For me it was the options: there were so many different spells, dozens of traits you could assign (the one I could never do without was alchemy!) the races were so diverse, it just provided hundreds of combinations that kept the game fresh thru dozens of games!
So how is EWOM measuring up to it's spiritual predecessor? At first there was a large amount of disappointment in lack of race diversity, but other than graphical similarity, the dozen races slated for the canon game could easily provide the same gameplay differences (if not graphical ones). And there obviously will be a large spellbook even in the canon game, which will surely expand quickly as user created content becomes available.
The one area we have nto heard a ton about is whatever anaolgy of MoM's traits make it into the game. There will surely be pre-game setup of your channeler, but we have not heard a lot of details as far as to how many and what kinds of options there will be. If this can be done well, I think that is the foundation of what will determine if this is the game that future 4x games are measured against.
Ditto. Just add kick ass Hero units you could customize with spells and artifacts and you have my list as well.
Sammual
No doubt. I "included" that in the "diversity of the game elements" expression.
I know everyone's thinking "apple pie," but my mom's trump treat was her pumpkin pie. Oh wait, that's a matter of taste, innit?
Seriously, though, I hadn't even considered an 'impossible standard' problem harming Stardock revenue (I gave up regularly reading game sites shortly after Games Domain stopped being By Gamers, For Gamers and started being By Marketers, For Mindless Consumers). There's definitely a self-interest value for us 'niche game' folks in seeing Stardock succeed with this project. It increases the chances that Stardock and/or an admiring competitor will do more work for the same underserved audience.
For me it was the combat. Not the tactical nature - that was old even then - but the way it handled units and squads and modifiers. Different races had character through not only empire-wide bonuses, but changes to how their generic units worked. Squads took casualties that reduced their ability to attack. Powerful monsters could sweep away several units. Throwing axes, striking first, all that stuff.
This was great stuff in the day of 'chariot attack chariot, random die roll YOU LOSE HAHA' in Civilization. Excellent racial character and combat stats that provided variety without being clunky or opaque.
^ ^ ^ What he said.
I agree,l I love the way squads became less effective when they took losses.
I loved that in the reverse. Casting heal spells on weakened squads made them stronger
Same here. I just LOVED the randomness combined with the amount of options.
I remember the very last game I played... I started with no books at all and took every trait I could. Warlord, articifer, myrran, the works basically. Started on myrror with barbarians and took over that world. As soon as my economy was up I started making super stacks and trashing all of the monster dens, temples etc that I could. Super stacks without spell buffs aren't actually that powerful against stuff like great wyrms, so it took a while.
The fun really started when I began to capture spellbooks. I got a random mix, some dark and 1 or two of the other elements.
I eventually took over the world with stacks of 9 windwalking invisible shadow demons. Good times.
Having the unique ability to enchant an entire set of items with "multiple" powers each.
Also selecting unique "Abilities" at the start of the game, which further distinguishes you from other summoners.
Choosing your own "Race" at the start which further allows singular distinction.
Being able to conquer the entire game with one mega powerful "Hero" unit. (I did this many times with death magic)
Being able to conquer the entire game without ever expanding outside of your initial starting city.
And one of the coolest options i recall was the "choice" between capturing a city or razing it. (This was such an awesome feature)
The nodes were so enchanting, something akin to being captivated by an hypnotic sirens song. I never captured them out of neccesity, rather i just took them because they sparkled. I just "HAD" to have that lovely sparkling addition to my territory. (Dr. Evil laugh here)
Yes, finding new spells and monster "Lairs" was awesome. Lairs in particular since you would often times find something so powerful it would stomp 5 normal units without breaking a sweat, and most times you would have to wait till either later in the game or organize an entire "expedition" specifically for the purpose of taking the monster "Lair". That feature made me giddy every time.
The list of "cool factor" in MoM is so inexhaustible that i could write 500 pages on it without getting bored in the slightest.
I agree completely with that statement.
One thing that was missing in MOM and that we will have in Elemental is that ability to see the entire map. Mom, you had to scroll here and there to see all the details. I still scroll the mouse wheel when I play mom hoping to scroll up and see the bigger map...
I used to do the "all ability" thing as well. I would go for dwarves. Get a adamantite hammerhand pump going. You can pretty much smash everthing except draconians because you get hammerhands so early.
In terms of atmosphere--I remember having chills go down my spine the first time I cast a mass death spell and the world faded to darkness.
I preferred adamantine zerkers because they got thrown weapons. That took care of those annoying flying monsters.
man, flying monsters are a pain.
but not as much as the ones that can only be hurt by magic.
MoM suprised me to this very day! The combinations of spells/races/units is so infinate Just recently I descovered gnolls. I always used to hate them! But then I saw omg their Swordmen are so strong so many swords! It's funny how the races have their own Niche styles. Like Klackons and their blasted DEFENSE. You can put iron skin and Holy Armor and they are immortal lol. Very fun game to figure out and play with
The infinite replayability, thanks to the variety in maps, quite well-balanced races that were really different, the vast array of spells and units, going far beyond the overly used "humans, elfs, orcs"
And of course the good balance between different tactics even if some at times could seem overpowered, e.g. would you go for a huge army of strong standard units, expensive beefed up heroes, massive spellcasting or summoning powerful creatures?
Also worth noticing is the many, many types of unit characteristics, making things much more interesting than the usual rock-paper-scissors. Yet at the same time most characteristics were very straightforward to understand.
And if you want to go on, the simple production vs food system, the bonus tiles and magical nodes were pretty amazing elements as well.
Most of the MOM copies / clones I've seen over the years either failed in terms of variety (way too few spells and/or units) or in terms of combat mechanics (almost random battle outcomes)
I missed MoM the first time around, but just started messing around with it using DOSBOX. So far, I have been surprised how similar it seems conceptually to Age of Wonders, and wonder why MoM fans did not consider AoW a worthy successor? Right down to power nodes, multiple planes, customizable wizards, building techs in cities, diverse races/units, magic spheres. In fact, my main reaction to playing MoM is a desire to take up AoW again. Anyone care to compare the two games?
AoW was different in a number of areas. For starters, its maps were built like HoMM, not like MoM. They were noisy with little things to be found, and cities were not as influenced by their location as MoM cities were.
City building did not have any sort of picture interface that really gave you the 'feeling' that the city was build built. Sure, you had similar building from an "On paper" point of view, but it still 'felt' too dissimilar to be the same.
There was not much in the way of alternate planes. There was an underground, but since map construction worked like HoMM, the underground was very limited when compared to Myrror. The undeground had specific pathways that forced your movement, unlike Myrror which was just as open as the 1st world. It wasn't a "sub-level" and the freedom of movement and potential ability to research into moving between the worlds at will, the myrror world could resurt in some very different tactics. So I'd have to disagree with multiple planes, because AoW doesn't have it. It has "underground" and thats constructed in a way that doesn't let it be a substitute for MoM's system.
The magic seemed to be too heavy on the battle spells, and the non-combat spells were rarly very useful. I mean, "global" spells had to encompass so much, and yet it did not end up with the kind of diversity that MoM seemed to carry. In a way its kind like Megaman weapons... They had the same 'ideas' but it requires a good blance of abilities and cost before you actually *want* to use them.
The wizard was fairly limited in range as well, and so if you basically had two tactics: turtle until you could cast spells in enemy domain, or build a huge army and sweep. You couldn't really rush the spell tree and go in with heavy magic blazing, because you wouldn't be able to cast spells far enough, or your wizard would be at serious risk.
Magic Spheres were not like MoM's tomes. Magic Spheres let you pick your school of magic, or even up to 3 specialties, but that was the depth of it. Magic tomes in MoM influnced not only the magic you cast, but the amount of that magic you could research. There was a tactic for taking only like 1 tome in "life" to gain access to guardian or something like that. This also effected spells you could trade or buy, since if I recall right you could pretty much buy and spell you wanted in AoW if you could find somebody willing to sell it. Spells were directly related to your skills and abilities as well, since it cost tomes to gain "artificier" and such.
Of course this is all opinion. I'd say that most of us agree that AoW did not "FEEL" like MoM. MoM felt like Cizilization with armies and magic. AoW felt like HoMM with economy, diplomacy, and a "main wizard" type character. I'd agree it was close. When I played AoW I kept noting things that were more or less a direct rip from MoM. But the general game-style was too far off to be a sequel.
All this talk about MoM made me curious about that game since I never heard of it before reading this forum. So I got my hands on a copy and played a game yesterday. What an experience, now I am twice as exited about EWOM.
AoW is not at all a worthy successor. MoM does not have a worthy successor, which is why so many people have such high hopes for this game.
landisaurus had some great points, I'll add a few of my own:
For me was the RPG aspect of the heroes. Being able to equip them, casting buffs on them, leveling them up, producing heroes that could change the tide of a battle... Also before patch 1.3.1 or so in MOM, I remember battling other heroes and getting their magic items.
That's why FFH2 Grigori has the same type of appeal to me except to a much lesser effect...
FFH2 as in the Fall From Heaven Civ IV mod?
What is it you kids type these days--QFT?
More and more, I suspcect that a big part of my motivation for typing too much around here and wanting to play hard in the beta is some mostly-unconscious expectations management thing. Sometimes nostalgia can seem rather like a social disease...
Yup
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