It is difficult to explain the issues of Sins have without going into too much "technical detail" which some may not understand. The main problem is that Sins is an older generation 32 bit game. With a two gigabyte memory limit. This is nothing new. All 32 bit games have a 2 gig memory limit. However Sins is NOT like other 32 bit games. Most games have an ability to load their assets "on the fly", or only as needed. Some games can also unload assets that are not needed. This is how they prevent themselves from reaching the 2 gig limit. Some games have been patched to where they can use up to 4 gigs of ram on 64 bit systems.
Sins also can load only what is needed at game start up, but Sins does NOT unload what it does not use. Any assets that are loaded remain loaded throughout the entire game! If you use all three factions (Six in the case of Rebellion), Then Sins will load ALL of its game assets at start up. Entrenchment, and Diplomacy in some games loaded between 1.7 to 1.9 gigs worth of assets at game start up! Graphic settings, The size of the Map, and the amount of Players, or AI opponents also determine how much ram Sins will use in any given session.In 2006 when Sins was first conceived 32 bit Windows XP was the standard OS of the time. Single core CPU's were also still the standard. Though dual core CPU's were starting to become mainstream, and 2 gigs was considered to be "plenty" of memory. So most game developers at the time didn't have to worry about hitting that dreaded 2 gig brick wall. As time went on Computers, and Sins itself evolved into their present state which is now Rebellion, and soon to be Windows 10 running in multiple core 64 bit systems. With 16+ gigs of ram. Things have changed so much over the years. However Sins still remained the 32 bit game as it was designed in 2006. That uses only a single core of your CPU. With a two gigabyte hard coded memory limit. Sins WILL CRASH when the game reaches that 2 gig limit.There is some misunderstanding about the 2 gig crash issue. The dump happens when Sins reaches 2 gigs of Ram Usage. That means the ram that Sins uses by itself. NOT what your entire operating system, and/or other programs you are running combined uses. Only the ram that Sins uses. No matter how powerful your system is. If it is 32, or 64 bit, or if it is Windows XP, Vista, 7, 8, etc. etc. Sins WILL CRASH when it hits its 2 gig ram limit. It is hard coded into the game.Nobody was aware that this would be a major problem back when the game was first designed, because Sins was designed based on the hardware standards of 2006-2007. Before 64 bit OS's, Quad Core cpu's, and 4+ gig ram systems became the standard that they are now. There is nothing that can be done about it. Except to re-write Sins in 64 bit. Which is out of the question, because it is too cost prohibitive for the developers to do this (Ironclad said so themselves). Sins is a great game, and it is a shame that this is happening. With the Entrenchment, and Diplomacy expansions Ironclad had unintentionally pushed the game over its own hard coded limitations with all of the new added content.
Over the years as of the release of Diplomacy 1.3, and Rebellion. Stardock, and Ironclad did indeed fix all of the major game crashing issues of Sins. Using the fix's from This Project as a guide. However, NONE of these fix's ever made it into Entrenchment, or Original Sins! While the Stardock, and Ironclad developers have fixed most of these issues over years. They can not do anything to change the game itself short of reprogramming Sins over from scratch. The developers can do no more, but there is something that WE can do as modders to prevent Sins from hitting that dreaded 2 gig brick wall, and improve the performance of Sins "just a little bit more". I have taken the initiative, and applied to Sins what i have learned from my Homeworld Modding days. I present to you....
The goal of this project is to improve your Vanilla Sins gaming experience, and to eliminate the 2 gig crash issue. No changes will be made to Original Sins, or any of its Expansions in game play at all. No stat changes will be made. Nothing "new" will be added. There are other mods that can do that. Original Sins will remain Original Sins, and the Expansions will remain as they are. What we are doing is taking what game assets that Sins already has, and we are "optimizing" them to improve the performance, stability, and to moderate the ram usage in game. The side benefit will be that some lower end systems can enjoy almost the same gaming experience as the high end users do (Especially Laptop Users).The project initially started out as an idea to reduce the texture sizes, and poly counts of some models. Not just arbitrary reductions. The goal was to maintain the quality of Sins in game. To make it look as if nothing has been changed at all. We started with optimizations to the Planet's, and Skybox's, because they were the "worst offenders" as far as ram usage, and performance was concerned. Unfortunately my modeling skills left much to be desired in Softimage XSI at the time, and there were un-fixable mesh errors on the optimized planet meshes. Despite that the "proof of concept" was established. A lot of ram was saved, and there was a very noticeable increase in performance.Then we studied the Particle files, and Textures. Many of the particle textures in our opinion were way too high in resolution for the purpose that they served. A reduction in texture resolution by HALF showed no visible difference in game at all! There were some exceptions where the particle resolution reduction difference was very noticeable in game, and those textures were reverted back to their original resolutions. Remember the goal was NOT to reduce in game quality. Also all of the particle textures were changed from TGA format to DDS format, because DDS uses a little less memory, and is much more efficient, because DDS format loads directly into video memory. The particles can also utilize the mip mapping features of DDS format. Where TGA format does not. Therefore enhancing in game video performance (increased FPS). As of version 0.07 no TGA format textures load in TSOP. With the exceptions of the Mouse Cursors, and Scenario Pictures. This is due to those textures being controlled by the hard coded exe. When you change the texture format those textures do not show up in game.The developers mentioned something about a Memory Leak. I heard that a memory leak can be caused by a file searching for something over, and over again if it is not there. Example a mesh file calling for a texture that does not exist. Vanilla Sins had MANY particle, and mesh files that had that issue. We removed all of the entries that pointed to non existent textures in the mesh, and particle files. We also removed the entries that have lines like for example "C;\g\main\datasource\textures\effects\aura4.dds", and just used "aura4.dds". This will default the search to Sins, or the Mods "Textures" folder, and speed things up a bit. Also various typo's were corrected in some mesh, and particle files. Some ships had mesh nulls that were Miss-Labeled. For example the Akkan had nulls, and flairs that were miss-labeled. The engine trails, and flairs didnt show up in game. the Marza was missing its bomb nulls. etc. etc. All of this has been corrected as well. If there is a ships mesh file in the mods "Mesh" folder then it had something wrong with it that was fixed. The Soundata, and Galaxydef files had errors too. Regardless if any of these issues caused any memory leaks, or not these issues MUST be fixed! (and they were as of Diplomacy 1.3, but NOT for Original Sins, or Entrenchment).After the Meshes, Particles, Textures, and the User Interface were optimized, and the very obvious issues were fixed there was a tremendous boost in game performance. Sins ram usage was greatly reduced. As of TSOP 0.07 I could run a game of Entrenchment, or Diplomacy ALL DAY, and I NEVER used more than 1.5 gigs of ram! This was using Maximum Settings. Including Bloom enabled. Tested on Huge Random Multi Star maps with 9 AI's. The 2 gig crash problem has been solved! Our primary goal with this project has been achieved! Without having to use any external memory increasing programs! Stardock, and Ironclad took notice, and they used TSOP as a guide in the Diplomacy 1.3 patch, and for developing Rebellion.Now that the Stardock, and Ironclad have fixed the issues of the game as of Diplomacy 1.3, and Rebellion. TSOP has been focusing more on Original Sins, and Entrenchment. Since the Ironclad/Stardock fixes never made it into Original Sins, or Entrenchment. However, That is not stopping us from optimizing Diplomacy, or Rebellion "just a little bit more" You can also use Large Address Aware to give Sins an extra gig to play with, but in vanilla Original Sins, and Entrenchment the Endless Search Loop issues that were never fixed will cause the game to eventually go over that extra gig (Run vanilla Entrenchment, and watch your ram usage keep going up, and up, and up). TSOP is a solution that will stop that issue.
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Downloads
The Sins Optimization Project v1.0
For Original Sins 1.195
For Entrenchment 1.055
For Diplomacy 1.37
Stardock, and Ironclad fixed all of the issues that compelled us to make TSOP. Therefore there is no TSOP for Diplomacy
For Rebellion 1.82
As with Diplomacy, Stardock, and Ironclad fixed all of the issues that TSOP pointed out, and then some in the case of Rebellion. Sins: Rebellion is as optimized as any Sins game is going to get.
NOTE: TSOP 0.07 is still hosted on ModDB, and it still works in the current versions of Trinity (OS, E, and D), but you will be playing as if Sins was patched to an older version of the game. Plus some Icons and Buttons wont be visible.
Changes in TSOP 1.0
TSOP 1.0 updated to the latest versions of Original Sins, and Entrenchment.
The User Interface is completely overhauled to use pure DDS format.
Trade Ships, Strike Craft, Mines, and Constructor Unit Meshes, and Textures are Optimized.
Starbase Textures are optimized mimicking the Stardock Rebellion Optimizations.
Sounds, and Music are optimized.
All TGA format Textures are replaced with DDS format, and TSOP "force" loads them. The only TGA textures that remain are the Mouse Cursers, and Scenario Pictures. This is due to hard code in the EXE.
"Strategic Texture Reductions" for the Particles return using newer methods to create a better looking texture.
(Original Sins, and Entrenchment) Many Mesh Null issues, and various File Errors were corrected, and Unnecessary Text Entry's were removed in both the Mesh, and Particle files. Entry's pointing to Non Existent Textures in both the mesh, and particle files removed. See the various "Fixed Files" texts in the mods Read Me for details.
(Original Sins, and Entrenchment) The Diplomacy 1.3 graphic fix's have been incorporated into the Original Sins, and Entrenchment versions of TSOP (Pipeline Effects, "White Line" error fix, and Corrected Mesh files).
TSOP 1.0 for Trinity will see the return of Optimized Planets using the planet meshes from Rebellion! but with our Optimized Original Sins Textures!
There will be no version of TSOP made for Diplomacy, or Rebellion, because there is no need for it. Only Original Sins, and Entrenchment need TSOP, because the 2 gig issue, and various other issues were never fixed in those two versions of the game.
This is the FINAL version of TSOP that i will make. If the community wants to take over the project they are more than welcome to.
Community input, and contributions are more than welcome, and they are encouraged! This is a Community Project! All can pitch in!
Note: TSOP does not fix the known issue of "Late Game Lag". It does help prolong the lag until further into the game in some cases, but sooner, or later the lag will happen. The late game lag issue is a CPU issue due to the fact that Sins (including Rebellion) is optimized to use only single core processors. Therefore Sins will use only one core in multi core CPU's. To help with the late game lag issue we recommend the following:
Playing on smaller maps.
Using fewer AI opponents.
Disabling the Trade Ship icons (this actually helps out a lot)
Stacking the icons in the empire tree (same as with disabling trade ship icons the less icons rendered the better).
Using a Strike Craft Reduction mod (The many strike craft in the game are a big CPU hog. There are some good strike craft mods that reduce the number, but maintain the balance. Search for them).
You do not need to download all versions of TSOP. You only need to download the version of TSOP for the specific version of Sins you wish to play. The Retail version of Trinity is just all three versions of Sins bundled into one package. Installation for Trinity versions of Sins are no different than if you purchased each version of Sins separately.
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Other mods are more than welcome to use TSOP. No questions asked! In fact we encourage it! Learn from it! Use it as guide, and an example! Merge it into your projects!
TSOP is intended to be a Stand Alone mod. Run with no other mods enabled. There are issues enabling TSOP with other mods. Enabling with other "Graphic Enhancement" mods is NOT recommended, because the graphic enhancement mod will defeat the entire purpose of TSOP. All of our optimized files will be overridden by that enhancement mods "enhanced" files. Increasing your ram usage instead of decreasing it. Some enhancement mods like Distant Stars are incorporating elements of TSOP into their future updates.
Read the included READ ME text's for installation instructions.
If you guys want 30 minutes, I can do that. I would urge the most conservative possible settings on this though, and perhaps 45 minutes would be safer? If they go a bit long and a couple extra patrols are waiting at the base, that just makes for a good exciting fight. Hardly bogs down the whole game. This is as opposed to indefinite lifetime. Is everyone sure 30 minutes is long enough to reach the farthest conceivable destination, and still have over 5 minutes to fight? The timer starts the instant they spawn, not the instant they make the first jump away from the pirate base.
I dont have very much time to test at the moment, but others players can test it and tell us how long you think the raids should last. You are probably right, and 45 minutes is plenty of time, and will still clear in time for there not be a performance hit. Testers tell us what you think.
I agree at 45 mins
Ok here's a new version with a 45 minute timer for the testers to play with.
v 0.92
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=FI0Z3S2Y
And here is a test version that makes the pirates blow up in only 5 mins, so people who want to test it can have an easier time doing so. They shouldn't get more than 3 planets or so away from the pirates base before they blow up.
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=1MCVU3RS
Wow--great job guys. Can you include instructions on how to alter the time for pirates--so we can adjust it ourselves if needed as players?
Ok after install, you go into \GameInfo\BuffSelfE.entity
look for the lines:
instantAction buffInstantActionType "MakeDead" instantActionTriggerType "OnDelay" delayTime 300.000000
Change delayTime to the number of seconds you desire. So 30 mins = 1800.000000
Karma for you Xalderon for doing what i thought could not be done.
Awesome--thanks much for the response! I am still wondering why you guys don't start your own game company
btw, was the spacemine optimisaztion already implemented in 0.07?
nope. maybe we can make a small patch. Those complete sets take hours to upload.
small patch would be wonderfull, was planning to go lanning with a bunch of my buddies, but only one of the pc's is actualy quite good ..and landmines ARE quite nice ^^
Will do like i did with the construction ships add on, then on the update after they will be fully incorporated. Same with the trade ship, and strike craft add ons depending on how well the testing goes.
Sorry i havent been on lately. RL work crazy as always and leaving little time for anything else.
stress, do not worry about us, we will survive, but it is normal for RL to try to take all. we just have to figure out how to have time for ourselves to balance the need to work to live instead of work wanting us to live to work.
harpo
Aye, Stress you've got you're priorities strait, we're ok on the backburner, it's still warm =D. Providin for your livin and those ya support's what chya gotta do. Go take care of yer home life things, we'll still be here when ya get back,unless we're doin the same in which case, leave us a note too!!!
BadTune~ What the hell is that thumping noise?~
Just wanted to say thanks for a great mod.
Just played a huge map with 5 stars vs 9 Cruel AIs. Three hours in and I was running a sleek 480 MBs with TSOP v0.07 for Diplomacy + the cargo ship reduction mod. Sadly I still got bit by the huge CPU slowdown and had to call a halt to it as I was getting like 2 fps on x4 speed. Got so bad I had to keep hitting pause just so the program would actually recognize a move, combat or build order. Still TSOP did its job most excellently. So kudos to Major Stress and the rest of the TSOP team
Btw anyone else notice that when the game is paused, zooming and panning and giving orders is smooth but when running everything is immediately slow as molasses on bigger maps once fleets get large? Makes you wonder if there is something in the code regarding movement / combat updates that chokes the CPU. My CPU is substandard but I have the feeling there may be something that scales superlinearly in the code base. Just a theory.
we all know major stress is busy right?
but dident someone else make the optimised mines? would it be possible for that person to upload em somewhere in the meantime then maybe? so we dont need to bother the major for it ?
SivCorp made optimized mines. The problem is he cant import them into sins himself. I have the meshes but have not had time to convert them (need to re-install XSI along with the rest of my modeling programs for my new box). Work has been crazy for me lately, but ill see if i can find some free time to get it done.
On another note. I tried to merge all of the add-ons for the 0.08 update (fighter self recovery, timed pirates, less trade ships, and strike craft), but am meeting with failure. Dump city. I know its because i am not adding something to ether the manifests or the entitys themselves. I really dont have time to troubleshoot this. Can the TSOP team see what they can do to incorporate this stuff?
stress it is the extra entity(s) for the timed pirates and autodock strikecraft, I did do this for myself and that is what I found, I just stacked all the addons into a single folder & used my manifest maker.
I could probably get the mines ready in XSI. I can also do the merging if thats what we really want. I thought we were keeping things pure? Either way is good to me.
Edit: is anyone working on a more powerful mine reduction? Has the auto docking SC been thoroughly tested?
I put the weebly and everything on hold because I have put off my own mod long enough
A big draw for this project both for myself and likely for it's potential future as a direct patch ad-on from IronClad is if gameplay functionality does NOT change. This concerns the reduction in the number of trade vessels (which I and others actually attack in multi-player games to prevent resources) as well as fighters doing goofy things, etc.
If you mess with actual gameplay mechanics, I can almost 100% garuntee that this mod will not be accepted as a patch due to the fact that you are in fact changing gameplay aspects rather than just changing the resources required for the stock game.
I would like to see and continue to play further optimized versions that do not affect gameplay. Just a thought. Think about it.
a good point boshimi336
Good point indeed.
Our goal is to make TSOP an official sins bug fix patch.
Over-enthusiasm got the better of me (even i am not immune to it). I wanted to see for myself how all of the add ons worked, and affected the game. However Boshimi is right. If we want TSOP to become an official patch we can not mess with the gameplay, or balance at all. There is indeed another topic for balance issues, and a community effort to fix them. I believe it is in the general forum.
That being said the game changing add ons must remain as add ons. Unless it is an add on which does not effect the gameplay like the earlier construction ship add on, and the current texture correction add on. Those types of add ons will be incorporated into the next main update. They usually are released as add ons because there is no point in making everyone re-download TSOP only for a few fixed files.
Do not get me wrong the effort that was put into these add ons is outstanding. Bordering on masterful. The pirate raid expiration i thought could not be done at all. Along with the self docking strike craft. As beneficial as they are they do indeed effect Sins gameplay, and reluctantly they cannot be fully incorporated into TSOP. We will still keep them as optional add ons for those that want them If it is proven that they do not effect the balance or gameplay then their omission shall be reconsidered.
I know this is confusing to you all. You all are probably saying "make up your freaking mind stress!". After working 14 hour days i dont have much of a mind left to make up However the main goal of the project stands. To improve Sins without altering the gameplay and/or balance of the game. I almost broke my own rule. Its nice to have a community that put you back on track
damn man, 14 hour days ? please dont forget the tiny detail called 'sleep' and 'taking care of yourself' will you stress but oke okey , all game changers shall be addons, all the'you wont notice this, but your processor will' stuff in the main thing.
With the pirates timing out, it was always my intention and understanding it would be part of an addon for those who wanted to take additional steps to speed up their game, like with the strike craft reduction. The pirates building up at the base is an aspect of vanilla Sins, however, and I expected TSOP itself would not change this. After all, I often enjoy going to the pirate base and cleaning up all those pirates myself.
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