April/May/June 2010 2v2 Demigod Community Tournament - Results Thread

Quoting OMG_NinkiCZ,

Actually I was looking through my replays the other day and noticed you should probably avoid playing a UB, that job should just have stayed with Orcun. I'll post it up when I get home.

Besides, you shouldn't feel the need to vehemently defend for your position. Like you've expressed many times, you're confident enough to take the tournament with your eyes closed. If that's the case, just give them the win and play out the next 2 games since you'll come out with a win anyway. What difference does it make, right?

I haven't had a serious discussion with you in weeks because you're a creepy jerk, so I don't think I've expressed to you many times anything about current issues. True though, we would have to beat them twice in a row anyway. So if the community decides that a game where there was no kills and 2 characters were running around with no armor against a fully equipped UB had a clear cut winner, then who am I to argue.

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You don't have to personally express anything to me, your attitude towards the community is crystal clear from the public posts you are making in these threads.

Best of luck with the next game. I'm sure you'll win with ease as you expect.

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Quoting OMG_BlackHatHedgehog,

reply 598

Blaming me with bending the truth or implying that we cause disconnects on purpose is not understandable by me

I'm 100% joking about intentionally causing DC's. It's demigod and it's an inside joke with OMG related to something Peter said one day. You weren't there.

But, you were using an intercorrect timestamp when the DC occured, regarding both levels and warscore. You were saying from the time point of when the game ended (more than a minute after the DC) and not when the DC occurred, and - apart from the two deaths - that time worked out in your favor as you were only 200 away from WS and had a 14 v 13 level advantage. Hence why it was bending the truth. You may not have been doing in intentionally, but the case you presented was not what was happening at the time at the disconnect.

I say JTreads lets you win engagements because it lets you be more crazy and berserk. It also is basically an instant speed boost while in Rook's towers, enabling you to close the gap faster and proceed to do damage. And it lets you run away with minimal risk. So ... yes?

Orcun even heard it ! Can't believe he doesn't get his own inside joke about him!

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>.< Can we stop the forum drama game for this?

Also, I think the "no armor" argument is a moot point as it wasn't an issue at any point in the game and I had gold to get better armor @ the dc / Kalel would have been able to re-buy it the next time he went shopping.

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^Even if I went home and believed Orcun and Shane should win, that's still 1 vs 3. The win is yours, get on with the next round of games and get this tournament finished.

Quoting OMG_Jona,

reply 603

Orcun even heard it ! Can't believe he doesn't get his own inside joke about him!

I don't think he was in the channel.

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I would personally like to hear the opinions of Pacov / Zen / Mith / Renz / Koush. I realize that some of the opinions currently in here are potentially biased.

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pacov

Join Date 02/2008

+183

Quoting RAWRRRR,

reply 606

I would personally like to hear the opinions of Pacov / Zen / Mith / Renz / Koush. I realize that some of the opinions currently in here are potentially biased.

My opinion is unbiased on this and as fair as possible. Unless its crystal clear one way or the other, my vote would be to throw this out. I haven't reviewed it yet and won't have a chance to do so until MUCH later today. Even though you are all fine players, I think we all understand that all it takes is one mistake on cata late game and its gg. And from what I've read, no one made any big mistakes up to that point. I can watch it, but I'm guessing my opinion will still be the same - looks like one team may have had a slight advantage, but that doesn't mean they would have won the game. Happy to take a look though.

Can any of you say reasonably that one team would have won based on what was happening in the game? Eg - based on what I saw, there was an 80-90% chance X team would have won? If not, then I say throw it out and that's probably the most fair way to handle things.

Also - how are you fellows planning on handling this? The rules say the following:

How will we handle crashes:

If there is a game crash, the players involved in that match should see if they can come to a consensus on the probable outcome of the match. If there is no clear winner, the 2 teams should replay the match using the exact same demigods and sides (light/dark). If there was a clear winner at that point in the game, then that team should be awarded the win. If the 2 teams disagree on the outcome, a third party will review the replay of the match and render a decision. Be aware that the 3rd party must agree that a specific team was going to win or the results will be thrown out and the match redone.

So, it seems like you guys can't agree on the outcome. And now you've requested feedback from multiple 3rd parties... how exactly are you planning on deciding who's opinion will be the deciding factor? Just tallying up the votes of everyone that's following this thread and provides their feedback on who would have won? You can probably bet money that after I watch this, I will be saying throw it out, though. Alot can change in the 4-10 minutes that sound like were left.

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So Mcshane can DC at critical points whenever to learn all of Rawwr's and Kalel's builds thats great.... The game was clearly theirs, all they had to do was tower push one side or middle. McShanes team didn't even have catapults, kalel had all the mid towers down and was instant away from getting giants.... how in the hell is that a throw out game. UB and TB wouldnt be able to hold a portal and push back the giants.. Either mcshane sells his boots and cant steal portals, or they wait for giant money and lose a portal to a tower farm.

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if mc got jboots few mins before the dc, the game was equal minus the towers. Rooks can take down the towers fast but ub/tb has double stunns and become stronger late game. I'd just redo.

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Quoting RAWRRRR,

reply 604

>.< Can we stop the forum drama game for this?

Also, I think the "no armor" argument is a moot point as it wasn't an issue at any point in the game and I had gold to get better armor @ the dc / Kalel would have been able to re-buy it the next time he went shopping.

No he wouldn't have because he came back out with 100 gold and was going to burn a sigil for sure the next engagement so another one next trip back would be more important if he lived.

The only thing that annoys me about this is that everyone was ready to play 2 nights ago but Orcun and I agreed to a practice game which we dominated allowing you to see our builds, so it irritates me to have a disconnect on a game where you merely had better map position thrown back in our face; even more so coming from you who has been in some of the biggest comebacks ever.

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I would gladly write and indepth review of the game and my anaylsis can be reviewed by some of the best players in the game who are not Orcun, Mcshane, Rawrrr and Kalel to determine the winner. If I find the game to be even at the point of desync than the game should be replayed. Anyway I offered this service at the begining of the tourney. Let me know what you guys want.

EDIT: on a side note hedgie did an excellant review a page back but I don't know if it would be the same as mine.

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Dewwww it! I need shit to read at work

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Cool cats yo.

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pacov

Join Date 02/2008

+183

Quoting OMG_ZEX,

reply 611

I would gladly write and indepth review of the game and my anaylsis can be reviewed by some of the best players in the game who are not Orcun, Mcshane, Rawrrr and Kalel to determine the winner. If I find the game to be even at the point of desync than the game should be replayed. Anyway I offered this service at the begining of the tourney. Let me know what you guys want.

I think they should just get on and re-do their game. That said, if you have the time and want to do so, feel free to do a write up, of course. I fully expect you to indicate that Rawr/Kalel have a slight advantage at the point of DC. I'm simply arguing that a slight advantage isn't anywhere close to being a win (and again, please keep in mind my opinion at this point is formed ENTIRELY by feedback from you folks, not having watched the game as I'm unable to atm).

edit - and hedgies stance was throw it out but if you are keeping it, go with rawrrr/kal. I say the slight advantage (as described) isn't enough to ensure a win. So, out.

Anyone - what is the time of the disconnect?

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Watched the replay. A few observations:

Why was Kalel so desperate to get 4 points in tower of light so early when he seldom had up more than 5 towers? More hammer could have helped them get a kill IMHO. Other than that minor point on his build not being quite right for the way he was playing, his playing kicked ass.

Orcun was playing fire TB, but he didn't actually ever push the enemies towers till they were about level 11 - 12 :/ (I know it's easy to criticise, I wasn't there playing so there is only so much I can get out of watching a game once, but on paper that looks and reads like fail)

Also, Orcun arrived way too late on a number of occasions I think. If he TP'd in a couple of times McShane might have actually killed someone. Instead he trundled over normal style a lot and by the time he got there McShane had lost too much HP.

lol RAWRRR was sooooo lucky on at least 4 separate times in this game. McShane must be like "if only I stunned 5 seconds later" That must have been infuriating to say the least

McShane's beast was great, but I think it's fair to say he wasn't supported enough.

I guess McShane will know to take diseased claws earlier next game. QoT got away a few times early game because McShane didn't take claws at level 3. And later QoT had boots of speed so was moving at 6.6, while McShane spent most of the game at 6.3. Albeit Orcun had fire aura, but he wasn't around enough.

It was a fun game to watch. But I'm not sure I can honestly call a winner. I honestly think McShane and Orcun could have easily held out for 3-5 more minutes to get to rank 10 and get giants.

Thinking about the game what I think might have happened is Rook would get set up on the hp side portal and Orcun and McShane would be unable to push tower Rook out. Then while that was going on McShane would probably steal their portal on the other side. What would happen then? Well, it would depend on who made a mistake first I think

I call for a rematch!!!

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Man this was a good game. And rawr got away 4 times under 200hp

So I looked at the money of each player. At this point orcun and mcshane could only afford catapults, not giants.

rawr: 3000

kallel: 5600

orcun: 3000

mcshane: 1000

Kallel had the money for giants. Both sides to Orcun's/mcshane's portal are open. However, right before mcshane disconnected, Kallel and rawr started to lose every 2on2 encounter, where rawr got away very close each time.

With the Giants kallel and rawr would have been able to push and it would take like 5-8 minutes till orcun or mcshane can buy giants.

If orcun's/mcshane's citadel survives till that point with their two portals the game would change in favor of orcun and mcshane. Not much rook and queen can do in a portal fight with giatns on both sides.

Well these are a lot of "ifs"

Now from a pointsystem just judging the game and not going beyond it like in boxing, the game was in clear favor of kallel and rawr.

(Giants, and both sides to the portals free, and the big bucks)

Now judging how the game could have ended, it was free for both teams at this particular point.

(queen rook just suck at portal game when both sides have giants)

Another point to think about is that mcshane disconnected at a point where kallel and rawr had the momentum. Ofcourse i'm not saying that mcshane did this on purpose, however I would be agonized if I were in rawr or kallel's shoes after playing such a good game without any deaths and having a clear chance of a win.

Now looking at the rules "Be aware that the 3rd party must agree that a specific team was going to win or the results will be thrown out and the match redone."

I don't think the third party was ever specified. At least I do not know about it. In my opinion, game results can never be foreseen, unless someone dies 5-10 times on one side.

As a result, the third party has to make the clear decision, do i give the game to the party that had the momentum in the game, or how clear one team would have won, and do I count in the chance of a possible comeback of the disadvantaged team.

pro rawr/kallel

-big money advantage 9,6k gold together (orcun/mcshane 4k gold together and no cats)

-mcshane disconnected

-Giants for at least 5-8minutes longer

-orcun/mcshane around 500 warscore behind 10

pro orcun/mcshane

- chance of comeback if citadel stands till they can afford giants

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based on the comments i would say do a rematch with same dg just like pacov said but if you want me to watch the replay you will have to wait until tmrw since i am quite busy today

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Sudden death.

Lvl 20. Filthy rich. First kill winz.

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agreed. Several comments have said "replay" so... hooray >.<

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Yeah, but McShane had Orb of Defiance. Sell that shiznit, boom, McShane has enough for giants (or almost enough anyway; he could get Orcun to sell it for him instead)

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I don't think there should be a replay if the disconnect happens like, 15-20 minutes in. That's just my view.

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Quoting OMG_DD-shred_demon,

reply 620

Yeah, but McShane had Orb of Defiance. Sell that shiznit, boom, McShane has enough for giants

Your replay bugged, he had sold this for j-treads. But yes, sell J-treads and boom, he has enough for giants

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Quoting OMG_Teseer,

reply 621

I don't think there should be a replay if the disconnect happens like, 15-20 minutes in. That's just my view.

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pacov

Join Date 02/2008

+183

Quoting RAWRRRR,

reply 619

agreed. Several comments have said "replay" so... hooray >.<

It at the very least sounds reasonable.

Quoting OMG_Teseer,

reply 621

I don't think there should be a replay if the disconnect happens like, 15-20 minutes in. That's just my view.

The entire reason we have replays/desyncs in the rules is to mitigate connectivity issues etc... eg it sucks to lose/win a tournament because connectivity and not game play. We have to take on face value that there was no foul play and demigod simply crashed, etc as there not evidence to the contrary that I'm aware of.

Anyway, if these guys replay this and mcshane has connectivity issues again late game, then I'd feel inclined to give a win to rawrr/kalel if circumstances are similar. Not that I have the official say in this because of how we structured things, but meh - I say just replay and let's move on.

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Quoting RAWRRRR,

reply 622

Quoting OMG_DD-shred_demon, reply 620Yeah, but McShane had Orb of Defiance. Sell that shiznit, boom, McShane has enough for giants

Your replay bugged, he had sold this for j-treads. But yes, sell J-treads and boom, he has enough for giants

He must have bought this the last few minutes of the game then

I've just realised I never made my call too explicit. Yes, RAWRRR and Kalel definitely had an advantage. If we were going to call a win on "points" before disconnect the win would go to them. But yeah, McShane and Orcun definitely still had a chance of victory and based on items held were not as poor in terms of accumulated gold as some people are making out.

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