Hello,
As much as I would like Elemental to be available on Mac and Linux, I know there is little to no chance of seeing it on those platforms. Looking at Stardock, you can easily figure out that they have invested most if not all of their efforts in Windows, .NET and DirectX which make their softwares a de facto single platform. With all their Windows tools, they probably have some guys that know the windows API, tweaks and hacks as much as those who created them in Redmond.
Anyway, I think they should start looking at the Mac and Linux platforms. Valve did it successfully. Firaxis did it. Paradox Interactive did it. Lots of indie game studios did it and got a sound return on the investment.
In the meantime, I will most likely be playing Elemental on a virtual machine on my Mac.
What do you think?
I'm all for multi-platform availability of games, but like you said, Stardock probably is most acquainted with windows APIs than anything else. You know what would be great too? If they released the full source code of their older games as well. Right now, the mac and linux game markets are open, and there's next to zero competition. There's a big opportunity there right now.
I am pretty sure that Stardock uses their windows customizing apps for defining their screens ...
Remember also that SD is quite small and low-budget. Might be a bit of a strain on them to do the conversion without a significant enough increase in profit. Remember games like Civ4 are so well known that many Mac users would immediately snap up a copy. I doubt the majority of Mac users are avid SD followers.
Basically what Rincewind said. Until Linux/Mac starts making up a much, much larger portion of gamers, it's just not economic for SD to develop cross-platform.
Well, that way then the SD game community could then rewrite the games's rendering methods, making them cross-platform.
Sorry, I didnt mean those two events as directly related. What I meant to say for opportunity is that right now, there are people running mac and linux who do want games running natively on their platforms, and in that market there is no big pushers like there is on windows at the moment. Valve recognized this and started offering Steam on the mac. They started that transition. And you know, Stardock probably knows a thing or two about getting into new platforms due to them becoming a standard.
From what I know of 3d environs it is hard to change the available platforms once you have begun. Things like OpenGL are platform free and can replace DirectX (which is windows only), yet once you have begun using one, it is hard to change to another. I have never made 3d games myself, yet if you rely on dependencies (which every game engine does) it is hard to switch once you have started using one, unless they are very similar which from what I understand DX and OpenGL are deliberately not.
All in all, it might be too much effort to broaden Elemental, yet for their next engine it might be doable.
PC gaming, obviously, would benefit if there wasn't a wall between windows and mac/linux and anybody could buy a copy of sins and play it on whichever platform they choose. Will stardock stop using directx and stop calling itself a windows-only developer (I think I heard Brad say that someplace)? I'm guessing they probably won't anytime soon (if ever). It's Brad's company, he gets to do whatever he wants, etcetera. His comments on the iPad were very interesting, so maybe he's thinking about a post windows-only world.
The release of steam for the mac, while not automagically creating osx native versions of every game on steam, still had the effect of increasing the total pool of consumers for pc games. It was a good thing. Valve's decision to natively port their titles to the mac is a good thing.
Impulse on mac/linux would be a good thing too.
I doubt the majority of Mac users are avid indie games followers. However
Yep, PC gamers aren't on windows entirely. Brad has mentioned that the latest offerings from apple could be a rival to that of notebooks and desktops. More competition is a good thing too.
Moving to Mac and Linux is something that would cost Stardock a lot of extra money and effort: training people, setting three environments to test for their releases, using a worse tool-chain,... Unless it's crystal clear that they will earn more money, it's hard to make the commitment to that.
From a personal perspective, I would love if at least the Impulse client had a Linux version. Honestly the only reason I bought a new PC last year and a Windows 7 license was for 1 reason only: games. And my digital distribution platform of choice is Impulse by far. I use Steam, but really only if a title isn't available in Impulse. I think it's important to note that the reason i prefer Impulse is that it gives me much greater freedom over the games that I purchase. Easier access to files for mods, maps, etc. and I don't need to have the client running to play the games delivered by it.
Now that Steam is (apparently) releasing a Linux client I am totally stoked. I've been playing around with more Linux distros lately and I have to say that they have come a LONG way. As far as how "user friendly" they are I'd say Linux Mint for example is at least as easy to use as XP. The command line is used about equally for each. I'm Planning on buying a second HDD for that new machine i mentioned earlier for a dual boot system. And you can bet that I will get more games from Steam so as to install both Linux and Windows versions of games.
It's ironic really how the more 'closed' system, Steam, is the first one to migrate to the open and free OS world that Linux is, while the system that allows more freedom for its users, Impulse, seems to be content remaining on the closed Windows OS.
Doesn't matter if Steam has a Linux version.
How many games/programs that you use on the PC have the same? And, will you have to purchase them anew by switching to a Linux system? That could be a very expensive switch.
Steam is only the delivery system, after all. If the games don't follow suit, what does it matter?
You know the the owner of the porting software takes profits on all mac game sales, not buyout. This has caused larger games to do it themselves instead of using a third party which can pretty much make any windows game compatible with mac.
I'm on a mac, and I have windows xp bootcamp.
What irritates me is developers ignore bootcamp problems that occur 10-20% of the time. Errors that cause a computer restart. It has something to do with something and I've never heard a good explanation. All the major developers write good code and I can run at max settings and quality and have no problem. Thats really a good gauge of the company, how fast their code runs.
Hooah!
Well it seems perfectly okay for me to install a windows game on more than one machine inside my LAN; I can't see why there would be a difference switching between a windows version and a Linux version. But you're right; I don't know for sure. Perhaps someone with both windows and Mac could answer this question better.
To your first question, yeah you're right again. I own 1 game out of god knows how many that have both Windows and Linux versions, and I know of a handful of others but not very many at all right now. My point is that if Steam has a Linux version, I think that would indeed make Linux a more attractive platform for some developers. There WOULD be more games developed for it I have no doubt. And you can bet that Valve games would be among the first.
As I said I'm stoked!
EDIT: And thanks to the OP for the link. A a very interesting read!
Hi guys!
Just a very breif message: Solar Empire - Trinity could for sure be a breakthrough in a new market. I can only agree with those who its time start looking at the Mac and Linux platforms. As said before Valve did it successfully. Firaxis did it. Paradox Interactive did it...
And as others have said before, success by one company doesn't make it economically viable for another or even possible.
"Time to start thinking about Mac and Linux"
I view the competition between pc and mac as one between gm and ford. Linux, on the other hand, offers a more consumer friendly approach.
Impulse at least should be made multiplatform, then people can download the non-Windows version if they change systems at some point if the company made a version for that system. This would make Impulse more appealing and availible to a wider audiance, so it is likely to have the greatest gain for the cost of porting it.
Actually, SD could support linux in cost-effective way - via wine. Their games run there already, just with some bugs here and there. It should not take much effort to fix these.
Apple is proprietary, does not play well with others. This is why PC's were created. You have to pay huge amounts of money for the hardware, then pay huge amounts of money for the software. There is no choice. Apple is the only person you can go to. No sales. No discounts. Lock you in an wipe out your wallet. THEN they'll chose not to support it and they will be the only person you can go to, then shutdown all the support.
Get away from Apple as soon as possible.
Mac is more likely to show a profit, but never certain. Macs in my experience tend to attract people who are really not into gaming.
Linux is more of a problem. Hacking to get a game up and running on the Linux box is the game. Actually playing it takes valuable time that could be spent hacking! Getting a Linux user to pay ... ah, ha ha ha! Did you say pay? ROFL!
Whats so funny about it? I have several professional tools I've paid for on my linux systems, including WingIDE Pro. I have premium account subscriptions to many sites, like devART. I donate to many FOSS projects to keep them running.
Only difference from Win users is that we prefer to taste first, pay later instead of buying cat in the bag.
I saw the topic come up again. As soon as you can get out from under the loan you had to apply for to get set up with the Mac, run! Run fast! Run far!
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