If you are playing in a premade with friends, say so in the title of the game. It's unfair to PUGs to join a game against 3-4 players on voice comm cooperating against total strangers. It's an unfair advantage and really goes against the competitive spirit of the game.
I have friends I play with too but I let everyone know it's a premade and hopefully go up against stronger players or another premade for some competition. If you wanna steamroll over noobs with your buddies, Go comp stomp...
PUG Voice chat is LOL. You'll have some 13 year old who sounds like his voice can break glass screaming at his team mates "OMFG WHY DIDN'T YOU HEAL ME YOU BUNCH OF F'N NOOBS" ... "YOU GUYS SUCK ZOMG MY MOTHER COULD PLAY BETTER THEN YOU" - Screaming 13 year old then Rage quits, followed by his team mates conceding... just like any other PUG except with txt chat no one had to hear his annoying Shrills.
Voice in an FPS is way less important than in a strategy game. When the couple things you need to say are "uber now" or "SPY BEHIND YOU!" and the minimal penalties for death voice chat is a lot less important, especially due to the hotkey shouts like "Spy!" "Medic" "Go go go" and such.
I'd say its quite the opposite - at least with competitive players.
Voice as opposed to chat? I don't see how.
Except that FPS's started voicechat? I would never play an FPS without direct voice contact to my teamates. Natural selection and tribes would have been unplayable.
I'd argue for a "Squelch/Mute Player" option in-game to minimize the pain of people abusing voice chat. TF2 doesn't have a Mute Player option last time I checked, but in TF2 if people are driving me up the wall with voice chat I can find another server. That's not an option in a 20+ minute game of Demigod, unless I ragequit and screw my teammates over.
It does. It's on the menu.
Because you have to stop to read it and to type it, you don't have to look away from the action to hear voice.
VoIP is a kind of big deal, but its really secondary to the largest advantage of premades: if you are on a premade you are essentially guaranteed that one of your teammates wont horribly die a whole bunch and singlehanded lose it for your team (unless your premade is just bad, but generally that doesnt happen wtih premades). The big disadvantage of a PUG is that you have THAT GUY WHO WONT STOP DYING on your team a fairly high percentage of the time, and you really cant overcome that normally.
I dont really see the point of playing premade vs PUG. You have a large advantage before the game even starts. To me, winning when you have an intrinsic large advantage is just boring as hell and I'd rather wait a while longer in the lobby to wait for people who are actually up to the challenge.
So yeah, I'd like to see people put "premade" in the titles. I've heard that Wicked that DG is all about premades and premades are what matters and you shouldnt take if you arent premading it and you need to make friends if you arent in a premade etc. If all that is true, why is he so worried about declaring that its a premade in the title and waiting a bit? If all that is true he should be eager to avoid premade vs PUG.
Its my experience that there are enough premades out there that they should be able to spend a reasonable amount of time playing each other --- which could be accomplished by putting a "premade" in their titles. But then again, maybe the real problem is that a lot of premades really dont want to be playing other premades...
No, I meant I don't see how voices as opposed to chat are more important in FPS games as opposed to strategy games.
Games would take a considerable ammount longer to form if people put (premade) in the title...why not join a game... ALT+TAB out and search their names to see if they normally play together to determine if it's a premade. It's really not that hard. Just requires about 30 sec.
I'm guessing you have never played an FPS at a competitive level.
I have. I still don't see it. Yes you're communicating constantly in both games but I don't believe it's as important to do so in the fps as opposed to during the battle in a strategy game.
The real solution is to add random teams - then you will know instantly which games are and are not premades. The sad fact about premades is that anyone that knows what they are doing can spot and avoid premades. So premades are playing the bottom of the barrel and apparently enjoying it.
okay here is the solution for all PAB's.
1) you don't want to play premade? play pantheon or skirmish and have fun getting noobs thrown into your team, if you are sick of playing with noob... ->2
2) get some friends, just add people you have fun playing with to your friendlist
3) play custom games with your friends.
4) put your flameshield on, you are now brandmarked as premade, sorry but you are not allowed to make friends and play with them in this game.
I see nothing wrong with premade games. It's a fact of life, people want to play with their friends.
I do however find it relatively unsporting for premades to try and be sneaky about it. I'm not talking about even just being "neutral" about it, but like, seeming to go out of the way to hide that they're a VoIP team of 3 assassins ready to trigank with Wrath.
To me, the idea of playing as a 'coordinated team' as opposed to a "pick up team" is to play against other coordinated team. But the couner logic of "We're just a bunch of friends looknig to play together" is valid too.
Ultimately I err on the side of "let me know you're not a bunch of randomers", at least until real "team Games" come out.
Premades (teams that are arranged in advance, often using voice chat): if someone asks you if you are a premade team (they should ask if they have any concern), tell them the truth. If you don't, you are being a jerk.
PUGS (pick up games): be alert if you don't want to be in a premade. Ask them if they are premade. If they tell you they are, you play, lose, and then complain... you are being a jerk.
I've asked several times if the game I joined is a premade and everytime the host appears to tell the truth. Other times, if it seems crystal clear that the game I joined is a premade (without my asking), I just leave in the lobby. Sometimes, they tell me its a premade and I play anyway.
What's the worst that could happen? Your stats could get screwed in a system that the pubs alreadly admit is jacked up?
I think we can all agree that a premade team with 3 people who work well together SHOULD beat any team of 2 and a random. The competative matchup would logically be 3 good premades vs 3 good premades. I can easily say that a team like Shadow and Itchydustbin, et all are bound to win by playing against just anyone, but honestly, we all play this game because we enjoy it. If they only played when there was a premade team up to snuff, then they'd MAYBE play weekly (if you are interested in creating a premade to crush them, let me know). But that said, I don't fault them in the slighest for taking their premade on the road and kicking some butt. Do I think that people like Shadow, et all, could get 100 wins just playing customs without their teams? No. Not a chance in hell. They'd have to be insanely good AND incredibly lucky due to technical stats. Prove me wrong by playing 8 games without your team. But, you don't have to because I'd enjoy to see a 200 win streak.
You want to win and play them all in a row, right? If not I've won more than 8 with randoms since the stat reset.
But I don't really see what I'll be proving if I do manage to do it, how do you know I don't know any of the people I'm playing with? It comes all down to luck rather than how good/bad I am at Demigod.
We completely agree... which leads me to what I said not in bold:
Which makes celebrating 100 wins utterly pointless for an individual player, but exciting for demigod's stability as a game. That's my real point. Or let me expand upon that. I hope I can drum up enough interest to create a premade that will beat down the current best team and that we can have matches in the future. I am very happy to see individual players distinguishing themselves, but see no real testimony of skill other than a stat that could be crippled by dropping an individuals team (eg you have 100 wins but couldn't win 8 in a row without your team).
What I'd really like to see in demigod is the following: players that can beat anyone 1v1, 2v2, 3v3, etc. Wouldn't it be great for any of us to say that pacov or itchydustbin or jimbo are some of the top players instead of having to second guess due to a shite stat system that can be cheated by anyone with half a brain? I'd love to know who the number 1 player is and at least try to kick his ass... instead, the best I get is guys who managed to win 100 games in a row by playing with their friends and NOT having demigod crash. Why, I'm a good player, I could follow the same tactic and be elite. Anyway, I hope the broken shite gets fixed and we can have more competition in the future. I'm sure we will.
All that said, I have no problem with premades, but reading between the lines is interesting too...
Well as I understand it, thats the whole reason for clan leagues and such.
Left 4 Dead is a prime example of why this is wrong imo.
Wow.. a reasonable and well thought out reply. As for your suggestions:
1. I didn't know this was possible, but I'll look into how to do this. Thanks for the tip.
2. I do this already.
3. I ask when I join and have never been told the truth. After a few minutes in the game it's clear if it's a premade. There are things that just don't happen with PUG players and must be voice comm. Things like all 3 players immediately and simultaneously teleporting to a flag and ganking you while trying to cap. In a pug, IF I see an opportunity, I can type it in chat, describing the flag, and hope my teammates are reading chat, have a teleport scroll, and/or give a fuck what I'm saying.
To the naysayers, playing in a premade against a pug absolutely goes against the competitive spirit of the game. Of any game. We are all here to play and have fun. I understand there are players worse than me and players better than me and I'm fine with that. However, I don't want to play a game where one side has an advantage I cannot counter or match. Voice comm is most likely in almost all premades and that is a huge advantage over pug players. I can't get that coop from random teammates that quickly, and I might even just get "shut the fuck up noob I am not listening to you l2p blah blah"
I guess I don't expect anyone to listen, I just wanted to vent here. Hopefully the devs will read this and realize their system is fail and they need to fix it for the gamers out here that give a shit. There will always be the little kiddies that don't care about fair gaming and want to wave their epeens around. This post is not meant for them. It's meant for players that just want to play a fair game with others without any outside advantages.
Your entitled to your opinion. Your wrong opinion that is. Go make some friends, heres a frog.
I don't see how he's wrong. You're playing against someone who is clearly at a disadvantage.
The fact that you claim his opinion is wrong is telling in and of itself why you want to play pugs as a premade.
Do we REALLY have to start this again Infinite? Really? I mean, REALLY?
He's wrong because he's narrowminded. Ive said it for the 100000000th time, with all the other premades out there, its hard enough to start a game as it is. People just want to play with their friends, not mop the floor with idiots. It doesn't kill the competitive spirit of the game because people choose to play with people they know will be fun to play with, that actually, increases the competitive spirit of the game.
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