There is quite a bit of concern (mostly from marketing) that people will be angry when beta 2 comes out because of how much we crippled the betas.
I hope those of you in the beta understand why we did what we did with the betas. Elemental is a new game. It’s been many years since there’s been a new fantasy strategy game made from scratch. As a result, it was important to us that we not rely on 3D graphics or multiplayer in order for the game to have good game mechanics.
Now, some of you may be like me where you’ve played games for decades so you’ll understand where I’m coming from. A GOOD game shouldn’t need super good graphics or high end production values. Tower Defense is an awesome game and it has virtually no graphics. So for Beta 1, we went to considerable efforts to force it to be, well, suck in order to get the beta testers to think about the game AS A GAME rather than as some sort of multimedia experience.
Now, when Beta 2 shows up, obviously with the 3D engine, some of you may feel we were trying to torture you or something. We just wanted to make sure that you guys felt truly free to debate and suggest different game ideas.
When this is all done, we will have to revisit just how much of an impact you guys have had in making the game a BETTER game and how much of that was because of being able to play minus fancy graphics.
Nowadays, it’s very very rare for brand new major PC games to be made. Nearly everything is a sequel or a remake. We felt it important that we take our time and do this right. So while 7 months in beta 1 might have seemed excessive, I think it’ll become clear that giving the beta testers time to debate game mechanics and concepts was worth it.
I'm a little surprised by this sentiment. I think it's been pretty clear from the beginning that we were entering a different sort of beta process. You sold people on the idea that they would get to watch and influence a game from the very early stages. This is an incredibly unique approach in this industry (I want to say it's never been done for a commercial game). Personally, it's very rewarding to see the stages of development, and makes me much more engaged in the final product. I wouldn't expect anyone to be upset at not having all the features through the development for exactly that reason.
Bring on Beta 2!
Awesome. We need more companies that are willing to "do new". Thanks for giving it a shot with this title.
Perhaps it's the fact that I didn't (unfortunately) get into beta 1 as the game went under the radar for me, but I find the post kinda funny, as anyone else would probably go "Here comes beta 2 and it is even more awesome than you thought it could be!" (It might be due to me belonging to the older school of gamers? Still, I find nothing to apologize here. Rather, it seems to me to be more of an issue of marketing thinking about the modern "beta tests" that are more like demos)
Irregardless, I hope I'll be useful in beta 2 when it comes rolling in.
Edit: dropped the excessive use of "perhaps"
I know now after posting my "gimme Beta 2 now before my heart explodes" post that beta 2 is 20 days off or so.
But after realizing I have just posted to the top 10 threads in ideas and my name is on all the last post spots. and that atm I am spending my day forum trolling or opening impulse to see if this game needs updating >.<
That I feel I have really tested everything I can test.
So I Humbly Beseech the Gods Frog and Boogie to push the release of Beta 2 as soon as possible. I feel my Incrediably Scrutinizing Input (In my own mind) is being wasted now. Where as I could be dedicating my Existence to the perfection of you glory. I feel I am not doing your awesomness justice.
(wow I hope groveling works )
Take all the time that is needed I say, but in the end of all this please do not sell us a "lemon". True gamers that understand how hard it is to please everyone and still be "quality and original" know that Greatness is not created it is earned.
We love you too, Brad.We love you too.
On a more serious note, although I might not have contributed a terribly large amount to the Beta, I have enjoyed it immensely. Seeing people get excited about a game, debate the mechanics and ideas and so forth has really inspired me.
Out of curiosity Frogboy, you wouldn't happen to have any jobs going at Stardock, would you?
The marketing team is trying to freak you out Brad! Personally I think that the Beta schedule was perfect. Sure, we had a cloth map only in Beta 1 + most of the gameplay features were not implemented, but at least we could focus on finding bugs/errors/CTDs/lock-ups/etc.
Well I'm definately less mad than I was when I tried to replace a car tyre.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bkaVndO0yg&feature=related
Ok, some how I'll try to contain my fury at Beta 2 being even better than I'd imagined , won't be easy.
Seriously though.....when is it coming it's like not knowing when Christmas is.
Doesn't most of the Civilization series have, with the exception of Food, a global resource pool (e.g. luxuries such as spices etc., materials such as aluminum etc.)?
nice stardock its obvious that if you make a game from scratch it will take long i would be angry if u finished making the game like a month ago coz that would mean u didnt care u just wanted to finish it up faster but you guys take your time and make something awesom...btw will you take your time on GalCiv3 and make it a cool game coz i like it how you make a race and take over worlds and stuff GalCiv 2 was good but felt kinda dead as in i skipped alot of turns coz they didnt realy matter much and planets werent that detailed would be cool to make how your soliders look like in terms of combat on planets and like inter space combat when a ship boards another ship it would be like a mini rts but on a space ship that would be cool lol.chooseing a flagship for the whole empire would be cool like its YOUR ship the king of all your empire
It doesn't bother me one whit that we were playing a severely trimmed back beta, and I doubt it will bother other people. I'm just excited at the idea of the beta taking a quantum leap forward and starting to become fun!
I think any of us that were ever in the industry will understand. There might be some minor backlash from people who never really understood what a "Beta" should be, especially a Public Beta instead of a Internal Alpha. I wouldn't worry about it too much though. Most of the people who might be mad will be blown away by the "Ooooohhhhh, Aaaahhhhhhhh" factor of seeing the 3D Engine in action.
I honestly don't think this will be much of a problem. You guys have been completely open about the process throughout, and explained why you are doing what you are doing. Plus, people are going to caught up with the all the new shiny stuff in the game to be mad at you. Getting mad at you guys now would be like a kid getting mad at his parents because he got his present on Christmas morning instead of two weeks earlier when they bought it
Well, after getting my latest Beta game, with only 3 reloads, upto 1232 Turns, I for one feel it is time to move on.
Can we start to ask about "tweaking" some the different "values" involved this round, even if only a bit. We can call it Balance Beta 1a.... LOL
Anyways. I don't see an issue. I am actually looking forward to it.
We will get more Maps right?
This is my first post.
Daily I check the journal entries and appreciate the close communication that the developers (I think Frogboy is the leader) have with the customer base and beta testers. I cannot wait to play this game! I remember Master of Magic as a masterpiece at the time and had a wish that someone, someday would create a newer game that utilized its template. Elemental appears to be this dream come true (almost there…)
I anticipate many sleepless nights expanding my kingdom, recruiting exotic and powerful allies for my armies, training and shepherding battle-hardened and crack troops, and discovering magic artifacts and new spells, and smashing rival kingdoms and armies. My play style tends to focus on defensive tactics and I try to develop smaller, highly experienced armies, a small cadre of powerful heroes, and well-defended bases. (I prefer quality to quantity)
I am not a beta tester, and multiplayer is not my thing. When I learned about the development of Elemental several months ago I set aside $60 in an envelope and wrote “Elemental” on it. Because I do not have internet at home (I’m posting via my work computer—it’s also how I patch my games) I really wish Stardock would offer a Per-Order with a DVD option. Impulse is not an option for me.
I finally went through the process of signing up so I could congratulate you guys, both developer and beta tester.
Keep it up.
Good Luck and Godspeed Frogboy!
Brad said in the previous thread that it will be early June at least...
I see what you did there marketing guy. Well played.
So it seems you've convinced people here that your game is so good that if someone were to be upset it would be about not having released it earlier...
Rather than considering the marketing guys as the [neccesary] evil this time I'm going to cheer them.
Which means they've fooled me... Well done!
Take your time. We don't need beta 2 right now.. We need it when it's ready!
When the full game is released, I'm going to start on a huge map.. Remember reading in the journals before the beta progress started. That maps could be several times larger then the gigantic maps in civ 4.. And that a map could take several months (possibly years) to complete.. Well, I'm taking that challange! I'm gonna play a insane huge map... And complete it
I think you were sufficiently paranoiac with your THIS IS AN EARLY BETA warnings that it wont be an issue.
Haha, I've never seen a developer pre-apologize because the next release of the game is so much better than the last. I think your marketing team can relax, it isn't like you hyped the game to hell and are releasing a POS. You actually advertised an unfun beta and are giving us a fun beta early... woohoo!!!
I completely concur with your old school, graphics don't mean crap, mentality. Even though I see there are lots of folks that won't give a game a chance if it isn't pretty enough, a game with no depth and shallow fun will only keep my attention for a week. Whatever make the game better, I'm all for.
That depends on if the game ships with the ability to take advantage of a 64 bit environment or only 32 bit. 64 bit management might have to be patched in if it isn't ready by launch.
Global, but you couldn't "use" them.
In Elemental if you have 100 materials and build something that need 25 then you'll only have 75 left. Like in starcraft.
I just hope that this doesn't rush the game to be honest. But if we really are missing as many features as you say Frogboy, then I guess this is A-OK
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