Money has been tight lately, as most of you can probably understand in our current economic climate. Having always been a TBS fan, I had to make a decision as to which game I would buy this fall. I've been anticipating Civilization 5 and Elemental for quite some time, but I had to go with the latter, and I still don't regret it.
I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm getting pretty tired of the Civilization series. It's starting to remind me of Madden: Release the same game, add a few features, and call it the best thing since sliced bread. I've played every one of them, and every spin off since Civ 1 and the whole tour through history bit is getting a bit long in the tooth for me.
So I'm left with Elemental, which kind of feels like the old pick-up truck your dad gave you. It doesn't exactly run all that great, needs a new set of...well, everything, and doesn't impress your friends all that much. So would I rather take the old pick-up truck that can potentially take me to places I've never been before, or do I stick with Civilization, my shiny ten-speed that's always been safe and reliable my whole life?
I've read all the reviews, seen all the crap hit the fan, and even felt a bit of disappointment in the past few weeks. However, there's something about this game that just gets me excited, something unique, and something I don't feel very often with games. Even with all of the bugs and problems this game has, it has something special that I can't quite explain. With Stardock's commitment to improve things, I am giddy with anticipation as to where we will be led in the next few months and years. It's expecting the unexpected with Elemental that is holding my interest. It's hoping that perhaps one day Elemental will defy it's launch in a way that we have never seen before.
I'm sure that Civilization 5 will get reviewed really well, I'm sure it will be everything that everyone has hoped it would be. I'm sure it will be polished, stable, and relatively bug-free. I'm sure, at the core of it all, it will still feel like the Civilization we've grown to love. Unfortunately, this is where I become bored. I'll take the old pickup-truck, but I'm not sure why.
Perhaps Trinity had the answer: Because you have been down there Neo, you know that road, you know exactly where it ends. And I know that's not where you want to be.
I like the way you describe all of this other then I don't think I could get tired of the Civ series. I have the same problem at the moment as far as which game to buy sorry to say the only "true" solution is to buy them both. I have played Elemental off and on at my friend's house, it is an extremely fun game as I said many of times on here. I been holding off on my own copy of Elemental because of Civ V being around the corner and playing Making History II. From the reviews I read, Civ V is a true work of excellence and surpasses even Civ 4! For me its a matter of which one to buy first. This is only a problem at the moment because within a few weeks I will have both of them anyway. Probably what will happen to you, you will end up buying them both anyway so maybe you should just get it over with now and do what you can to buy them both. If funds are tight, I suggest selling some old games you are not playing on ebay and put that towards one of these. Its not very often that awesome games like this come out. So far we had Starcraft 2, Elemental, and tomorrow Civ V, thats gaming heaven if you ask me. I am choosing Civ V for now simply because I am more of a history guy instead of a fantasy guy, although I do like the fantasy stuff a lot too. In the end, its more of a time issue then a funds issue for me. If I buy both now I will be overwhelmed with the sad saying "too many games, too little time" and I absolutely HATE that. In the end, neither game is going anywhere and will always be in stock (surely digital at least) if you can't decide.
I also picked (and pre-ordered) Elemental over Civilization 5 deciding that's where I'd prefer to invest my TBS energy (and money). However, while I love the *idea* of Elemental, the reality unfortunately fell short by such a HUGE margin that it just isn't that much fun at this point.
I haven't tried to return my copy as I also hold out the hope that eventually it will grow into the game we all want it to be. But, in all honesty, it is nowhere near that point right now. So, it goes on the bad-game-buying decision pile right now and I'll check back in 9-12 months and see if they've been able to recapture their vision and pour some of the same magic they put into GalCiv2 back into it.
But, in the meantime, I'm very excited about Civ5!!! Particularly the hexes (I know you hate them Brad but I love 'em and improved combat. To me it looks like Civ polished to (near) perfection. I guess I'll find out tomorrow with the rest.
Best of luck Stardock! Take your time to get it right and I'll be back...
Actually, in the library games list of the steam app, you can right-click on the game in the list and go to the properties dialog, pick the updates tab, then select "Do not automatically update this game". No more automatic updates for the game.
That doesn't circumvent the compulsory updates when online, sadly. If you try to launch the application it will attempt to update and will not load until updated. The workaround is apparently unchecking the box and running Steam in offline mode. That is hardly transparent to normal users. Still, at least it's possible.
I was just over at the civfanatics forum to see what's going on, i will warn you now, don't say anything negative about Steam on that forum! They are surprisingly nasty about it as well, too many people that haven't been taught any good forum maners, but i just ignore those ones and only respond to the reasonable posts.
Well if you think they are mean. Don't ever go to Apolyton, I don't think your sensitive little soul could handle it. lol....
You make me smile though, so that means I don't want to kill you. Rejoice!
Rather perplexed with the discussion of "I am choosing this instead of that". Is this something driven by the modern MMORG culture of games (rally around the cult?)
In the ancient days (80s/early 90s) there were actually multiple good games on the market at the same time for strategy, we are seeing a repeat of that rare period (been awhile)
Even back in those days as a poor grad student I would have found the money to buy both Elemental and Civ 5. Now I see it as no brainer, personally I have seen completely different game play with each CIV release (CIV 2 still my favorite), be interesting to see what new wrinkles they have added. Wish Elemental was more polished but still worth playing
We all know that nothing can beat the official WoW forums [because it's full with fanbois, haters, whiners, retards, braggers, rocket scientists, alcoholics, drug addicts, kids, grandpas etc.] so.......
Civ5 today. I seriously can not imagine anyone, at this point, having chosen Elemental over Civ5 (as an either-or proposition especially) and feeling good about that choice.
And the demo for Civ5 is already up so you can choose if you like it with an informed opinion.
Seeing all kinds of exciting problems and crashes on civfanatics. I especialy like the 1 gb day zero patch.
Nah, Civ 5 is a better game. Don't be such a fanboy.
The players actually able to play the game are playing it and not on forums. 12,000+ playing right now ( http://store.steampowered.com/stats/ ), despite it being a workday. I only got half an hour this morning before I had to head to work.
The 1GB "0 day patch" is only for people who have the deluxe edition, and is the deluxe edition content.
Of Elemental.
Hey, next time you lurk outside my windows, don't forget to pick up the trash you left behind.
.....argh not this fanboy - hater stuff again...just drop the topic already.
Got it now, its 10,000x the game Elemental wishes it could pretend to be. CIV V is very polished and the presentation is off the charts.
Multiplayer works outta da box (You can even include AI in your MP games) badda bing beijing
Why don't people have room for two really good games? I do.
Exactly. However some people may not have the money for both. My cousin only wants civ 5 for example. He wont buy Elemental because he doesnt want to buy both games. Instead he would rather search through craigslist and buy 100s of dollars of Star Wars toys. Priorities. Different strokes for different folks.
Anyway I wrote my impressions in this thread here if anyone is interested. Note I am also a fan of Elemental as well.
https://forums.elementalgame.com/384552/page/10/#2782196
I'll just copy/paste my impressions and add a couple more:
I just played the demo, and I don't think I can go from Civ4 BtS to Civ5: it just feels like I'm losing a lot, especially in complexity. No, Civ5 isn't quite CivRev (which I hated), but it is definitely dumbed-down in my opinion.
No city health management, automatic "no-rush" game mode by having cities with their own defense stat (it's a freakin chore just to take down this city-state; I don't mean hard, but just boring and drawn out, and cities getting ranged combat automatically is BS. They hit you on their turn, then hit again with a unit, and then when you attack the city you get hit AGAIN), I don't find hexes all that more interesting (and I have played hex wargames like Blitzkrieg and A&A: Minis and Battletech). The leader screen is nice, but I don't care about graphics that much. The default graphic settings the game recommended for me don't look that much better than Civ4 anyway, so my current setup doesn't give me more graphics power. So many less civs and leaders, less choices in terms of government and religion (or fake choices: once you start getting a certain Social Policy, you're gonna get all of them eventually because it seems too expensive to switch to its anti-thesis. I like to customize my empire for the moment with Civics and not be strung into one).
Oh, one of the worst changes was the music (oddly enough). In Civ4, the music fit the time period. Now, it is all Rhapsody in Blue style music (can't remember the name of the genre...late Romantic maybe?). And I enjoyed when I zoomed in on my cities that it played Civ2 style music.
So, in my mind, the odd-numbered Civilizations are not as good (3 and 5) while I love 2 and 4. Civ4 was a breath of fresh air in the market at the time, but Civ5 is just kinda a letdown. I'll save my money for Fallout: New Vegas or maybe get a boardgame.
I couldn't tell: is happiness now a global statistic? I saw it at the top of the main screen but not the city screen. Some people think the interface is cleaner, but I don't like it so far. Forcing you to click on Next Research and Production and Units before ending the turn is nice, though.
As a disclaimer, I don't play ANY TBS for its multiplayer, that's what my RTS's are for, so I don't care about multiplayer functionality.
ColonelFlagg:
Interesting comments. I got that same impression from several reviews despite the fact that the reviewers were eager to gloss over the game's shortcomings and slap a 9.5 on it anyway. The general consensus is that there are fewer options for shaping and guiding your civilization ("dumbed down" is a phrase I'm seeing a lot in the forums), not to mention fewer civilizations out of the box compared to earlier games. The message boards have been an interesting read, too, with people complaining about instability and performance issues.
I point all this out not to disparage Civ 5 but to simply note the double standard between the treatment of Civ 5 and Elemental. Civ 5 is being defined by its strengths in the gaming community while Elemental has been defined by its weaknesses, which I think is grossly unfair to Stardock. This serves to strengthen my theory that if all other things were equal, Elemental would have gotten a much better reception if it had been called "Sid Meier's Elemental: War of Magic".
It is not me who is sensitive - it seems the Steam issue is a very 'sensitive' thing for them!
If anything, i am lazy, not sensitive - too lazy to respond to such simplistic offenses. Sometimes if i am in the mood i will respond or if the offending post seems cunning and is therefore a worthy challenge!
Apolyton? Haven't been there for a while, but certainly don't recall any problem?
If Elemental were a good or even passably decent game, I'd have time for both.
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