Unless one go quickly for the victory (like conquest) on tiny map, the late game is very bad. There are 2 problems
1) Technical problem - the game just become VERY slow. I have good computer, I do not think it should slow down like that. More over, it seems that it just hits some kind of barrier, like in 20 turns around turn 150 it converts from OK to run game, to nearly impossible to run.
2) Late game mechanics. When you kingdom is big, it becomes just way too tiresome to play. I am talking about constant attacks of caravans that require clean up forces EVERYWHERE. And if you have a war and some quests on your hands, the whole game becomes just too much. It is TOO much going on, too many UNINTERESTING things to do. (train unit, train pioneer, do not forget about those, send them together, oh no - to many monsters, find another unit go clean the aria, found the sity, build up the city, reapeat, while at the same time, protect the caravans from monsters from every directions, train inits, build buildings in your 10 or so cites, it becomes really uninteresting, cumbersome with no interesting decisions to make.)
I think one big help could have been, if monsters would not be able to enter your territory at all! Like in civ games. Also, their amount must be reduced. Also, teleport spell must be cheaper, and/or, there should be away to prevent spent mana in auto combat so that it goes below some amount that you can specify. There may be another teleport spell require research, so it is like level 4 spell, that let you teleport to any place where you do not have FOV. So you could teleport and protect pioneer. More over, heroes should be able to teleport as well, not just your main.
There must be also some kind of mechanism to prevent building so many cites. Even when you conquer new ones, you should be able to destroy city because it is too hard to maintain or something. Because maintaining 10+ cities is ugly. Or there may be another way... like making possible to build just ONE city building of ANY kind (may be excluding housing) per WHOLE KINGDOM. No monastery in every city! Or there may be some mechanism, like doubling the price of building if it is build in second city, tripling for third, and so on...
I want a unit with guns.
I actually find late game micro management a problem in most 4X games. That's why sometimes I'll quit and start a new game, I find the early and mid game more interesting...
You can raze cities by hitting "x" when the city is selected.
While I can, right now there is no reason for this to do - it is always beneficial to have it.
Yes, but I think it is especially bad in this game, due to all those monsters, and absence of ANY negative aspect to grow. In civ there is corruption and city maintenance, there is nothing like this in this game.
Mmm my initial enthusiasm for the game is waning too. I agree with the comment about the late gameplay, but overall I am now finding the whole game pretty ordinary. Everything is just dull and uninteresting...there is nothing that makes you want to keep playing or even coming back to it.
Overall it is a sound game, with some technical hitches, it just lacks that certain something. Like watching a black and white movie compared to a colour one.
There are administration costs that raise with the number of cities, but so far they are fairly low.
Lol.
I had the same problem and it mades me quit my game.
I dont know why but actually i find a'bit' less lag in my game... maybe my computer gets used to it
But i have to agree that passed some point you have way too many creeps all over, and very powerfull ones.I think next game, if i actually am in the mood to start a new one... i will try to empower some heroes with magic so i can make a least 2 or 3 armies to be on the edge on different places.But you see, the big problem is that i dont find it very appealing since finally it will be having armies to roll over the AIs standing up in the game at this point and dont even have interest in the towns i would gain just rampaging through the land to annihilate them.
I mean when you have developped your cities its not interesting to get new ones (only use is to get a TP point).I would just take cities and erase them from the land if i could so i wouldn't have to protect them or even have to care about them.That's problematic because what's the fun in that...)
That's where led me my last game and i have to admit that now i am frustrated because at the time i dont find the little 'plus' appealing that makes me want to start a new game.Maybe with some more content, looking for magical stuff, new units to get in my army etc .. it would be fun to at least continue the game, but now, just fighting some spiders, bandits, etc without even getting some interesting loot (that would be in fact a good motivation that lacks in the game = loot !,call me a lootwhore, but loot is always a good engine !).
As stated a huge number of times but i will again, the reference to MoM (even if i know it's not the same game...), in this game, i liked the fact that fun heroes would come to me and that i could craft my own magic stuff with different properties i could try on the battlefield etc... that was a good part of the game i enjoyed.
Well at the present time it's too repetitive to have interest in the last stage of the game.I was surprised to wait for the last quest of mastery just to end the game.I have faith in the develloppement of the game, even if it's decreasing i have to admit because there are too many things to improve.I am not a fan of multiplayer game so that part doesnt bother me,the map generator doesnt bother neother for the time being, because first i would like an appealing game with content that make me think in the morning when i have time 'woot i have will launch a new game and have fun'.
I know it's not very constructive post, and sorry for the english because i am french , but i just wanted to talk about the feelings i have inside.
Thanks you had the courage to read it .
Regards.
I find the monster populations to be too numerous. That's my only real problem with the late game micro stuff. Cities grow very slowly after level 3, they don't need that much management. What becomes a problem is managing the 10 different units you have out in the world, and constantly scanning for new monster spawns showing up RIGHT next to caravans. Every 5 turns or so, a glance for new monsters should be enough. It seems now though that every 5 turns, you have an entire new incursion to deal with. And any area you clear for monsters will be full again 15 turns later.
I like having each turn take a certain amount concentration to make sure you've addressed everything though. Having a million things to pay attention to, and a million cities to manage, is part and parcel of all 4x games, and especially Stardock games. Elemental late game plays very similar to Gal Civ 2.
Maybe we should be able to have squad put on automatic escort of the caravans ?
managing 40+ cities is fun, and wow it lags like hell even in cloth map view
I'm just going to throw out -- and this isn't intending to sound derisive -- if you're having to protect your caravans often, either one of two things is going on:
1. Mobs are spawning inside your borders, which they're not supposed to do
or:
2. You're not expanding cleanly. In my games, the slowdown late game is the only real bothersome thing, my borders encompass everything that can be moved to, so I just have to send one person through to clean up the mobs in the borders once, then move them to the edge and keep mobs out, not protect the caravans because the caravans never go anywhere dangerous.
I don't trade with the AI much. So I guess that could be number 3.
Addendum. This is a really good idea.
'Mobs are spawning inside your borders, which they're not supposed to do' (damn i dont know how to quote )
I dont think they spawn in my territory, they just come by the edge of my territory and sometimes attack caravans i sent to AI cities.
The best way within currently gameplay to deal with ridiculous quantities of random creeps is to just keep expanding your borders, since monsters will not spawn inside of "civilized" territory. Yes, this means yet more towns that you don't care about, but it's possible to completely shut them out of your lands. It's quite possible, if tiresome, to expand your way to making monsters extinct. Strategic use of Town Halls to expand your city radii helps with this strategy.
Another good way to keep your lands free of encroaching nasties is to just seal yourself off - creative use of Raise Mountain, as well as strategic city borders (walls) can turn monsters into a mild nuisance at best. WTB some way to sink land into sea other than Flood.
Edit : The "I want to send caravans through the untamed hellhole wilds" problem could be solved by having watch towers that you could garrison, which would defend any undefended resources/caravans in their radius. That would actually be pretty cool. To me the whole issue is that it's obnoxious to go manually defend things, it's not so bad if it happens automatically.
My only problem with using your SoI to keep your caravans safe is that you have to start blobbing cities across the map, which I hate. There should be a happy medium between having your caravans at risk but not having to dedicate so much time, and resources, to keeping them safe.
i dont bother with caravans anymore roads help the enemy more than me
Good point i even forgot the raise mountains thing ! Thx man.
As for expanding enough, some times you have a little place (i had last game) between your control zone and the see, and you cant block it because you can't create a new city,too close to your own ones.
Well with raise mountains it wouldnt bother me anymore thanks again
Thats my only issue with the game.. the lategame slows down alot. But I hear they are working on a fix (;
EWOM definitely needs either something to curb too many cities, or a strong incentive or bonus to develop just a few cities to a large size...
Could really use a City management screen that list all citys there stats, Building and Training. with a mini map so I can see where they are.. If there is one I have yet to find it.
The problem with too few cities would be that new ressources only pop in your ZOC if you reseach the tech,plus quests too.That's a major problem.
This is so dead on, very good OP. Brad & company, please read this post!
WOW!
Major dicrovery for me!
Same woot ! I discover new stuff every day
Thanks.
(just a question: does it destroy contructible tiles near the previous city like when some raze one of you cities ?)
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