It is difficult to explain the issues of Sins have without going into too much "technical detail" which some may not understand. The main problem is that Sins is an older generation 32 bit game. With a two gigabyte memory limit. This is nothing new. All 32 bit games have a 2 gig memory limit. However Sins is NOT like other 32 bit games. Most games have an ability to load their assets "on the fly", or only as needed. Some games can also unload assets that are not needed. This is how they prevent themselves from reaching the 2 gig limit. Some games have been patched to where they can use up to 4 gigs of ram on 64 bit systems.
Sins also can load only what is needed at game start up, but Sins does NOT unload what it does not use. Any assets that are loaded remain loaded throughout the entire game! If you use all three factions (Six in the case of Rebellion), Then Sins will load ALL of its game assets at start up. Entrenchment, and Diplomacy in some games loaded between 1.7 to 1.9 gigs worth of assets at game start up! Graphic settings, The size of the Map, and the amount of Players, or AI opponents also determine how much ram Sins will use in any given session.In 2006 when Sins was first conceived 32 bit Windows XP was the standard OS of the time. Single core CPU's were also still the standard. Though dual core CPU's were starting to become mainstream, and 2 gigs was considered to be "plenty" of memory. So most game developers at the time didn't have to worry about hitting that dreaded 2 gig brick wall. As time went on Computers, and Sins itself evolved into their present state which is now Rebellion, and soon to be Windows 10 running in multiple core 64 bit systems. With 16+ gigs of ram. Things have changed so much over the years. However Sins still remained the 32 bit game as it was designed in 2006. That uses only a single core of your CPU. With a two gigabyte hard coded memory limit. Sins WILL CRASH when the game reaches that 2 gig limit.There is some misunderstanding about the 2 gig crash issue. The dump happens when Sins reaches 2 gigs of Ram Usage. That means the ram that Sins uses by itself. NOT what your entire operating system, and/or other programs you are running combined uses. Only the ram that Sins uses. No matter how powerful your system is. If it is 32, or 64 bit, or if it is Windows XP, Vista, 7, 8, etc. etc. Sins WILL CRASH when it hits its 2 gig ram limit. It is hard coded into the game.Nobody was aware that this would be a major problem back when the game was first designed, because Sins was designed based on the hardware standards of 2006-2007. Before 64 bit OS's, Quad Core cpu's, and 4+ gig ram systems became the standard that they are now. There is nothing that can be done about it. Except to re-write Sins in 64 bit. Which is out of the question, because it is too cost prohibitive for the developers to do this (Ironclad said so themselves). Sins is a great game, and it is a shame that this is happening. With the Entrenchment, and Diplomacy expansions Ironclad had unintentionally pushed the game over its own hard coded limitations with all of the new added content.
Over the years as of the release of Diplomacy 1.3, and Rebellion. Stardock, and Ironclad did indeed fix all of the major game crashing issues of Sins. Using the fix's from This Project as a guide. However, NONE of these fix's ever made it into Entrenchment, or Original Sins! While the Stardock, and Ironclad developers have fixed most of these issues over years. They can not do anything to change the game itself short of reprogramming Sins over from scratch. The developers can do no more, but there is something that WE can do as modders to prevent Sins from hitting that dreaded 2 gig brick wall, and improve the performance of Sins "just a little bit more". I have taken the initiative, and applied to Sins what i have learned from my Homeworld Modding days. I present to you....
The goal of this project is to improve your Vanilla Sins gaming experience, and to eliminate the 2 gig crash issue. No changes will be made to Original Sins, or any of its Expansions in game play at all. No stat changes will be made. Nothing "new" will be added. There are other mods that can do that. Original Sins will remain Original Sins, and the Expansions will remain as they are. What we are doing is taking what game assets that Sins already has, and we are "optimizing" them to improve the performance, stability, and to moderate the ram usage in game. The side benefit will be that some lower end systems can enjoy almost the same gaming experience as the high end users do (Especially Laptop Users).The project initially started out as an idea to reduce the texture sizes, and poly counts of some models. Not just arbitrary reductions. The goal was to maintain the quality of Sins in game. To make it look as if nothing has been changed at all. We started with optimizations to the Planet's, and Skybox's, because they were the "worst offenders" as far as ram usage, and performance was concerned. Unfortunately my modeling skills left much to be desired in Softimage XSI at the time, and there were un-fixable mesh errors on the optimized planet meshes. Despite that the "proof of concept" was established. A lot of ram was saved, and there was a very noticeable increase in performance.Then we studied the Particle files, and Textures. Many of the particle textures in our opinion were way too high in resolution for the purpose that they served. A reduction in texture resolution by HALF showed no visible difference in game at all! There were some exceptions where the particle resolution reduction difference was very noticeable in game, and those textures were reverted back to their original resolutions. Remember the goal was NOT to reduce in game quality. Also all of the particle textures were changed from TGA format to DDS format, because DDS uses a little less memory, and is much more efficient, because DDS format loads directly into video memory. The particles can also utilize the mip mapping features of DDS format. Where TGA format does not. Therefore enhancing in game video performance (increased FPS). As of version 0.07 no TGA format textures load in TSOP. With the exceptions of the Mouse Cursors, and Scenario Pictures. This is due to those textures being controlled by the hard coded exe. When you change the texture format those textures do not show up in game.The developers mentioned something about a Memory Leak. I heard that a memory leak can be caused by a file searching for something over, and over again if it is not there. Example a mesh file calling for a texture that does not exist. Vanilla Sins had MANY particle, and mesh files that had that issue. We removed all of the entries that pointed to non existent textures in the mesh, and particle files. We also removed the entries that have lines like for example "C;\g\main\datasource\textures\effects\aura4.dds", and just used "aura4.dds". This will default the search to Sins, or the Mods "Textures" folder, and speed things up a bit. Also various typo's were corrected in some mesh, and particle files. Some ships had mesh nulls that were Miss-Labeled. For example the Akkan had nulls, and flairs that were miss-labeled. The engine trails, and flairs didnt show up in game. the Marza was missing its bomb nulls. etc. etc. All of this has been corrected as well. If there is a ships mesh file in the mods "Mesh" folder then it had something wrong with it that was fixed. The Soundata, and Galaxydef files had errors too. Regardless if any of these issues caused any memory leaks, or not these issues MUST be fixed! (and they were as of Diplomacy 1.3, but NOT for Original Sins, or Entrenchment).After the Meshes, Particles, Textures, and the User Interface were optimized, and the very obvious issues were fixed there was a tremendous boost in game performance. Sins ram usage was greatly reduced. As of TSOP 0.07 I could run a game of Entrenchment, or Diplomacy ALL DAY, and I NEVER used more than 1.5 gigs of ram! This was using Maximum Settings. Including Bloom enabled. Tested on Huge Random Multi Star maps with 9 AI's. The 2 gig crash problem has been solved! Our primary goal with this project has been achieved! Without having to use any external memory increasing programs! Stardock, and Ironclad took notice, and they used TSOP as a guide in the Diplomacy 1.3 patch, and for developing Rebellion.Now that the Stardock, and Ironclad have fixed the issues of the game as of Diplomacy 1.3, and Rebellion. TSOP has been focusing more on Original Sins, and Entrenchment. Since the Ironclad/Stardock fixes never made it into Original Sins, or Entrenchment. However, That is not stopping us from optimizing Diplomacy, or Rebellion "just a little bit more" You can also use Large Address Aware to give Sins an extra gig to play with, but in vanilla Original Sins, and Entrenchment the Endless Search Loop issues that were never fixed will cause the game to eventually go over that extra gig (Run vanilla Entrenchment, and watch your ram usage keep going up, and up, and up). TSOP is a solution that will stop that issue.
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Downloads
The Sins Optimization Project v1.0
For Original Sins 1.195
For Entrenchment 1.055
For Diplomacy 1.37
Stardock, and Ironclad fixed all of the issues that compelled us to make TSOP. Therefore there is no TSOP for Diplomacy
For Rebellion 1.82
As with Diplomacy, Stardock, and Ironclad fixed all of the issues that TSOP pointed out, and then some in the case of Rebellion. Sins: Rebellion is as optimized as any Sins game is going to get.
NOTE: TSOP 0.07 is still hosted on ModDB, and it still works in the current versions of Trinity (OS, E, and D), but you will be playing as if Sins was patched to an older version of the game. Plus some Icons and Buttons wont be visible.
Changes in TSOP 1.0
TSOP 1.0 updated to the latest versions of Original Sins, and Entrenchment.
The User Interface is completely overhauled to use pure DDS format.
Trade Ships, Strike Craft, Mines, and Constructor Unit Meshes, and Textures are Optimized.
Starbase Textures are optimized mimicking the Stardock Rebellion Optimizations.
Sounds, and Music are optimized.
All TGA format Textures are replaced with DDS format, and TSOP "force" loads them. The only TGA textures that remain are the Mouse Cursers, and Scenario Pictures. This is due to hard code in the EXE.
"Strategic Texture Reductions" for the Particles return using newer methods to create a better looking texture.
(Original Sins, and Entrenchment) Many Mesh Null issues, and various File Errors were corrected, and Unnecessary Text Entry's were removed in both the Mesh, and Particle files. Entry's pointing to Non Existent Textures in both the mesh, and particle files removed. See the various "Fixed Files" texts in the mods Read Me for details.
(Original Sins, and Entrenchment) The Diplomacy 1.3 graphic fix's have been incorporated into the Original Sins, and Entrenchment versions of TSOP (Pipeline Effects, "White Line" error fix, and Corrected Mesh files).
TSOP 1.0 for Trinity will see the return of Optimized Planets using the planet meshes from Rebellion! but with our Optimized Original Sins Textures!
There will be no version of TSOP made for Diplomacy, or Rebellion, because there is no need for it. Only Original Sins, and Entrenchment need TSOP, because the 2 gig issue, and various other issues were never fixed in those two versions of the game.
This is the FINAL version of TSOP that i will make. If the community wants to take over the project they are more than welcome to.
Community input, and contributions are more than welcome, and they are encouraged! This is a Community Project! All can pitch in!
Note: TSOP does not fix the known issue of "Late Game Lag". It does help prolong the lag until further into the game in some cases, but sooner, or later the lag will happen. The late game lag issue is a CPU issue due to the fact that Sins (including Rebellion) is optimized to use only single core processors. Therefore Sins will use only one core in multi core CPU's. To help with the late game lag issue we recommend the following:
Playing on smaller maps.
Using fewer AI opponents.
Disabling the Trade Ship icons (this actually helps out a lot)
Stacking the icons in the empire tree (same as with disabling trade ship icons the less icons rendered the better).
Using a Strike Craft Reduction mod (The many strike craft in the game are a big CPU hog. There are some good strike craft mods that reduce the number, but maintain the balance. Search for them).
You do not need to download all versions of TSOP. You only need to download the version of TSOP for the specific version of Sins you wish to play. The Retail version of Trinity is just all three versions of Sins bundled into one package. Installation for Trinity versions of Sins are no different than if you purchased each version of Sins separately.
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Other mods are more than welcome to use TSOP. No questions asked! In fact we encourage it! Learn from it! Use it as guide, and an example! Merge it into your projects!
TSOP is intended to be a Stand Alone mod. Run with no other mods enabled. There are issues enabling TSOP with other mods. Enabling with other "Graphic Enhancement" mods is NOT recommended, because the graphic enhancement mod will defeat the entire purpose of TSOP. All of our optimized files will be overridden by that enhancement mods "enhanced" files. Increasing your ram usage instead of decreasing it. Some enhancement mods like Distant Stars are incorporating elements of TSOP into their future updates.
Read the included READ ME text's for installation instructions.
offered the uploading a few times. It was to close to this update to really bother trying to figure out what was what in the last update.
Guys lots of Karma need to go to MyFisto, and SivCorp. The last few updates were all them two. Especially SivCorp for the optimized meshes.
Thank you sir!
My next target will be on structures and starbases. Lets keep it rollin'
Edit: Or maybe on constructor ships.... The Vassari Constructor is 2395 Faces?!? Each planet gets 3 right? So on large maps thats.... TO MANY! I'm going to start with these little buggers first.
This is great work guys, I have a low end system myself and I've observed first hand how much difference this mod makes. My most recent 8 way FFA game would run at about 40% speed vanilla, and about 80% or so with these graphics changes. I'm now going to start a new game and compare 0.04 with 0.05 and see if I can measure any difference.
One question (sorry if this was already addressed somewhere else): What changes does TOP make in the GameInfo directory? Because I'm using TOP in conjunction with my own mods, which change only files in GameInfo, I'd be interested to know what changes are in this directory so I can decide whether or not to incorporate them. So far I'm only using the graphics files, and since I've already seen so much improvement, perhaps there is no need to worry GameInfo.
Bravo to the continued work all. I am extremely impressed at your collaboration here and look forward to the next update.
*hands Siv a blacksmith's hammer* HERE!! smooth those little bastards out!! You can never trust anything that LOOKS like a flea
*bang bang*
Well now I'm gonna have to redo the UV maps.... fun.
I love the detail the Devs gave Sins, I just don't see how no one looked into the big picture. 3-6K poly ships and structures that get duplicated over and over? Maybe I should look at getting a job in the gaming industry, cause the building industry is drying up fast...
There is no denying the artists skills in the Sins models. With all i know from all of my school of hard knocks experience i "still" dont know enough to get a modeling job. Summer is coming so construction will go up. It is over where i am at hence the 14+ hour days.
I updated the readme about enabling other mods with TOP. Which i no longer recommend. Due to the different planet, and skybox meshes, and the fact other mods override our optimized files.
I did get a cheap laugh out of the "crack in space and time" glitch in the skyboxes when I ran opti and DS together lol
As long as a mod does not change the Backgrounds, Planets, and Suns, Particles, The Strike craft, and trade ship meshes and textures. In other words only stat change mods like re-balance mods can be run over TOP without having any effect.
Yay
I finally figured out the dam tangents when importing from 3DS max.
1st i import the OBJ from 3ds and name the mesh SOASE_MESH_wUVs
Then I import the FBX that has all the mesh points. This one is named SOASE_MESH. With the SOASE_MESH selected I make 2 texture projections.
Select SOASE_MESH_wUVs in the explorer (press 8) and open the texture editor and select all (Ctrl + a) and Copy UVs.
Select SOASE_MESH in the explorer (press 8) and open the texture editor and select "texture projection" and paste UVS, select "texture projection 1" and paste UVs again.
Select SOASE_MESH_wUVs in the explorer and delete it so you should have 1 mesh with mesh points and 2 good texture projections.
Man that was a pain to get it to work in a script.
Yes I have a button that converts the model directly to .MESH and places it in the mod folder of my choice.
The Reference Files button converts any file from the root dir so I can quickly compare but will do them all and place ind the same new mod folder. Whoop Whoop!
Outstanding. I will have to test this when you are done. We may soon get rid of the need to use XSI..
The button script still uses the convert xsi files but thanks to the Major and writing his last convertxsi article I found the paths can easily be modified from source to directory. Each button installs directorys in C:\Developer that the scripts call upon.
I have not yet figured a way in script to to copy or call upon the files so they will need to be manually copied to to C:\Developer\ConvertXSI for convertxsi button to work. This is just the convertxsi files, then the folder can be left alone. No more copying files to and using dos, 1 button an BOOM done.
There is lots more testing needed even before I release a beta of the plugin. Like calling on directory's of other operating systems where the textures are copied from . e.g.
strMods = XSIUtils.ResolvePath ("$USERPROFILE/AppData/Local/Ironclad Games/Sins of a Solar Empire/")
should allow any user to pick or create a folder in the native mods dir but is not tested. If cancelled it defaults to C:\Developer\New Mod
Select Case Application.Platform
Case "Win32"
strSoaSERootDir = XSIUtils.ResolvePath ("$PROGRAMFILES/Stardock/Sins of a Solar Empire/")
Case "Win64"
strSoaSERootDir = XSIUtils.ResolvePath ("$PROGRAMFILES(X86)/Stardock/Sins of a Solar Empire/")
Case "Linux"
Application.LogMessage " I aint got time for your crap"
Since I don't have XP or 64 bit vista or 7 I need testers.
Aractain is developing a Max import/export/point management/material management/tangent management tool that totally invalidates XSI for max users. I've been helping him test it out with excellent results, and I believe he's almost ready to release it to the public.
Well I am, and a lot of new modders are free bees. They will still need XSI/Softimage, will they not?
I started learning modeling with XSI (free) then tested the 30 day trial of 3DS max and actually found it limited in capabilities. But like the Major pointed out it might be just what your used to. Cant wait to try it ( 13 days left, be quick).
All my tutorials will be for free bees!
I look forward to the 3D Max script. It should make model design so much faster for this game. Then maybe I can optimize a few peoples mods for some epic battle scenes
And good work Fist! I've never been much of a code junkie.... I'm an artist, and don't care much for the programing end of things. Enjoy that 30 day trial, it is a fun program. I've done 4+ years of schooling on it and majored specializing in 3D animation and spacial graphics on 3D studio max 7. The 2010 is the best version yet!
Nope, XSI will serve no purpose if Max is your poison of choice. Aractain's script covers everything that XSI was previously needed for, and does it in a much more elegant and intuitive way.
Personally, I've found Max to be much more powerful than XSI and definitely easier to use. As far as cost is concerned, I bet you can find a free copy of an older version somewhere...
Max has been my weapon of choice through its various incarnations since version 2.5 which i still have somewhere buried in my archives. I found most modelers prefer the program which they first learned to model with. Some prefer XSI. Some Maya. Some Lightwave, but the majority i see are Max users. All have their good and bad points. Max and Lightwave IMO are the easiest to use as far as UI. Once you learn the UI's and what everything does its a cakewalk. The rest of the modelers are all about memorizing hotkeys. It took me 2 weeks just to figure out how to rotate the freaking camera in maya, and you have to use a hotkey plus the mouse?! I STILL cant select a SINGLE poly in XSI it always selects multiple tris. No mater what selection setting i use. Bet theres a stupid hotkey for that too :/
Max is just straight up point n click modeling. Yes it has hotkeys too, but you dont need to memorize them because everything is on the menus. 3dsmax hasnt changed much as far as UI since version 4. Gmax (the free version of max) is based off of 3dsmax 5, but you need scripts to export anything other than proprietary format. You can find Gmax export scripts anywhere. You can use any version of max dating back to version 4, and the 3ds format will still be valid for importing into other current modeling programs.
I started with Milkshape 3D so the basic ease of max's editable mesh fit me nicely once I got 'the stack'.
I do use hotkeys though, 4 of them.
Q for the camera, w to move, e to rotate and r to scale! Thats all though, everything else is a mouse button (apart from shift/control and alt of course).
Milkshape is a good starter program, but it is limited. Which most modelers find out on their own.
LOL yea i remember fighting with "the stack" until i learned to "collapse all" before i exported.
Basically its R -T - Y - U - I all in a row for selections
Tried it already myfisto. Still selects multiple tris at random in a radius around where i try to select just one tri. I blame it on Vista/windows 7
Try going to File-->Keyboard Mapping, a keyboard window should pop up. In the group window (top right) scroll to XSI at the bottom. Raycasting is what your looking for in the command window. See where its binded or rebind.
Did you change to QWERTY or Maya setup? Vista is fine with default key setup.
Mmmmmm, "the stack"
I love the stack in 3D studio Max. I do all my work in the stack, if possible. Then just collapse it when I am done.
XSI looks like it requires alot of pre setup to get it to work similar to max.... me no likey.
Max requires a lot of setup to get it to work like XSI
Got most of SoaSE models in XSI all ready to try and optimize some structures
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