I am really enjoying Elemental. However I feel it needs some more work. It just feels like I have to make too many concessions each game and am not really challenged. Also, the simplicity of the tactical battles was a HUGE dispointment and really kills my desire to start a fresh game... I like indie devs, and support this game as well as Darkfall, just so we can have more variety and push the quality of AAA games. I feel like their hands were tied as far as release date and its either support them or see 5 major studios release all of our content.
Anyways, I keep hearing people mention other RTS games like dominion and MoM etc. I would be interested in trying a new game while I wait for Elemental to get polished. One game that seems similar is HOMM5. I REALLY liked the tactical combat, but the overmap and strategy elements fell flat. Can anyone recommend any other games to try, hopefully one that is still rather recent (past 5 years Id say).
Thanks for any suggestions!
Oh, also has anyone heard the extent of mods? Could we put something as complex as HOMM tactical battles into Elemtental? How about have dungeons actually load up dungeons that are REALLY long tactical battle maps...
The story of 1 is summarised in II, but apart from the different plot the only changes I believe are some optional difficulty tweaks - you can have items degrade over time, require food and drink to survive and similar.
You might also want to check out the Spiderweb Software series of RPG's, they're turn based too. Avernum is entirely turn and party based, Geneforge has a rather unique background and is real time with turn based battles. Avernum 5 and Geneforge 4 are currently on sale at Gamer's Gate (it's the last day though so hurry) and well worth it imho.
Wow, thanks for that bro! I actually got started with book1. I made a paladin type of character. Hes got div magic for buffs, but still swings a sword. Hes also got lock picking... odd for a pally... The guide on the forums there said fighters should go full on end. but Ima switch it up and gets strength and speed too.
I'm looking at Avernum right now too. My absolute, hands down, all time favorite games are turn based party rpgs. I'd given up on them and these games remind me of what I like in those games. I find it odd that I didn't like dragon age more. Seems awesome but I just get bored so quickly. Now Baldur's Gate.. now there is game. BG2 and throne of ball are my favorite games, the battles were so intense, and there was so much tactics. Formations actually really mattered and the magic was fun as hell. I really hope avernum hits that same spot. Do you have any recommendations on an entry point into that game? 6 is the latest. But if the graphics and production vaules are conistent the whole way thru, Id skip back a chapter like I did w/ aschalon.
Thanks for the input, its good to know the community here has its head in the right place.
King of Dragon Pass... nearly impossible to find these days, though.
Playing Avernum 6 right now. Its a VERY good game. There is a lot of reading, which is actually good because it doesn't suck. And they actually used a spell checker. I really suggest people try avernum. I went with 6 since it gives a fully open game window with the interface as an overlay. It also runs at numerous resolutions.
Elemental needs to take this game and have it be their tactical battle window.
[quote DOMINIONS III is ok also and I'd say it probably has the most robust magic system but the combat engine is pretty boring. No hands on ability and that's no fun to me.[/quote]
Boring? lol I never found the battles for dominions 3 to be boring, nothing like watching 30 battle mages call down thunder and lightning all over the battle field decimating the enemy army, extra crispy. or watch the horde of undead struggling to advance toward your army through a battle field of mud while your priests spam banishes and your mages brakes their bones... So many things to try, it never really gets boring.
If you want a strong accent on RPG elements and tactical battles, then AoW SM with mandatory BNW 3.2 Mod is the best Fantasy TBS out there. This mod is as important for AoW as FFH2 is for Civ 4.
On the other hand if you are rather looking toward empire-building game in fantasy settings, then FFH2 is top notch.
Haven't played avernum, but first three games in series are remakes of Exile series (same developer), so I can comment on them. Exile 3 was amazing, it featured vast open world, decent main storyline, tons of sidequests and plenty of secrets that awarded exploration. Exile 1 and 2 were actually very similar games, but with worse interface, that made playing them a pain in the ass. I'm guessing they fixed that in Avernum games, so it's probably not an issue anymore. All games also had plenty of puzzles, which I always liked in rpgs. In any case, if you're fan of rpgs, avernum 1-3 should be pretty decent games.
Thank god I'm not the only oldtimer around that knew Warlords
If I say it was BORING it was BORING. I don't care what your opinion of it is I'm discussing MY OPINION of it and the combat is BORING! ) Since it is BORING that moves it WAAAAYYYYY down on my list of best fantasy games. Now go back to your tinker toys and candyland. )
Oh you might want to check out "Sword of Aragon" by SSI too. I had forgotten how good that fantasy rpg wargame was. Sadly it's a wargame story and everything pretty much plays out the same each time through it. But, i does have some random battles from random creatures while you're playing the main plot just to keep you on your toes protecting your homeland and rear properties. Since you can start out playing I think 5 different character types Barbarian, Knight, Ranger, Cleric and Wizard it's good for at least 5 run throughs over the years. The Amiga 500 version is much better than the PC version though. Much more colorful and much better sound effects. It was actually this game that got me to buy an Amiga 500 because they weren't going to port it to the Commodore 64.
Dominions 3 graphics are.........bad imo, BUT the gameplay is what makes people play it for a looong time, bought it last year and just the printed manual was worth the money the game cost, I mean a manual on paper...294 pages....I mean just like the old days, but sadly not played the game so much, but just what I have seen so far is making promise myself going back to play it more.
i just hate a thing about king's bounty and heroes of might and magic 3
heroes are outside the fight (except for giving tacticals advanteges and launching spells...)
I think they changed that in HOMM V Raruto.
Gfx doesn't matter for a true strategy gamer. The only problem with Doms3 is the extremely bad AI, but it was supposed to be an MP game anyway..
Only briefly. Heroes interact more in battle, but they are still out of it.
And yes, Kings Bounty would be perfect if they would have found a way to place heroes in battle.
The game that was very promising, but unfortunately didn't succeed due to budget constraints was Heroes 4. But this is a story of what could be that never will be...
Dominions 3 multi-player probably will take days to finish :/
The bad thing about that game is the UI which is utter crap and makes micromanagement pretty hellish. This is especially true if you work with blood magic. =/
FFH is good though.
It seems that, despite hearing people mentioning MoM, you still haven't played it.
Just do it. Honestly, despite its age, it's still by far the best of its kind. Nothing comes even close to it. It HAS flaws (very unbalanced mainly, but also very bad diplomacy), but the good is so much more than the bad that it still is more than worthwhile.
It is purely unbelievable how much they could put into a game. It's like they thought about every single things they could imagine in a fantasy setting and managed to put it into the game. Magic, monsters, artifacts, standard units, heroes, races, buildings, magical roads, alternate world, really awesome global enchantments... The variety is astounding, especially for something that is, when you think about it, 16 years old. And the immersion level is very high, the whole interface sets the mood and plenty of little things keeps you immersed in the world of the game.
It's even quite depressing to see that nothing has been able to top it in such a long time.
On top of that, it's rather easy to make it run on Windows, unlike many other DOS games, so...
Well people have already listed most of them. I have not played DOM but have heard bad things about it.
For me the best Fantasy TBS is by far AOW:SM. But I wouls also like to add the original AOW as well.
Elven Legacy Tactical combat is good but it is not an Empire building game inless they have released update to allow it. I just have the original. Basically you just go through a linial campaign (which I don't really care for.) No Sandbox play at all.
Which of these games do not have interactive (tactical combat)? It sounds like only Domions 3 but wanted to check. Of the ones mentioned wizardry 8, aow sm and kb l/ap are great. Homm is a bit dated (but I enjoyed 3 - hated 5 as simplistic and boring). Wizadry 8, Avernum and Eschlon book 2 (not like rogue since the map is static with a fixed story) are more traditional story rpg games.
Anyways (not really related) but with the 1.06 patch I'm getting a lot of ctd mostly during combat (I have nvidia graphic card).
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I actually picked up Avernun 6 yesterday. GamersGate had an offer for Avernum 5 (60% off, cost about 7 Euro) and I figured I'd get the latest version together with it. Haven't played much yet, but I used to be a huge fan of the Exile series back in the CompuServe days, and the Avernum games seem to play the same way. Takes a bit of time to get used to more simplistic 2D graphics again, since I've gotten used to state of the art visuals, but looking at how long it's been that I played a RPG with a story that actually "grabbed" and interested me, it's fairly obvious that stunning graphics alone just don't make for a good experience.
As for Fantasy TBS, I'd definitely recommend the two King's Bounty games. KB: The Legend is fairly inexpensive now and a little easier than Armored Princess, though the latter has some nice convenience features (less backtracking) and perhaps a better story. There's also KB: Crossworlds coming out in 2-3 weeks, which is an expansion set for Armored Princess. These games are lighter than Elemental, but I find them extremely playable and highly addictive.
A little deeper, and still tactical, are Fantasy Wars and its sequel Elven Legacy. I'd definitely get FW first, which is pretty much a more modern version of Fantasy General. Both titles have a higher difficulty than what most gamers today are used to, especially Eleven Legacy. They are also very pretty. The AI isn't the greatest, but the scripting is superb, so it th e computer opponent seems quite intelligent.
AoW2:SM is a classic, and probably my favourite fantasy TBS so far. Someonealso mentioned the Kohan series, which is probably the only "actual" RTS series that I truly enjoyed. Not nearly as twitchy as the typical RTS titles. Kohan: AG is the best of the three games. Also already mentioned was the open source game Battle for Wesnoth, which includes a ton of content, receives updates every so often and has a vivid community. Good AIs.
I'm intruiged. I've played the original AoW:SM but I can't imagine how a mod could make as much of a difference to AoW as FFH2 did to CIV4. I tried to find some descriptions of it but the stuff I found only mention that it makes heroes more important and battles harder. Can you give me a short summary of the changes? Thanks.
I honestly don't see MOM ever being remade with newer graphic at this point. The complexity of it is just immense and trying to recreate this whole thing for newer systems would be a very risky proposal, outside of the budget of most people. I think our best chance at this point would be a Free Software remake that stayed as true to the ideal as possible. Something like FreeOrion and UFO:AI
Does Dominions 3 have tactical combat?
I've gone back to HOMM 3 and Dominions 3 until Elemental gets a few more patches. Dominions 3 is an amazing game if you've never played it. Obviously there is a demo so check if it's your style before you buy. There are no tactical battles. Basically, you give orders to your troops and they automatically duke it out. You can watch the battles and it can be pretty fun to do so. Giant battles between undead and huge gorilla men anyone?
It's definitely a deep and complex strategy game. There are many playstyles and a ton of races and pretenders(the equivalent of sovereigns) to choose from. These include a giant kraken, a lich or a stone monolith!
The players' control of tactical battles is limited to preparation. More infos.
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