I was really, really hoping that Dragon Age and Mass Effect could co-exist side by side without melting into one another. Apparently Bioware or EA have different plans. Personally, I have enjoyed Dragon Age and Mass Effect 2, but I enjoyed Dragon Age more. I just loved the fact that I could change so much about my character, not just cosmetic changes, right from the start. It looks like they are taking this away in favor of the one male or one female approach that Mass Effect 2 had, which I did not care for much. Like I said, I still enjoy Mass Effect 2, but I just felt more drawn into the world of DA than the other. I know this can be the exact opposite feeling for other people.
They mentioned a bit about voice acting in Dragon Age, or lack of, and possible changes helping with that. You know, I really don't care if my characters talk or not. I mean I found the companion dialogue worthwhile, but hearing my voice in ME2 only added a fraction of the satisfaction I got from being able to customize my DA character.
I don't know. I am disappointed. I was late to the DA and ME2 party I know, so I didn't have the roller-coaster experience of following those two games up until release that I have been having with their sequels. I am all for continuing series, but if linking the two means sacrificing choice (character choice) and only giving you story choice... I am not a huge fan. I'd rather have a mixture of the two.
Edit: quick note the external link above is to the kotaku article talking about the changes
Where did you see that they're going the ME route with DA?
I remember the huge debates on the DA forums before the game launched because they weren't going the ME approach. Some were thrilled, others hated the idea. Bioware often said that doing the voice over for each playable character in DA was way too much overhead (ie, one male male and female of each race, not counting if you wanted base classes to each sound different).
Yeah, if they go this route I’ll be disappointed. ME2 was a fun enough game but DA was obviously tailored to the PC more.
Wow. Seems assbackwards to give people all the origin stories and freedom of character choices just to go back to RPG basics with the sequel.
It doesn't bother me as much as long as they maintain a good variety of classes and skills. I mean, essentially, they're only making you use a name. Everything else is still yours.
Edit: As far as the Origin Stories, let's face it, most of them were more or less gimmicks that didn't affect much of anything. I did a Dwarf Noble story, and when I was doing the Dwarven quests in their city, I got recognized once or twice during the plot, and it made no difference whatsoever.
I disagree. My sister played the dwarf origins first and I played the mage. Our understanding of the world was very different. I won't do spoilers here but the choices at the dwarf city, my understanding, isnt' really a choice for the dwarf origin characters after what was done to them. While i was torn with who to put on the throne, my sister's response was no way to one of them... because of the origin experience.
Same with the Circle of Mages, there was really only one option for me as a Mage, although technically I could have gone the other way. If you get into the role, origins matter.
That's pretty disappointing to hear. That system isn't necessarily bad but it just doesn't fit with the first game. The first had so many options and even had a different beginning for many of those choices which was so original and refreshing. They are basically throwing out one of the best features of the game (in my opinion) to try and appeal to a wider audience and speed up the development time. Bioware is still a good company but I see it slowly drifting in the wrong direction for my tastes and I have a feeling in another few years their games will just be average. We'll see.
Not only that but I was hoping to be able to keep playing my original character in the sequel. I assumed we would revisit him and get to explore what happened with Morrigan and her baby (assuming you made that choice).
And I was hoping against hope to do the same. I have two characters, each with a different ending choice I had wanted to explore. Now it seems like we'll all wind up being human again even though they had already narrowed down race choices a lot compared to their earlier games...3.
I guess there's that, yes. And I made similar decisions. But gameplay wise, the origin stories made no difference. The way the plot unfolded as a dwarf was the exact same as if you were any other race. They just didn't capitalize on a lot of opportunity to really make Origin stories matter in the game, not just to you the player.
I would agree that the origins did not have as much as an effect as Bioware claimed they would, or as some of their most loyal fans say it does. No argument there from me on that, however, this was the first attempt really to incorporate the idea. You would think they would expand on that with the sequel, work with the idea, tweak it, make it better, not stop back and say hey, Mass Effect 2 sold better let's do that. In Mass Effect 2, I spend most my time trying to get better guns, and picking up more team members. In Dragon Age, I spent most my time trying to get the story to unfold the way I wanted to to and learn more about this world. As predictable as the story was, it was still interesting and entertaining and picking up companions felt more natural. In Mass Effect 2 I pretty much got a laundry list of characters to go grab and a Codex full of information I am not reading. I pretty much read all the codex/diary info from DA. I just cared about the world a lot more, and I think a large part of that is because of the way the game started with me picking, race, sex, class, origins and by god all of that actually has an effect, some of it minor, on how i interact in the world the whole time.
There's an article on CVG today that says DA was more successful than ME2.
Really, I had thought the ME2 was up there because of console sales. I'll have to go look. If that is the case, then it really makes no sense for them to shift the game like this.
Here you go:
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=255062
yeah, I was surprised too. There’s a lot more to DA than ME.
Thanks for the link. I am surprised, very surprised. I thought ME 2 would have more appeal to the general gaming public than DA. I got my uncle to play ME 2 (which he likes), and there is no way I think he would like DA for example because of the combat, and I tend to like niche games anyway.
Only one playable race. No origin stories. That's much more like ME than DA.
Mass Effect 2 is fun just like Jade Empire was fun, but I wouldn't call either of them a real RPG. More significantly, Jade Empire stood alone and I personally never compared it to Bioware's previous games and didn't think less of it just because it wasn't an RPG.
Mass Effect 2 though, is significantly different than the first ME, and as such, deserves derision. Why did Bioware throw out the awesome game play of the original just to make it a proper shooter? All that was unique about the title was tossed out in the name of selling more copies.
And I'm afraid that now that everyone has trashed the console versions of Dragon Age: Origins, inappropriately comparing it to the PC version, Bioware will do the same with it. If console gamers want something more actiony, even if it's generic, lightweight, and inconsequential, let's give it to them!
I for one will not buy a Dragon Age that is some generic button masher. I LOVE DAO on the Xbox 360, and what I expect of a sequel is better graphics, new stuff (skills, equipment, story, etc.), and improved game play.
...
What?
Awesome gameplay? At first i liked it. But pretty soon i realised how ME1 worked: You take AR, put best mods to it, and run forward and shoot everything (and use throw/lift). Character development had no meaningful choices, you just maxed out a few skills (i refuse to call them talents) and you're good to go. In battles, there are no tactics involved or anything. I have played it on insanity starting with a brand new character, no challenge anywhere.
Exploring with the Mako is sort of fun... for a couple of times. Afterwards, it was chore, but thankfully totally non-essential and optional.
Oh and the weapon skills worked idiotically (increasing accuracy, yet you still have to point and shoot yourself) though i'm still not quite sure whether it is better way than what Oblivion did, skill=weapon damage.
And there were Charm and Intimidate skills. Not saying anything about them, in general, every BW game i have played has idiotic persuasion system. Morrowind speechcraft is still the best persuasion system, and it wasn't very good...
I don't get what was so unique in ME1. Gameplay-wise. Forget dialogue (wheel), story, graphics, places, setting, whatever else than character development and actual gameplay. Not that story was that unique either...
AND DON'T GET ME WRONG! I loved ME1. I actually voted for it in some GOTY poll rather than Halo 3, which i had expected so much and liked well.
ME2 character development is so much better, you have to actually think whether you want this skill or that, since you don't have enough points for all of them (unlike ME1... you could get all the essentials and have left-overs) and you need to decide whether to take low ranks now or save for higher ranks. Of course, in the end, cookie cutter builds are obvious, and there isn't much point in many skills, EVEN on insanity. Which, by the way, once again, didn't pose any challenge save for a couple of bosses.
Classes in that game are more distinct and weapon system is consiredably better than ME1's where you use the gun (and everone of these is identical within the weapon type...) with most damage, unless you're a noob.
I think Mass Effect works better as more pure shooter with character developement and dialogue RATHER than Action-RPG having shitty character development and wannebe-shooter gameplay that fails.
And now on-topic. DA2.
New combat system? Good, assuming it's more action oriented (eg Morrowind or Oblivion). If it's still party-based, well, i hope you can queue actions now.
Pre-determined character (as in species, name (or part of it), backround)? Well most (RPG) games with these seem to work just fine... and let's think of classic RPG: Fallout. Yeah, it works just fine. (Except that Fallout ain't that good as HC fans make it, i know as i have played it through).
Dialogue wheel? I don't know. ME2 still had moments where the choice doesn't do what one thinks it does. I doubt that BW will eliminate these. Also, i sort of like to know what i'm going to say beforehand, besides, i skip the line after i've read the subtitle. Reading is so much faster. But since i mostly liked Mass Effect's system, i have no real issues with this.
More cinematic game? No problems, as long as there's STRONG illusion that what i do affects the world and there is a shitload of choices, always, not just chaotic evil, neutral and lawful good choices (like ME's do, and DAO mostly (well it felt like that)).l
(PS I still think that if someone really wants a real RPG, stick to PnP games. Imagination has more processing power than any computer or console, if you need cinematic graphics. Embrace cinematic action games with character development and dialogue choices!)
I hate how ME2 makes you choose all one path, "good", or all one path "evil" or else you find yourself severely limited later. DA did not do this. I liked DA combat just fine. If i wanted Oblivion type combat, there is, well Oblivion and Might and Magic and a other FPS type games to go for it seems.
On the whole Good vs Evil thing, I though that was a let down in DA.
I was usually friends with everyone in DA (which is odd since there is the curel and the kind split in the party), and on a saddistic playthrough I didn't have enough fun since everyone was ethier dead or didn't say much to me (even though they were at -100 its no different than -25 or so which is a TINY bit different than 10).
Usually my evil females are the most interesting and fun playthoughs that I do last but this time there simply wasnt any content to see for that path...
I dont mind so much if the Origins feature is unique to Dragon Age:Origins. But if they finally get rid of the "save the world" story, then i will be overjoyed...since thats makes DA2 a way more of a BG successor.
RPGs are about the story. As long as they craft a good story (and the game is good too), it'll be fine. Reducing characters options is not so bad as it allows more detail (allows voices, more branching possible as there are not various races plus genders for each). Only need that would worry me is if they were to make it as "simple" as Mass Effect 2 (which I love, mind you, but I prefer Dragon Age). That and that I hate the customization for the character in Mass Effect, so clumsy!
And we play "the baby" in Dragon Age 2.
Or maybe not.
We don't. Unless time travel is involved.
I guess everyone has different opinions but I found ME2 borderline boring. It was an actual struggle for me to get through it which is a first for a Bioware game for me. ME1 had it's issues but it held my attention the whole way through. I even started to play it a second time which is almost unheard of for me. The Mako planet searching was the only part that tried my patience. ME2 got rid of that but replaced it with planet scanning which is even more boring. At least the Mako had terrain, items to find and occassional enemies. Scanning was just boring through and through. ME2 just simplified things to such a degree that it became uninteresting. The whole game just felt like a formula they were following. Each planet felt similar, each combat felt similar, quests made you do similar things (goto to planet A and recruit member A, goto planet B and recruit member B, ...). The story and characters where pretty good but the actual game play bored me in many respects. For me this was the worst Bioware game ever made. At least from the RPG's I am familiar with.
I wasn't a huge fan of ME2 either. The actual story was pretty good... all 10 hours of it. There's quite a lot of filler to make it seem like a full length RPG. Like the hours spent scanning planets, which has to be the most ridiculously boring thing I've ever seen in a game.
I also played as an Adept, and there was almost no problem not solved by Singularity. Let's not even get started on how badly the DLC fits with the rest of the game. Honestly I'm glad to see Dragon Age did better, as they put more effort into it. (The Illusive Man was fun though.)
I liked the idea of Origins in DA:O, but I found that, even with these, the game had much less replay value than The Witcher with its single character.
Any replay of DAO seems pretty similar (well, until you play a mage, at which point subsequent runs as not a mage seem like masochism).
If DA2 offers in-game options that open several roads to tread and offers more replayability/choices, I'll be happy.
I couldn't care less about the voice, as I play all games with sound turned off.
http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2010/07/09/five-facts-about-hawke-in-dragon-age-ii.aspx
This is where I read about it, and point 5 makes me think Fable (any of them) right away. And except for the main character the game seems to be the same if you don't count the Fable element.
Better or worse? Hard to say. The combat in ME2 is very good but the story is unintuitive and the commerce system is fubar. I liked Dragon Age for simply being an immersive gameworld, its combat is unfinished, its Origins are non-critical to anything except dialogue, the story, while good, is way to formular and smells of every other Bioware game since Kotor, and it lacks replayability and random since every drop and enemy will come at the exact same location EVERY TIME... (Go D2!)
I like ME2 main character, even the VOs, if not for the dalogue wheel, I hope they add teh paragon/renegade actions while in conversation but add more than 2 options, not every time but polarity is not optimal.
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