UFO's and Aliens. Do they exist? Do you think there's even a chance that there is other intelligent life in our galaxy or universe or do you think we Humans are the only intelligent life in all of creation? These are questions that we as a species, man-kind, have asked since as far as our recorded history goes back. Even Ancient man, with no knowledge of modern science or modern understanding of what "Space" was, would look to the night sky at the twinkling stars and wonder...."Are we truly alone?".
Honestly, I've always thought aliens existed. Whether or not they've actually visited this planet at any point in it's history I don't know and I don't think anyone can truly say one way or the other and have definitive proof. Of course there is probably just as much "proof" that aliens don't exist as there is that they do, but, at least we are now discovering for a Fact that there is or was "some form" of life in the universe outside of the planet Earth. We know from microscopic fossils in martian rocks that at one point millions of years ago there was at the very least Single Celled life on Mars. We found this out back in the late 90's. Didn't hear about it? That's not surprising since I only found out about it because of a 10 second mention on ABC's "World News Tonight" back in 96-97. Today how-ever you can research this for your-self as many papers and articles have been published on the subject. A quick Google Search will lead you to many results such as these:
Meteorite Yields Evidence of Primitive Life on Early Mars Source: www.solarviews.com Article from 1997
Fossil Life in Martian Rock Found in Antarctica ? Source: http://spider.seds.org/spider/Mars/Marsrock/marsrocks.html Article from 1996
Proof of Life in Three Martian Rocks May Come This Year Source: www.popsci.com Article from 2010
This is enough in my eyes to call it "Definitive Proof", they're just waiting on the specific results so they can say it's a fact without a shadow of a doubt, and I respect them for waiting and taking it slow and doing the science the right way. A claim such as this can't be rushed no matter how apparent the results of any "proof" might be.
While I do believe in intelligent life outside of this planet, I'm still a skeptic. I mostly believe in what I can see with my own eyes. What I can feel with my own two hands. I think it's important for anyone doing any Serious research into the matter to be a skeptic and to try to dis-prove or debunk as many fakes as possible. With our advances in computers and video editing and special effects it's easier than ever for the nut-jobs and conspiracy wackos out there to make convincing "proof" on their own and it's people like those that bring a bad ilk to any Serious research into the matter. Sadly there are a lot of fakers and crazy people out there working in both directions of the debate. There are people who make fake videos of UFO's and try to pass them off as real and there are various groups and religious zealots who try to prove that Everything is fake and say that None Of It is real and anyone who believes there is intelligent non-human life in the universe is a moron or a liar.
Worse yet there are many people out there who are terrified of the idea that aliens may exist. Some people are so closed minded that no matter what scientific advances we may make or what we may learn about the universe and life its-self, they will Never believe that alien life exists even if aliens were to land on the White-House lawn and announce to the world that they are real and that they are here. Even if that did happen (which of course it hasn't) there would be a certain percentage of the world's population that would say it was faked, even if the proof was pointing a particle cannon at their head.
I'm about to tell a story I've never told publicly before. I've never told it honestly because I'm a little afraid of what it may make people think in regards to my sanity. If you choose to believe it, that's great. If you choose not to believe it, that's great too. One thing I do know for sure, I know what I saw...
Note: Before I get into the story, keep in mind that I was a kid. I was 13 or 14 years old. I had never done any drugs, didn't smoke cigs, didn't drink, and I wasn't a wild kid with a crazy imagination. I never had an "imaginary friend" at any point and even when I did grow up and start "partying" I've never had a hallucination nor have I ever saw something that I wasn't completely sure was right in front of me (magic tricks aside).
It was the summer of the year that my family moved from Deland in Volusia County out to Lake Mack in Lake County, Florida. I had to go to summer school that year to make up a failing English grade in 7th grade English (long story but basically I got screwed out of the grade I should have received). Because there weren't that many kids in my area going to summer school that year all of us in the neighborhood had to meet down at the corner store which was the only bus-stop for summer school that year. School started at 7 A.M. and was all the way in Leesburg (almost an hour from my house). We kids had to be at the bus-stop at 5:30 A.M. because it was a very long ride all the way to Leesburg from where we were in Lake Mack and there were other students to stop and pick up along the way. I was walking to the bus-stop down a long winding road. It was a normal paved road and there were houses and trailers all over the place. Even though the road was deserted because it was so early in the morning it was still a populated and crowded neighborhood. As I was rounding the bends I noticed all the tall pine trees were swaying back and forth pretty hard like there was about to be a storm, but oddly enough I couldn't feel any wind. I'm not going to say there wasn't any wind, there very well could have been and the currents were too high off the ground for me to feel the wind, but, I didn't actually feel any wind.
I was looking up at the tops of the pine trees when a very Large Triangle came out over the trees. At first I thought it was a helicopter and maybe I was seeing the lights on the ends of the rotors but then two things hit me. First, I couldn't hear Any noise. None what-so-ever. Second, if the lights I saw were on the ends of the rotors they would have been spinning very fast and not been stationary. They were also way too far apart to be rotor blades. The object was at least 3 times as high up as the trees, maybe 4 times as high, and it...was....Massive. I'm talking like the size of a Boeing 747, Massive. I quickly realized there was no way in hell that it was a helicopter. There were no flashing lights on it. They were on steadily. There were four lights in total. One larger light in the center and three more slightly smaller lights, one at each tip of the Triangle. I had seen plenty of helicopters up close, even military ones as I've lived close to Deland Airport for most of my time in Deland and seen plenty of air shows and air planes and helicopters first hand. I've seen both the Apache and the smaller Cobra Attack Chopper that it shares it's design with. It's also of note that out in Lake Mack in Lake County we were technically on the out-skirts of the Ocala National Forrest. The army had a bombing range on the far edge of the forrest and at least 3 or 4 times a year you could hear the bombs being dropped and all you had to do was go outside when the planes or helicopters were flying over-head to see what vehicles were doing the bombing. Lake Mack was right underneath their flight path for a long time even though the bombing range its-self was a good 60 or 70 miles away.
Anyway, when I realized just what it was I was looking at....well, I'm not ashamed to admit I got scared and started running for the bus-stop. I didn't look back and I didn't slow down. When I finally got to the point where I could see the store and see the other kids through the darkness standing under the street light at the store I stopped running. I didn't want the other kids thinking I was too scared to walk to the bus-stop in the dark, which I wasn't. I've never been afraid of the dark, not even as a small child. At that point when I stopped running I took the time to look behind me. Not surprisingly I didn't see anything. Nothing. No ship, no Triangle, no wind, and the trees were as still as could be since there was no wind.
I'm not gonna say I know for sure that it was aliens. I don't and to surmise that with no further evidence would be kinda stupid in my eyes. What I do know is that I have no idea what it was and it WASN'T a conventional aircraft. I honestly don't know what It was, but I do know I have Never seen Anything like It nor have I since. That one experience has led me to believe in intelligent life outside of this planet. I can't say it Was aliens. I can say I Think it was, because I have no other explanation for it.
So.....what do YOU believe? Do YOU think we're alone in the universe? Or do YOU think there is far more out there then we could ever dream is possible?
I have seen two UFOs in my life, both times I was sober...lol. I am a redneck, but I have not been abducted.
I do, however, believe in UFOs and Aliens. I do not believe the aliens are little green men, or Chewbacca style beings. I believe they would have been created by the same Creator as we were, and therefore would be humanoid, maybe slightly different than us due to environmental adaptation (my version of evolution).
I think it would be arrogant of us, humankind, to think we are the only highly intelligent beings created by our Creator. And since my Creator, God, created man in His own image, it stands to reason that any other intellectually advanced beings He created would also be in His image.
There, a redneck opinion.
Our solar system is as a speck of dust under the fingernail of our Creator.
That's just so wrong on so many levels...the least of which is that "we are....highly intelligent beings"....
I didn't mean you, Jafo....
....and yet another article [on-topic] ->
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38727371/ns/technology_and_science-space/
'Chances that we'll find ET are pretty good' - Proof of aliens could come within 25 years, scientist says
SANTA CLARA, Calif. — Proof of extraterrestrial intelligence could come within 25 years, an astronomer who works on the search said Sunday.
"I actually think the chances that we'll find ET are pretty good," said Seth Shostak, senior astronomer at the Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence Institute in Mountain View, Calif., here at the SETIcon convention. "Young people in the audience, I think there's a really good chance you're going to see this happen."
Shostak bases this estimation on the Drake Equation, a formula conceived by SETI pioneer Frank Drake to calculate the number (N) of alien civilizations with whom we might be able to communicate. That equation takes into account a variety of factors, including the rate of star formation in the galaxy, the fraction of stars that have planets, the fraction of planets that are habitable, the percent of those that actually develop life, the percent of those that develop intelligent life, the fraction of civilizations that have a technology that can broadcast their presence into space, and the length of time those signals would be broadcasted.
Reliable figures for many of those factors are not known, but some of the leaders in the field of SETI have put together their best guesses. Late great astronomer Carl Sagan, another SETI pioneer, estimated that the Drake Equation amounted to N = 1 million. Scientist and science fiction writer Isaac Asimov calculated 670,000. Drake himself estimates a more conservative 10,000.
But even if that lower value turns out to be correct, at the rate they're going, it wouldn't take scientists too long to discover an alien signal, Shostak said.
"This range, from Sagan's million down to 10,000 that's the range of estimates from people who have started and worked on SETI," said Shostak. "These people may know what they're talking about. If they do, then the point is we trip across somebody in the next several dozen or two dozen years."
The SETI quest is set to take a leap forward when the Allen Telescope Array, a network of radio dishes under construction in northern California, is fully operational. By 2015, the array should be able to scan hundreds of thousands of stars for signs of extraterrestrial intelligence, Shostak said.
But while humans might be able to discover an alien signal within that timeframe, interpreting what ET is trying to tell us could take much, much longer.
Shostak admitted such a task would be very difficult. An alien civilization may be as technologically advanced compared to us as Homo sapiens are to our hominid relatives Neanderthals.
"We could give our digital television signals to the Neanderthals, and theyll never figure it out. And they're not stupid," he said.
Yet simply having proof that we are not alone in the universe would likely be a world-changing achievement, Shostak added.
Mathematically it is nearly impossible for humans to be the only intelligent life in the universe. Alien life exists.
G3-
I'm glad we seem to be on the same page more or less, even if there were some misunderstandings along the way. Clearly the use of resources is incredibly important, and we should strive to reduce our consumption as best we can. Along that path though, are those who want the change to come immediately, with no regard for the cost incurred due to overly early adoption of immature technologies. The media and the government want you to be scared though, because it's easier to sell you stuff which isn't ready (but which they can make huge profits on) and it's easier to get you to give up more rights and power to the government if you think the world (or your world) is about to end unless you let 'them' take drastic action.
The recent oil spill in the gulf is a perfect example of this. Obama went as far as to call it 'the worst natural disaster in the history of the US'. Ummm.... just how stupid is that remark? Katrina? Hello? Anyone? But no, the media laps it up, because 'the worst ever' sells more than 'a big oil spill, which will naturally dissipate over time with little long term effect on the environment'. Of course everyone flew into panic mode and hasty decisions were made, which were probably worse for the overall situation than doing nothing until more information was available. Especially with respect to dumping all the 'cleaner' into the gulf, you want something with long term environmental impact? Yep, bad idea, rushed into because WE HAVE TO ACT NOW!!!!
Well sometimes you do have to act immediately, but I think the point is that the scientific community is acting, and will continue to act, and forcing immature technologies into effect before they are fully understood (or fully functional) is sheer folly.
Wow, that is so incredibly stupid... Why would ET be trying to tell us anything? When the message was sent a million freaking years ago before ET knew 'we' were here. Damn, nutters just keep on getting dumber.
Not stupid. "our" exploratory craft have "messages" on them and we have NOT yet found anyone/thing to be sending them to.
Let's also be careful about calling people here 'nutters/dumber'. Doing so has consequences...
Well firstly, I didn't call anyone *here* a nutter (unless that SETI dude is posting here...). And secondly we're not talking about craft, we're talking about SETI looking for radio signals, which may also be 'dumb' because we are already moving away from 'radio' after about 60 years. And that's really what makes finding any ETs incredibly unlikely. The time scales involved require us to be looking at the right place where a million years ago someone may have used radio to communicate on their world. And unless their civilization lasted for a million years, and continued to use radio throughout that time, then the window for seeing them gets smaller and smaller.
I think the consensus in this thread is that it is incredibly likely that there are intelligent ETs out there somewhere. The remaining issue is the likelihood of ever knowing it for sure.
Er...they're not tuning in to the top 40 hit parade and the traffic report on Groovy Tunes on the AM band. The reference to 'radio' is simply the frequency of communicable transmission....wavelength....
Of course it is. Question, what is the current standard for our communicable transmissions?
It's a hell of a lot more quiet than 'radio', it's also not aimed into space from radio towers...
See we got to a point where we assumed, 'hey, we use radio based terrestrial broadcast, so duh, everyone else out there must use it too!' Well that's an assumption that's not terrible, but after ~60 years we've improved our transmissions to the point where they are no longer terrestrially based, they are no longer pointed 'everywhere'. We are dimming our own signal if you will.
Seems reasonable to think that there is a timeframe in which 'radio' is huge, after which technology advancements start to decrease it to the point where it's a hell of a lot more quiet than it was for the century it was the standard. Again, it's a question of timeframes more than anything else.
For those trying to explain 4th dimension-this covers 1-10.
Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JkxieS-6WuA
Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySBaYMESb8o
Again, wrong.
Technology emits radio frequencies...not JUST your Tranny/Radiogram/UHF Transmitter. If 'alien civilisations' use ELECTRICITY they will emit radio frequencies.... As a matter of interest a Formula One car's engine fires at such high revs it emits a radio signal just from the spark of ignition combustion that is 'audible' with Ham equipment. That 'hum' you hear around power lines is borderline audible frequency...and pulsars can be 'heard'.
No 'advanced civilisation' that we have yet encountered exists in radio silence [and again I do not mean the local Surf Report]...
Perhaps this background radiation everyone attributes to the big bang is actually distant remnants of ancient civilisations listening to The Simpsons...
The Simpsons is getting old and tired and has probably jumped a few sharks already...but it's not quite that old...
I honestly didn't read the whoooole thread, but someone mentioned why would UFO's be coming here and it made me remember this comment I read somewhere. That persons comment basically explained why the "aliens" would come to Earth, basically his long explanation was that they came here for vacations lol, that really made me giggle. He also said that the only reason we've heard about crashed UFOs is because they're dumb tourists hahaha and added "You never see a US Carrier Crashing somewhere right?".
This comment really made ma laugh, but at the same time it could be yet another possibility that "made sense", cause yeah we go to Africa on Safari trips to see animals being animals. So if we had the tech, and discovered life elsewhere we'd probably go on intergalactic safaris as well .
I myself have seen 3, possibly 4 UFOs which I have no explanation, I even saw a UFO during the day and was with my dad as we headed for a baseball game.
Actually, that's not the reason we go to Africa :
Wow...
It's a question of power (pulsars are freaking LOUD compared to anything else). That 'hum' you hear isn't going to be anything but lost in the background once it's gone a few LYs from earth. We blew like a blowtorch for ~60 years, and will probably continue for another 40 or so, after that we are going to look much much quieter, and thus be that much more difficult to see.
The same *could* apply for any other intelligent civilization anywhere else. Or it might not. SETI is guessing that any other intelligence would have developed their technologies similarly to us, not a terrible assumption as far as we know. The issue is that as technology continues to develop we need to refine our assumptions about how 'loud' we are, or for that matter, how 'loud' the ETs we're looking for are. If they weren't blasting their 'radio' for thousands of years we're looking at seeing their signal over only a small fraction of time. It could have already passed us by. The assumption that once a civilization 'fires up the stereo', it never turns it off, is one I find very difficult to accept.
The most likely ONLY way the 'stereo' gets turned off is when the civilization goes nuclear and snuffs itself out...and we'll likely HEAR that.
I can't see why anyone would find it 'very difficult to accept'....and the presumption that 'our' world is getting 'quieter' radio-wise is quite baseless.
No it's well established due to the conversion to digital and satellite transmissions. Again 'radio' (also includes TV) towers sent their broadcasts up and out (to be bounced around back down so that we could pick them up). Radio towers are going out of business, or have you not noticed?
And even if they went nuclear and snuffed themselves out, what makes you think we'd hear it anyway? It's one big pulse, and if it passed us by already, well we'd never even know. It's not as though they'd turn into a pulsar, unless they invented stellar converter devices or some such. Then again, how would we know the difference between naturally dying (or dead when we see them) stars, and intentionally destroyed stars?
Oh...I see. "Digital and satellite' transmissions are clearly 'silent'....radio towers are out of business means those Mobile phone towers [cell phone] are not really there at all either...just a figment of my imagination.
Just a hint...closed-circuit communications [by wire] are not totally 'silent' either.
Then there's television broadcasts - wireless broadband [oh, yes....'wireless' means 'radio'....how about that].
And every time you turn a corner in your car....your 'indicator' emits a signal - no - not [just] to other traffic - typically on the AM band.
Bitof background...my old man was in Army Signals in Crete, Egypt and New Guinea during WW2....intercepting that 'radio' we aren't really emitting....working with Enigma codes that weren't really needed as we weren't sending anything....then after the war spent 30+ years in Flight Service...talking via radio with aircraft.....gee...we still do it exactly the same way all these years later.....then he was a Ham after retiring....'heard' the chatter [morse] re Chernobyl....listened in on the Apollo stuff that civilisations won't emit when they explore space....
Since then...I got the nick 'Jafo' from 3 decades of 'radio' communications in Motor Racing [FIA, FIM]....admittedly starting at a time when the system wasn't 'secure' FM frequencies but was simple closed land-line telephone - which emits 'noise' anyway.
Radiated signals [radio] is not just what Joe Public wants to pick up on his car stereo...it permeates all the advanced civilisations that we know of....and thus is VERY reasonable to presume will be adopted by others we are yet to encounter.
Communication is vital for civilisation....and I don't mean JUST 'books'.
What you say, Jafo, is correct. However, in the vastness of space our sphere of influence is limited... miniscule, in fact, and we may very well have missed transmissions broadcast by other, non-terrestrial civilisations... ie, we weren't listening in the right direction at the right time. It could also be that our primitive equipment (in comparison) is not capable of receiving transmissions over the immense distances they have to travel.
And it could also be that 'out there' civilisations wish to remain undetected from primitive critters like us, so they cloak their activities from our prying eyes and ears. I mean, knowing us the way you do, would you want us infiltrating or assimilating into an otherwise peaceful, violence and war-free civilisation.???
It could also be that gravity and/or atmospheric conditions (ozone layers and the like) do not allow for radio transmissions to escape into space, and therefore we can not receive them.
ET is out there alright, but he is too smart for us and will not fully reveal himself until we become truly civilised.... something we are not, as yet.
If you look back to the Roswell incident, and look at the technology of that era. You'll see that technology BOOMED at about that time, and we have been advancing technologically at a much faster rate since than before.
I truly believe that much of our technology is alien technology learned from the Roswell craft. That said, I think that is proof of ET, and proof that he's technologically advanced.
Better yet, let me really open myself up for ridicule by stating that I think ET may even live among us, and some parts of US Gov't. knows it.
As a Marine, my nephew has been training for the CIA, and tells me that he has been warned of the "perils" he "may" encounter, by the hand of the USMC, if he fails to follow guidelines set by USMC for interacting with alien lifeforms. It was not IF, but when.
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