Banks usually do actually. The thing about commercial software is that it's sold as a service, with a terms of service contract. The bank doesn't pay for the software at the point of purchase, like any other service they get to actually use it and then decide whether it's fit for purpose and pay up, or to dump it and not pay. Furthermore, if a bank does purchase it they usually take out a support contract which specifies what kind of time period they can expect any broken features to be fixed in and similar, which if broken means they can sue for breach of contract. So if they expect X and X is missing, they're likely to have you fixing X within a given timeframe part of the contract.

 Consumer off-the-shelf software likes to pretend it's a license but it's not legally recognised as such. So it gets through a loophole whereby it pretends it's a service, except you pay for it upfront and have no recourse if it's not fit for purpose, barring any protection which may be provided by whatever consumer laws apply to the sale. Which since most countries can't decide whether software is a service or a good, are usually few and far between.

Computer game software companies have learned that we customers will let them get away with 'release unfinished and fix later' to a much greater degree than customers of just about every other type of product.  The real blame is ours, as they wouldn't if we didn't let them.

The wii doesn't have an update system, so their games have to be pretty darn clean. It's intersitng that everyone always talks about 360 and PS3 as if they are the only consoles out there considering there are a heck of a lot more Wiis in homes than either of those two.

And toss in Darkfall Online and Warhammer Online.

That covers the past ~3 years.

The only game I didn't wait at least a month or 3 (or much much longer) for is Elemental.  My pre-order was based upon SD's reputation (and I've already mentioned here a few  times I blame myself, not SD, for my breaking my rule).  'Wait and see' has been my general policy for close to 10 years now.

The online games were released 'early' but getting a fast start is too important to wait, and for those, the fun of playing with friends and the value of an early start trumps waiting for a stable/'finished' game, so I consider them a separate category.

Is balance considered "fixing"?

Because SC2 has a balance patch due sometime. Most games have balance tweaking (especially strategy in either flavor, RT or TB). Does that mean the balance is currently off and so it needs to be "fixed". If we're saying games shouldn't be released and fixed later - does that mean they shouldn't need balance patches?

Well,

A large part of the reason is because while there's lots of wii's out there,  software sales don't reflect the numbers well.

The wii was a perfectly played novelty product,  it sold because of the wiimote,  not because of the games.  People were fascinated with the idea,  and wanted to try it.  Nintendo successfully fueled the whole thing by creating an artifical shortage.  The hardware is old,  the yields are high,  and they don't require cutting edge equipment to produce,  unlike Cell or PowerPC.

So nintendo sold a boatload of units to people who ended up enjoying the novelty and then shelving it.  Yup,  there's an obscene number of wii's out there,  but all reports have been that the sales don't reflect it.

Don't get me wrong,  I've the highest respect for Nintendo.  They took a product that absolutely should've been DOA,  and with one relatively small but innovative decision,  and good buisness sense,  they turned it into a runaway win.  The tech for the wiimote's been around for more than 10 years,  it's a lightgun and an accelerometer with an RF transmitter.  Dunno who said "Hey,  you know what we could do with this..." but he's not getting paid nearly what he's worth.

But that's why,  of course,  I'll also agree with you,  Nintendo does ship pretty bug-free products.

Indeed. The pre-order beta testers ended up mostly being used for engine testing (don't blame us for OOMs, though, most of the time we had very small maps and most of the times we were crashing too much due to other factors before coming close to OOMs once we could play bigger maps) and very broad mechanics testing. Certainly pretty much all the MP decisions were made without our input, and we only had a very brief time to play with MP in Beta 2, when there was also no game to play so we were basically testing connectivity and not gameplay. We were able to influence some broader mechanics (city building, city level-up options are the two big ones), but a lot of the gameplay stuff didn't come from us. In fact, we were complaining about the same magic stuff and the same tactical battle stuff as everyone is complaining about now as soon as those were made available to us.

I think it would be very beneficial for future betas to include a pure "gameplay" phase, where we get as complete a game as possible (both mechanics wise and content wise) so we can actually play it and give good, relevant gameplay feedback to make sure all the game aspects are actually fun on release.

It is very fair to say we did not have access to the full game until basically release.  This did suck, and it made it hard for any of us to comment  on the whole situation.  The fact of the matter though, is that phase is over now, nothing we can do about it.

The problem we have now is, basically info over load...so many ideas about how to fix combat/magic/you name it..I even saw a thread about the games graphics.  The hardest part I would think is now to wade through the stuff that is there and find the stuff that is good.

This also requires the Dev's to make decisions for themselves as well, which might not always be the same we make as a  group.

I'm new to the community and I rather like what I'm seeing. Rarely seen developers work so hard to improve something and admitting mistakes were made. Maybe I just missed all of the horrible posts (or I subconsiously avoid them).

I've bought more than one game that had some kind of default, and 0 support for weeks rendering it unplayable so I don't see how anyone can complain about Elemental with the efforts beeing made.

I really hope i overlooked some element of sarcasm in this post.   Mafia 2 is the perfect example of everything that is WRONG with gaming today.   While the story was good, the game play was incredibly short (<10 hours).   In addition, because the story was scripted, there was NO replay value (replaying missions to find wanted posters + playboy magazines does NOT constitute replayability).  You cant even save at even specific spots so as to create your own lasting content.  They cut out free ride mode (which was in the original) as well as additional content, and left the story hanging in order to shove DLC down peoples throats later.  Within 2 weeks of releasing a $50 game ($60 collectors edition), they have already released the first $10 DLC to milk gamers for even more cash.

For comparisons sake, despite the buggy first days, I've now played several full games of Elemental.  A few of these have surpassed the 10 hour mark on their own.   The game is just as re-playable now as it was on day 1 (I haven't even bothered to finish the campaign).   Stardock has promised additional game play changes and content which will all be free, and I know they will deliver.   On top of that, one of the 3 major expansions planned for the game a year or so down the road has already been gifted to all of us who purchased the game because of the buggy launch.  While I still think elemental has a long ways to go as good as MoM, Civ, or even Gal Civ 2, I believe it will get there.  It already has more value that most games on the market today, including the "Polished" mafia 2.

I completely disagree with this novelty idea. I've been listening to "real" gamers claim this bs since the console came out. The Wii spanks the other two consoles in almost every sales category, including having some of the highest rated and selling games that don't really move far annual from the charts, and I am not talking about Wii Sports, Wii Play or Wii fit which all can ship with hardware.  I am so sick of this it's not a a real console. Yeah, tell that to the millions upon millions of gamers who have the system.

Anyway, it's not just Nintendo. The Wii is really not designed to accept updates and barely does DLC for the games that have DLC (Music titles for example). So all i's games have to be damn near perfect in terms of technicality. It certainly doesn't prevent shovelware which are generally bug free too just crap to play. And the one game I know shipped with a critical bug, well the publisher shipped replacement discs to everyone for free. But don't try to sell me it's a novelty, because I am not buying. Nintendo often has several top spots in NPD top sales every... single... month.

The point is, the gaming industry can be pushed not to ship their buggy ass barely working products in this era, here in now. They don't have a choice when it comes to the Wii.

With release, even up to 1.06, I couldn't get to turn 200 without significant OOM issues.  Even 1.07 is worse than the beta test games for this.

Whether it was adding new features, or changing old features, or something else, OOM issues were greatly increased in release for me, and judging from forum posts, for many/most(?) others.