It is difficult to explain the issues of Sins have without going into too much "technical detail" which some may not understand. The main problem is that Sins is an older generation 32 bit game. With a two gigabyte memory limit. This is nothing new. All 32 bit games have a 2 gig memory limit. However Sins is NOT like other 32 bit games. Most games have an ability to load their assets "on the fly", or only as needed. Some games can also unload assets that are not needed. This is how they prevent themselves from reaching the 2 gig limit. Some games have been patched to where they can use up to 4 gigs of ram on 64 bit systems.
Sins also can load only what is needed at game start up, but Sins does NOT unload what it does not use. Any assets that are loaded remain loaded throughout the entire game! If you use all three factions (Six in the case of Rebellion), Then Sins will load ALL of its game assets at start up. Entrenchment, and Diplomacy in some games loaded between 1.7 to 1.9 gigs worth of assets at game start up! Graphic settings, The size of the Map, and the amount of Players, or AI opponents also determine how much ram Sins will use in any given session.In 2006 when Sins was first conceived 32 bit Windows XP was the standard OS of the time. Single core CPU's were also still the standard. Though dual core CPU's were starting to become mainstream, and 2 gigs was considered to be "plenty" of memory. So most game developers at the time didn't have to worry about hitting that dreaded 2 gig brick wall. As time went on Computers, and Sins itself evolved into their present state which is now Rebellion, and soon to be Windows 10 running in multiple core 64 bit systems. With 16+ gigs of ram. Things have changed so much over the years. However Sins still remained the 32 bit game as it was designed in 2006. That uses only a single core of your CPU. With a two gigabyte hard coded memory limit. Sins WILL CRASH when the game reaches that 2 gig limit.There is some misunderstanding about the 2 gig crash issue. The dump happens when Sins reaches 2 gigs of Ram Usage. That means the ram that Sins uses by itself. NOT what your entire operating system, and/or other programs you are running combined uses. Only the ram that Sins uses. No matter how powerful your system is. If it is 32, or 64 bit, or if it is Windows XP, Vista, 7, 8, etc. etc. Sins WILL CRASH when it hits its 2 gig ram limit. It is hard coded into the game.Nobody was aware that this would be a major problem back when the game was first designed, because Sins was designed based on the hardware standards of 2006-2007. Before 64 bit OS's, Quad Core cpu's, and 4+ gig ram systems became the standard that they are now. There is nothing that can be done about it. Except to re-write Sins in 64 bit. Which is out of the question, because it is too cost prohibitive for the developers to do this (Ironclad said so themselves). Sins is a great game, and it is a shame that this is happening. With the Entrenchment, and Diplomacy expansions Ironclad had unintentionally pushed the game over its own hard coded limitations with all of the new added content.
Over the years as of the release of Diplomacy 1.3, and Rebellion. Stardock, and Ironclad did indeed fix all of the major game crashing issues of Sins. Using the fix's from This Project as a guide. However, NONE of these fix's ever made it into Entrenchment, or Original Sins! While the Stardock, and Ironclad developers have fixed most of these issues over years. They can not do anything to change the game itself short of reprogramming Sins over from scratch. The developers can do no more, but there is something that WE can do as modders to prevent Sins from hitting that dreaded 2 gig brick wall, and improve the performance of Sins "just a little bit more". I have taken the initiative, and applied to Sins what i have learned from my Homeworld Modding days. I present to you....
The goal of this project is to improve your Vanilla Sins gaming experience, and to eliminate the 2 gig crash issue. No changes will be made to Original Sins, or any of its Expansions in game play at all. No stat changes will be made. Nothing "new" will be added. There are other mods that can do that. Original Sins will remain Original Sins, and the Expansions will remain as they are. What we are doing is taking what game assets that Sins already has, and we are "optimizing" them to improve the performance, stability, and to moderate the ram usage in game. The side benefit will be that some lower end systems can enjoy almost the same gaming experience as the high end users do (Especially Laptop Users).The project initially started out as an idea to reduce the texture sizes, and poly counts of some models. Not just arbitrary reductions. The goal was to maintain the quality of Sins in game. To make it look as if nothing has been changed at all. We started with optimizations to the Planet's, and Skybox's, because they were the "worst offenders" as far as ram usage, and performance was concerned. Unfortunately my modeling skills left much to be desired in Softimage XSI at the time, and there were un-fixable mesh errors on the optimized planet meshes. Despite that the "proof of concept" was established. A lot of ram was saved, and there was a very noticeable increase in performance.Then we studied the Particle files, and Textures. Many of the particle textures in our opinion were way too high in resolution for the purpose that they served. A reduction in texture resolution by HALF showed no visible difference in game at all! There were some exceptions where the particle resolution reduction difference was very noticeable in game, and those textures were reverted back to their original resolutions. Remember the goal was NOT to reduce in game quality. Also all of the particle textures were changed from TGA format to DDS format, because DDS uses a little less memory, and is much more efficient, because DDS format loads directly into video memory. The particles can also utilize the mip mapping features of DDS format. Where TGA format does not. Therefore enhancing in game video performance (increased FPS). As of version 0.07 no TGA format textures load in TSOP. With the exceptions of the Mouse Cursors, and Scenario Pictures. This is due to those textures being controlled by the hard coded exe. When you change the texture format those textures do not show up in game.The developers mentioned something about a Memory Leak. I heard that a memory leak can be caused by a file searching for something over, and over again if it is not there. Example a mesh file calling for a texture that does not exist. Vanilla Sins had MANY particle, and mesh files that had that issue. We removed all of the entries that pointed to non existent textures in the mesh, and particle files. We also removed the entries that have lines like for example "C;\g\main\datasource\textures\effects\aura4.dds", and just used "aura4.dds". This will default the search to Sins, or the Mods "Textures" folder, and speed things up a bit. Also various typo's were corrected in some mesh, and particle files. Some ships had mesh nulls that were Miss-Labeled. For example the Akkan had nulls, and flairs that were miss-labeled. The engine trails, and flairs didnt show up in game. the Marza was missing its bomb nulls. etc. etc. All of this has been corrected as well. If there is a ships mesh file in the mods "Mesh" folder then it had something wrong with it that was fixed. The Soundata, and Galaxydef files had errors too. Regardless if any of these issues caused any memory leaks, or not these issues MUST be fixed! (and they were as of Diplomacy 1.3, but NOT for Original Sins, or Entrenchment).After the Meshes, Particles, Textures, and the User Interface were optimized, and the very obvious issues were fixed there was a tremendous boost in game performance. Sins ram usage was greatly reduced. As of TSOP 0.07 I could run a game of Entrenchment, or Diplomacy ALL DAY, and I NEVER used more than 1.5 gigs of ram! This was using Maximum Settings. Including Bloom enabled. Tested on Huge Random Multi Star maps with 9 AI's. The 2 gig crash problem has been solved! Our primary goal with this project has been achieved! Without having to use any external memory increasing programs! Stardock, and Ironclad took notice, and they used TSOP as a guide in the Diplomacy 1.3 patch, and for developing Rebellion.Now that the Stardock, and Ironclad have fixed the issues of the game as of Diplomacy 1.3, and Rebellion. TSOP has been focusing more on Original Sins, and Entrenchment. Since the Ironclad/Stardock fixes never made it into Original Sins, or Entrenchment. However, That is not stopping us from optimizing Diplomacy, or Rebellion "just a little bit more" You can also use Large Address Aware to give Sins an extra gig to play with, but in vanilla Original Sins, and Entrenchment the Endless Search Loop issues that were never fixed will cause the game to eventually go over that extra gig (Run vanilla Entrenchment, and watch your ram usage keep going up, and up, and up). TSOP is a solution that will stop that issue.
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Downloads
The Sins Optimization Project v1.0
For Original Sins 1.195
For Entrenchment 1.055
For Diplomacy 1.37
Stardock, and Ironclad fixed all of the issues that compelled us to make TSOP. Therefore there is no TSOP for Diplomacy
For Rebellion 1.82
As with Diplomacy, Stardock, and Ironclad fixed all of the issues that TSOP pointed out, and then some in the case of Rebellion. Sins: Rebellion is as optimized as any Sins game is going to get.
NOTE: TSOP 0.07 is still hosted on ModDB, and it still works in the current versions of Trinity (OS, E, and D), but you will be playing as if Sins was patched to an older version of the game. Plus some Icons and Buttons wont be visible.
Changes in TSOP 1.0
TSOP 1.0 updated to the latest versions of Original Sins, and Entrenchment.
The User Interface is completely overhauled to use pure DDS format.
Trade Ships, Strike Craft, Mines, and Constructor Unit Meshes, and Textures are Optimized.
Starbase Textures are optimized mimicking the Stardock Rebellion Optimizations.
Sounds, and Music are optimized.
All TGA format Textures are replaced with DDS format, and TSOP "force" loads them. The only TGA textures that remain are the Mouse Cursers, and Scenario Pictures. This is due to hard code in the EXE.
"Strategic Texture Reductions" for the Particles return using newer methods to create a better looking texture.
(Original Sins, and Entrenchment) Many Mesh Null issues, and various File Errors were corrected, and Unnecessary Text Entry's were removed in both the Mesh, and Particle files. Entry's pointing to Non Existent Textures in both the mesh, and particle files removed. See the various "Fixed Files" texts in the mods Read Me for details.
(Original Sins, and Entrenchment) The Diplomacy 1.3 graphic fix's have been incorporated into the Original Sins, and Entrenchment versions of TSOP (Pipeline Effects, "White Line" error fix, and Corrected Mesh files).
TSOP 1.0 for Trinity will see the return of Optimized Planets using the planet meshes from Rebellion! but with our Optimized Original Sins Textures!
There will be no version of TSOP made for Diplomacy, or Rebellion, because there is no need for it. Only Original Sins, and Entrenchment need TSOP, because the 2 gig issue, and various other issues were never fixed in those two versions of the game.
This is the FINAL version of TSOP that i will make. If the community wants to take over the project they are more than welcome to.
Community input, and contributions are more than welcome, and they are encouraged! This is a Community Project! All can pitch in!
Note: TSOP does not fix the known issue of "Late Game Lag". It does help prolong the lag until further into the game in some cases, but sooner, or later the lag will happen. The late game lag issue is a CPU issue due to the fact that Sins (including Rebellion) is optimized to use only single core processors. Therefore Sins will use only one core in multi core CPU's. To help with the late game lag issue we recommend the following:
Playing on smaller maps.
Using fewer AI opponents.
Disabling the Trade Ship icons (this actually helps out a lot)
Stacking the icons in the empire tree (same as with disabling trade ship icons the less icons rendered the better).
Using a Strike Craft Reduction mod (The many strike craft in the game are a big CPU hog. There are some good strike craft mods that reduce the number, but maintain the balance. Search for them).
You do not need to download all versions of TSOP. You only need to download the version of TSOP for the specific version of Sins you wish to play. The Retail version of Trinity is just all three versions of Sins bundled into one package. Installation for Trinity versions of Sins are no different than if you purchased each version of Sins separately.
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Other mods are more than welcome to use TSOP. No questions asked! In fact we encourage it! Learn from it! Use it as guide, and an example! Merge it into your projects!
TSOP is intended to be a Stand Alone mod. Run with no other mods enabled. There are issues enabling TSOP with other mods. Enabling with other "Graphic Enhancement" mods is NOT recommended, because the graphic enhancement mod will defeat the entire purpose of TSOP. All of our optimized files will be overridden by that enhancement mods "enhanced" files. Increasing your ram usage instead of decreasing it. Some enhancement mods like Distant Stars are incorporating elements of TSOP into their future updates.
Read the included READ ME text's for installation instructions.
What happens if you render in a really small resolution?
Absolutely nothing. No change. Same on laptop as on my desktop.
Hi Major Stress,
Thanks for your hard work and insights ... you're taking Sins and Sins Modding to a new level!
In terms of game slowdown (framerate), in my development I have notice that some abilities can be CPU hogs, that is when you have say 20,30,40, ... ships using the same ability.
I had this problem when I tried adapting the ability "DamageOverTimeAura" and changing useCostType from passive to antimatter. I also wonder if re-balancing one or more of the variables: actionIntervalTime, range, maxTargetCount, would help. For instance, have the ability used less frequently, and/or with a reduced range and/or with less targets, but be more potent.
Anotherexample, playing Entrenchment 1-1 on a small map, I come to the end of the game I don't build mines then I have no problems. However, if I build mines (advent style), 150 on each planet (say on 10 planets) the game slows down - as you say it becomes a slideshow. The mines are just sitting there supposedly inactive! No, they must be using there ability of searching/tracking. I find it hard to believe that having hundreds of the same small structure just sitting there could effect CPU usage unless they are not just sitting there.
Basically, my conclusion is that late game slow down is because of ability use, lots of abilities being used, some being more efficient than others. I will be visiting this issue myself shortly.
I know when it comes to the mines we at DS cut down on the amount possible to build (50) and increased their range and strength. This helped a lot and ironically made them more useful.
Thanks for the responses. Ability inefficiency seems like that could be the problem.
My thought is that the AI is keeping track of so many units at once. PLUS their behaviors. PLUS all of the ability's, and effects. Eating up CPU, but my cpu never goes above 40% running a core i5. Laptop centrino dual core it creeps to 70%. Unfortunetly my industrial art Sempron 3100 died (RIP beta box). So i cant test on that anymore. It didnt matter the game always ran at 100% on the sempron. I just hope this is not like Klingon Academy where the better machine you have the worse the game runs.
I am working on Original Sins right now. So there are no mines, or starbase's so that shouldnt be the slowdown issue.
I would like to ask about shield meshes for ships and structures.
Sins has about 60, entrenchment/diplomacy add an additional 10-20. So in total you have between 60-80 different shield meshes. As you know there are two general types: conformal (follow the ship/structure shape) and non-conformal (typically tear shaped). Of the race's the TEC's generally use non-conformal shields while the Advent and Vasari use conformal shields.
If you make all your shield meshes non-conformal (tear shaped). and you create shield classes say 1 for frigates, 1 for cruisers, 1 for capitals, etc and you make them common to all races (or you could have race sets) you can save up to 60-70 meshes. Of course, in this process you have changed the visuals for shield impacts.
The reason I ask is that I had to do this for my mod because of the arbitrary 400 mesh count limit ( I believe its changed to 800 since).
I have been trying to do a good title for the web page or even the OP, need some input.
or the more classic
I think the 2nd is a little bright and harder on the eyes.
Like the first one. The Vasari pointing to the title is a nice effect.
That would be on the 2nd as well just dint bother to save as a separate pic to fit on the thread.
You can view the pages here but they are not done, any input is welcome.
Each shield mesh is scaled, and fitted to the particular ship, or structure it is used for. Which is why there are so many.
The idea of standard shield mesh types has merit. The issue is if say we used 1 type for captials it will have to be scaled to the largest capital ship. Which means a small cap ship will have a huge shield mesh. A shield mesh scaled to the Marza would look stupid on a Sova.
No it will not effect the visuals for shield impacts because those are particles.
SoA2 uses "bubble" shields, but we did not standardize them because of the wide range of ship scales
For for Original Sins Races (and 3 new races) I use the following "bubble" shields,
Shields_Capital_Large.mesh, Shields_Capital_Small.meshShields_Cruiser_Large.mesh, Shields_Cruiser_Small.meshShields_Frigate_Large.mesh, Shields_Frigate_Small.mesh
That's 6 not 60 (original races) [+60 (say for the new races)]!
I said, "Of course, in this process you have changed the visuals for shield impacts.", you said "No it will not effect the visuals for shield impacts because those are particles.". What I meant was the point you made elsewhere regarding scaling/fitting .. basically how closely fitting does a shield have to be, to be aesthetically pleasing (in battle when taking hits)? Because I personally don't mind "bubble" shields and these shields being, say, 20% larger than they should be and not exactly conforming to the ship.
Another thought is to just remove the shield meshes completely. The ships will still have shields, but no shield effect. Assume they all have hull huggers.
Good thought, shield mesh = ship mesh ... not sure if people would complain or notice.
I have tried it both ways. Having shields does add interest, that is, up close, but ...
Maybe we could just look at the poly counts on the shield meshes as well. I very much like the idea of keeping the game AS-IS but running better. Or how about a TSOP add-on that does change some game-play aspects but it is optional.
EDIT: Does it really matter about the different shield meshes or is it more the total poly count rendered in-game?
I dont think shields make that big of an impact on FPS. I can do a test with all shield meshes removed, and see if that makes any difference. I would prefer if we left them as is, or if SivCorp can work his magic on them. The few i looked at the poly counts were not really that high.
I dont think its about total poly counts anymore. My new system is an intel core i5 3.2 gig cpu, 6 gigs ddr3 ram with a gforce gt-220 1 gig video card. Sins with TSOP "should" SMOKE on it, and it does in the early game, but i get the same late/end game lag as i got on my old Sempron 3100 machine, and what i get on my dual core laptop. The same late game lag everyone gets. No matter what the effects settings are. Though on my laptop i cant run high because of crappy GPU. This is only on Original Sins. Not Entrenchment. Not Diplomacy. I havent rigged 0.07 for the expansions yet.
I did read a couple articles and the total poly count will make an overall difference but there needs to be more done than strike craft, cargo ships and constructors.
I imported a bunch of the shield meshes into XSI and they look like there just larger, lower poly copies of the ship. We could save a lot of polys by making more of these just a bubble shape for frigates anyway. Keep the cap ships as is as there is not that many in-game and are probably zoomed in on the most.
So I went through those video tutorials and found this one for XSI but I am not really that experienced in modeling so it will take me awhile to test this out on some models.
awesome video ^^ if that works that easy you can reduce the polygons of all models within hours without loosing much of the detail
Even with my import script it will take a few hours just importing but I have 70% already done with another script that saves to dotXSI and converts to mesh and saves to my mod with one click.
Hopefully other modelers might also make use of that video as well.
Awesome!, that will be extremely helpful in reducing polys for my models. A lot of the models that I do usually end up at around 8k to 10k poly's or more!
NumVertices 8608 or NumVertices 7584 see if you can spot the difference. This is with a 10% reduction. With a 5% brought it to about 8000 but hell i've been playin this fo years and never zoomed and inspected a model this much.
I could probably do every model in the game in a day or 2 once we agree on an amount.
The 'lattice' struts (top and side) seem to be garbled.
yeah both cranes and the comando bride looks a little deformed
NumVertices 8608 to NumVertices 8132 with a 5% reduction.This probably 1 of the most detailed structures, thats why I started with this.
Are there any mirrors for the Trinity Optimization?
Filefront is the most problematic an unreliable gaming file download system on the face of the planet(old news).
It keeps telling me the link is broken in Chrome, Firefox and IE.
And help is appreciated, Thanks.
see this reply from myfist0
harpo
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