Newzbin has arguably been the "Best" source and index listing of what is posted to BBS Newsgroups around the world. BBS stands for Bulletin Board System and almost every Internet Provider in the entire world provides access to them as part of your Internet package. Whether you're old enough to remember or not, BBS's are the Foundation of the Internet. These are the Original Internet. In many ways this is what the Internet was built on. If you had to compare it to something physical, use this example. You buy some land and build a house. That land is the Earth, your foundation. That land, that Earth, is the BBS system of Newsgroups. It's what the Internet was built on. Think of every website in existence as a "House", sitting on the land. Without getting extremely technical that's the best analogy I can give. It is a flawed analogy, it's not exactly accurate, but it's close enough.
I've been a free member and user of Newzbin for well over the last ten years (No, it's not just for pirates and hackers). in a way you could also compare BBS Newsgroups to MIRC back in the day before ICQ and Yahoo Instant Messenger and Skype. Think of Newzbin as a site that would tell you what everyone was talking about in various channels on MIRC. That's what Newzbin was. You had to either be a paid member of the site or you had to be INVITED by a paid member and were given a basic free membership. It wasn't always "Invite Only", but when they switched to that system everyone had to make new accounts and if you weren't already paid or re-invited you were locked out, sorry about your bad luck. Luckily, as I was a free member, a friend (who was just a random Internet stranger at the time) re-invited me and I was allowed back in.
Some people, namely those who used Newzbin's service, are going to greatly suffer because of this. It was an invaluable tool to help people find needed information quickly and easily. Any information at all from examples such as "Legal Statutes from cases dating back to the Early 19th Century" to "Online Legal Copies of Every Book in the Library of Congress" to "Discussions being held by College Physics Professors" and also "Doctors Sharing Research Up-To-The-Minute". It was as much a listing of communications as these very same forums are. BBS Newsgroups are nothing more then that. People talking back and forth in topics just like this. The exception is back then our ability to post and reply wasn't set up like this, so every post made, whether it be a new topic or a reply to that topic where it's own "Thread". Newzbin helped organize those threads and posts and show you where things were so you could quickly find them.
Sadly how-ever, as with many technological innovations in our day, some people chose to use these for evil purposes. Even though these "Newsgroups" are intended for communication, and to provide a backbone for the rest of the Internet, they are also used to host and share files with limited "retention". Every ISP on the GLOBE must have space on the BBS Newsgroups for their systems to work. I don't know why or how it's set up exactly, I don't work for the cable company so I can't tell you why they even have to be there at all, but they do. More and more ISP's these days Are Limiting or Flat Out DENYING their customers access to these Newsgroups. If your ISP isn't giving you access to them, you're not getting everything you're paying for and you should call them and DEMAND Access as a Paying Customer. Far be it from me to tell you what to do, it's no skin off my shoulder if you enjoy wasting your money, but I know I don't like wasting mine.
When I say some people use Newsgroups and by default the listings on Newzbin for "Evil" I mean piracy of course. Newsgroups go by the more common term Usenet. Still, Newzbin as a website did NOT HOST OR SHARE ANY FILES. All it did was tell people where files were at, in what groups they were listed, and what the file names were. It did this because technically these posts on various Newsgroups were the same as the other topics or "threads" or "conversations", it just so happens some of them are pieces, usually .rar's, of games or movies. The same kinds of things that can be found on any Torrent site.
Newzbin did nothing wrong. People did have LEGITIMATE USES for it, just like they do Fogbugs, or Photobucket, or many other sites. Newzbin was closed because they owe money to people I believe. I didn't know anything about any of this or it's legal trouble before finding THIS ARTICLE when I tried to log-on to Newzbin today.
If you know or heard anything about this or find a site that talks a little more in depth, please let me know as I'd like to find out all I can about it being shut down.
Hopefully some of you out there see this for what it is regardless of what the causes are. Another place being closed because someone thinks they're losing money over piracy and pressured some Government to take action. Newzbin wasn't just a site for pirates or other thieves. It had real value. Eventually, slowing, this is going to turn into a legal and virtual "Witch-hunt" by Governments to shut down more and more sites limiting knowledge and people's freedoms Online.
You have it backwards.
It's not Jafo's practices that I disagree with. I'm totally fine with the use he made of a crack. That is no chink in any armor.
I disagree with his preachings.
You do not supplant theirs with your own....that is what pirates do.
Nobody can agree with Jafo unless he admits that it is ok for everybody to not respect EULAs in some case. If it was ok for him, and he just said he thinks it was ok for him, then it is ok for everyone to not respect EULA in the very same situation.
Well it's not black white from either perspective. It's one great muddled mess. Sony's rootkit and Starforce were espcially bad. Securom has been known to cause some problems to some parts too, so I am not sure it's much better plus Securom has a lot of varities too.
I don't know that Jafo every took much of a stance on DRM so much as piracy, and we all know that piracy can exist with or without DRM. And while getting rid of Starforce and playing a game might break an EULA, I am not sure it would be considered piracy. I mean he bought the game right? I am sure the lawyers in a massive sue every IP on the list could care less whether or not he legally owns the game he downloaded, but in general when most people talk about piracy, they're not talking about people who purchased the game and then downloaded the game later for whatever reason. There might be some grounds to question his stance since he kind of mentioned before that if you break the disc you need to buy it again... anyway I don't think you found as much of an ah hah moment as you think. Jafo isn't perfect, and I assume if you read this thread you know I am not exactly agreeing with him on all points here.
Anyway, I would say there is a lot of work to do from both sides, industry and consumer, and when that work is done, the pirates left will hopefully find sanctuary nowhere. Until then, i can't demonize all pirates, but that doesn't mean I am going to join their ranks either.
My sentiments exactely Nesrie, pirates are commonplace, not demons. I dont agree with Jafo on all points either i just am of the opinion that piracy is bad for devolopers and the community, nomatter how tempting it is.
And now it seems pirates want to screw each other as well as various copyright holders with the Pirate Bay's Pirate Date website!
My internet training is still telling me this is a joke but I've been wrong before.
I wish Ubisoft wanted to screw with me in a similar way rather than with my progress since the last checkpoing every time the connection drops...
It would be alright if the actual creative forces behind the media being pirated were the ones mounting all these legal cases, but they're not. No. it's the corporate power brokers and their lawyers who are doing so, and while it is claimed they are protecting the artists and future development, etc, it's more to protect their own rich and opulent lifestyles.
As Mick Jagger and David Bowie have both said, the record companies have been screwing artists for decades, and that the only time it was profitable for musicians was for a short period in the 70's, and usually only then because of their touring and live performances. That's why the Beatles formed their own record company, because they were tired of EMI and other record companies ripping them off.
The same applies to game writers/coders, while they receive a pittance (in comparison) for their efforts, the gaming corporations are raking in billions.... and they also claim it is for future development. BOLLOCKS!!!! I have a cousin in the UK who wrote a PC game, and he was approached by a gaming company to purchase it from him.... despite being paid for it AND receiving cash advances for 2 further games, he still has to work a full-time job to make ends meet. Like he said: "Unemployment benefits would pay me more than those bastards do."
So what's my cousin's take on his games being pirated?? He doesn't give a stuff because he's been paid all he's going to get from them (that's right, no royalties.. otherwise no sale at all) and figures the additional exposure can't do him any harm. He hopes one day the be able to publish his own games and cut out the corporate factor to sell them for a 1/4 of the price currently being asked... and STILL make a modest living out of it.
Well fat lot of good the legal action did since Newzbin is now back online anyway
No, it's not. Newzbin2 is online how-ever
hehe, I'm just being a smart ass.
I am rather peeved though that they no longer list the News groups I used for watching the stock markets. It's more or less just the pirated stuff now and not much, if any, actual "News". It's really a let down because the Original Newzbin actually had plenty of legal and valid information being shared. Plus share-ware versions of programs to use, actual legal share-ware. Now that's all gone and it's just illegal content being listed.
I defended the old, Original Newzbin to the death because it Did have legitimate value as a source of information. This new one run by the new owners...if they keep this up I think they'll be busted pretty quick and without the actual valid content being listed along with the pirated content they won't have a "Legal Leg to Stand On" in their defense. At least the original owners could always say Newzbin had valid applications aside from piracy, the new guys don't seem as bright sadly.
I'm sorry to derail somewhat, truly I am, but Raven I wanted to ask: were you working as a GM or a Councilor with OSI (I believe Sages, by that point, had been removed)? I gave UO the best 7-8 years of my life, and it always grabs my attention
caross73 and Nesrie,
You have made very convincing and thoughtful arguments - keep up the good fight.
I started as a volunteer "Councilor/Seer" on the Great Lakes shard when UO was still ran by OSI Pre-EA owned. Ahh, the good'ol days. . I think the best time I ever had as a GM though was working on TFL as GM Thanatos and the other "Gods". Some of the other GM's picked up "Deity Identities" as well but I couldn't always count on their availability for quests I would run so I often had to RP multiple Gods in game at the same time. It was crazy, but it was fun as hell too. . That's what I miss the most. Having an active player base running and playing quests that I was sometime literally designing and running "Live" on the spot. When inspiration hit me I had the autonomy to be allowed to act on it without having to get the entire Staff's or Admins approval first (as long as I documented it afterward) and if I needed to add a custom script I would have to send that to our head admin "G" for approval first.
When our player base slowed down after a while I even had the time to run "Personal Quests" for some of our more dedicated players. I called them "Personal Quests" because I would work the background of the player created character into the quest and often I would tailor make them just for the specific player. My favorite players were the ones who would both RP and PvP. It's not that I didn't like PvP just for the sake of PvP, but it was always better when it had good RP behind it and was story driven instead of someone just looking for "Kills" or to "Go Red". That's why I always loved portraying evil characters. Very often in the larger quests I would custom make monsters then control them directly during the "boss encounters" during the quests instead of using a scripted AI. Having a GM on the spot running a quest Live adds a whole other layer of depth to a game. Sadly even large corporations wouldn't have the money to maintain a game experience like that. The people they would have to hire would have to have the technical knowledge and be an actor at the same time. If not for the fact that I was volunteering on a Free Shard then it never would of happened. OSI couldn't give me that kind of freedom for obvious legal reasons. You can't predict what a Live person is going to say in a MMO, even a Staff member. That's why even live GM's in OSI who would answer pages and help stuck players would have to follow a pre-written script with standard replies like "I'm sorry, I can not help you with that question/problem. If you are having further difficulty please contact Ultima Online Customer Support at etc etc".
I'm glad that you could enjoy working as much as playing. It's a pity that there were so few hosted events on the core shards, in all my years I came across only 4 or 5, but they were always a step up from even the best dungeon runs or "surprise" PvP moments.
I tried free shards for a while, even tried starting one with a friend, but it fizzled out very quickly. Most servers were frequently deserted, and the best servers were operation under an invitation system that I never found a foothold in. It's a pity many of them weren't more popular because there was such a wealth of creativity and plenty of ideas that could have gone far.
Oh well. I still wander from game to game, trying to recapture that sense of wonder and... limitlessness... UO instilled in me.
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