded by aliens, the Tolmekians had become a second class power in a hostile galaxy.
They were not entirely helpless, though. As a mining expedition, they had sophisticated scanners and extraction equipment. Upon emerging from the wormhole, they were able to locate a resource rich world for their colony. Most of their mining and manufacturing equipment was undamaged, so they immediately went into action. While working to develop communications with the aliens, they were able to build up a small defensive fleet. Clever posturing and deception allowed the small fleet to keep larger powers at bay as the colony developed. When communication with aliens was possible, it revealed that the colonists had significant technological advantages in mining and manufacturing. Using that to their advantage, they pursued relations with other races and strengthened their position by establishing trade networks.
As the Tolmekians grew in wealth and influence, the mighty empires of the galaxy grew more and more aware of their true situation. Increasing pressure from their powerful neighbors set into motion events that would lead to the forging of the Federation and see it rise to prominence. Among the Tolmekian leadership was Temeculus, a skilled diplomat, shrewd negotiator, and visionary. Temeculus foresaw the inevitable fate of the Tolmekians – either establish themselves as an independent power or be absorbed by their expansionist neighbors. Knowing that they couldn’t hope to overcome their adversaries yet unwilling to surrender their future, Temeculus saw a third path.
To preserve their independence, he had begun nurturing relations with several other minor powers. Through trade, technological exchange, and cultural ties, he brought together those who were also living in the shadow of greater powers. When the time was right, he brought them together into alliance of mutual protection. In time, Temeculus saw his life’s work complete as the alliance became a federation with enough power not only to resist encroachment, but to lay claim to contested worlds and resources. The Federation itself bears his name, as Tolmekian is a derivation from Temeculus. It is only in retrospect that the first humans are also referred to as Tolmekians. The Federation prospered, eventually taking their place among the major powers and gaining a seat on the galactic council.
That was in the past. Our story is yet to be told.
The Kushana Initiative
Temeculus was elevated to a status of nobility – even royalty - among the humans, passing that status to his descendants, who continue to play a major role in Tolmekian politics. It is the descendants of Temeculus who drive our current story. It is a period of stagnation amongst the major galactic powers, with each trying to find some advantage over the others. The opportunity appears when a section of the galaxy long rendered inaccessible by dark energy storms suddenly calms. Scans reveal hundreds of habitable planets and multiple resources untouched and ripe for exploitation by any bold enough to claim them. The rewards seem to outweigh the risks as all gear up for a new race to the stars.
Among the Tolmekians, it is Princess Kushana who provides the impetus to send a force into the new space. Aware of the dangers, but also aware of the price of failure, she arranges to have her brother, Prince Temeculus the XIII, lead the way. The prince is young, bold, and skilled. Anything he lacks in experience is compensated by drawing together a council of advisors from the top echelons of the Federation. With all due haste the expedition is assembled and launched. Once again the Tolmekians find themselves in a contest that may determine the future of all races in the Federation.
And with that I present you the forces of the Kushana Initiave:
I spent points on the abilities that I thought best reflected Federation history. Economics is a no-brainer, and we had a request for research. Creativity and luck are what has kept the Tolmekians alive. Diplomacy could be higher, but I opted for the PQ bonus to make best use of what colonies we do get. I decided to go with Super Trader for a couple reasons. First, it fits the story. Second, it's a pretty simple SA to work with. I haven't played with anything other than Terran, Yor, and Custom races with Super Diplo or Isolationist, so I wanted to try something different but not too . . . alien.
Comments? Concerns? Ready to go?
Good i like it.
Edit: My keyboard is broken, i can't write much, i'm using on-screen keyboard.
I like the racial traits, color is also "neh" for me.
Glad to hear. I was editing it on the go, so you might go back and check the picture of the custom race if it wasn't up yet, and the last little part.
Good race! I always like it when the backstory has potential for entire works of fiction in its own right. I'm a little unclear why you aren't just using the Tolmekian Federation or simply the Federation as your race name. Trek aversion, perhaps? Also like the logo.
Certainly can't complain about the ability picks; with a total 50% economic bonus there should be no financial problems. Not sure where the 11 points of logistics are coming from, though. I didn't realize it was possible to customize logistics.
The only complaint of any nature I have is that the blue-orange ship color scheme is a little... meh. But this is totally subjective, feel free to keep it.
Agreement here as well, glad about the econ and research bonuses. Also a bit surprised by logistics but well... I still don't know what exactly luck influences though.
Great background story so far!
I don't mind the ship colors, though the purple robe of our racial portrait is a little suspicious
Thanks all.
Why Kushana Initiative? Dunno . . . it came to me as a possible name before the entire story formed in my head. I was working toward something different. Everyone has a federation or an alliance or a collective, so I thought "how about an initiative?" I worked it into the story and it stuck.
Colors? Well, after finishing the story and everything else I didn't have a lot of time to play with them. I think I like the blue/orange idea, but I will certainly see if I can liven it up a bit.
Logistics and miniaturization: I went into the raceconfigs and gave each race +5 logistics and +10 miniaturazation. Just felt like having better ships and bigger fleets. That and having to research 2 logistics techs just to fleet a pair of constructors was getting on my nerves.
Hey, he is a prince after all! I have nostalgia reasons to use that particular portrait. You'll see more as the game unfolds.
I think that's enough input for us to get going. I'll start up the game and post the intro as soon as I can. I'm thinking it would be best to start the actual game as a new topic and link to it in the the first and last posts in this topic. That way the story can start fresh and people won't have to scroll through a bunch of planning to enjoy the game. Also, the first post will be the intro, not some question.
I guess the new topic will be The Kushana Initiative, unless anyone objects.
I don't have a problem with anything. Looks great, especially the separate topics idea. Good work Tolmekian, let's see how this turns out!
Also, I'm linking to this awesome thread in case anyone hasn't read it. We will probably find it useful.
I'm eagerly waiting to start this.
I was wondering if I could Join up as well
yes but post your request on the actual thread dso that everyone can see you.
Hello all! I wanted to tell you all how much I'm enjoying reading this play-by-committee! I hope you don't mind me posting here, as I didn't want to clutter up the game thread. Thanks all!
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