Yeah I'd say the Senate
The Preator is the center of power, but does not have absolute power. Even he has to answer to the senate if the Romulans are at all like the old Roman Republic (before the time of Augustus). It was fanon about the rejection, and divergance of the Rihansu from the logic of Surak. TOS established that the Romulans were indeed Vulcan decendants from that time. The rest of the background pretty much came from the book "Spocks World", and was later incorporated into TNG to become canon. Hence the episode "Reunification". So far no one has really explored the Romulan culture other than a few episodes of TNG, and (shivers) Nemesis. Though i take nemesis with a grain of salt, because that movie made the great Romulan Star Empire look like a bananna republic that only one Sovereign Class could have easily conquered. What we do know is their government is similar to the old Roman Republic, but they have a Soviet Union style secret police (tal shiar) That ensures loyalty among its citizens. Which it apparently is not very effective since Spock was operating on Romulas virtually untouched.
diplomacy beta seems to be ok .. hope more options will come in while the beta is running but it will definitly fit into startrek and this mod+diplomacy will be just perfect harmony as far my imagination goes..
I took it from DS9 that the Tal'Shiar weren't always working with the Empire's best interests in mind. From what I understand in the STO timeline (which is likely the closest thing to canon that we'll be getting for the prime universe for some time) they didn't really do all that much after the destruction of romulus, and mostly ended up carving out yet another little kingdom led by whoever was their leader at the time. That, of coarse, is competely in keeping with the Soviet Union secret police that inspired them.
On another note, concerning Romulan balancing. Will you be incorporating some of the more subtle canon problems and advantages for their ships. I think you guys had mentioned their increaced armor before, but I was also wondering if you were going to be incorporating things like how few ships the romulans actually had. We know that they never had a big fleet, but maximized their forces with their cloaking technology. Will we be having to do the same thing.
Since, theoretically, the Romulans are based on the Romans and we know that the Romulans have both an emperor and praetor, it stands to reason that the praetor has a similar role to the Roman praetor.
The "Praetor" of ancient Rome was the title given to the head of the Praetorian Guard. They were the palace guards (i.e., in Imperial Rome they guarded the emperor and his family). Beginning with Claudius, the Praetorian Guard effectively began selecting the Emperors, and nobody could argue much because the guards had physical control of the entire Imperial Family.
Notionally, you expect the Romulan Praetor is something similar, since the word "praetor" is obviously some kind of translation and probably wouldn't have been applied otherwise. Likely, the Praetor is the head of the Tal'Shiar, or perhaps even the entire Romulan fleet. Theoretically he would be accountable to the Emperor, but when one guy controls the entire military, who has the real power?
Unfortunately the name similarity between praetor and praetorian guard is merely coincidental. The praetors in republican Rome where magistrates/judges and in Imperial Rome they were Imperial officials. They were many titles more prestigious and with more power than praetors e.g. consuls, imperator, pontifax maximus. Sure, praetors were involved in the running of the praetorian guard during imperial Rome however there are many different types of 'praetors' specialising in different areas.
I never understood why the Romulan leader was referred to as praetor when in historic Roman definition it is a relatively low senatorial rank.
Maybe because gene didnt want too many "Emperors" in trek. Kind of interesting that the old TOS maps (mainly Franz Joseph) had the Klingon empire on one side of the federation in the beta quadrant. On the opposite side was the weaker yet still a threat Romulan empire. Wasnt until TNG where the map changed, and now both the klinks, and romulans live on the same side north, and south of each other. So the Romulans moved into the beta quadrant with the klingons.(and broght romulus/remus along with them) No wonder the klinks are perpetually pissed off, and want to kill em.
Perhaps Preator was used as "something different" To avoid too many "emperors" in trek. Like i said the Romulan government is "similar" to the old Roman Republic. It is not the same. In the rommies case Preator (which ever way its spelled). Is the emperor, or the center of power. Perhaps like the klingons the romulans to have an "Imperitor" which is purely a cerimonial figurehead with no true power. I havent seen anything in the way of religion in romulans so i doubt an Imperitor would be a religious leader. Regardless it is obvious the Romulan Senate holds the true power. Pity most senators are hell bent on romulan manifest destiny. They think Romulus is "destened" to rule the galaxy.
Now you got me confused is it based on the roman republic or the roman empire, because there are no emperors in the former one?
I think it's a mix of the two, doubt the Romulans were based entirely on one governing body.
Stress, you were right in your first guess, the Praetor holds ALL the power, he controls the romulan military, he who controls the military, controls the empire. The senate, is at his mercy, they can meet with unfortunate "accidents" when they displease him. The Emporer is a figurehead, nothing more.
Eh, Tribunes were originally low-ranking too, but ended up with lots of power later. Realistically, the Praetor is whatever the writer wants him to be that day.
I always thought of the Praetor as more of the head of the Senate + some strong executive characteristics
He presides over the Senate and the Continuing Comittee. The Senate is basically an oligarchy with the Praetor leading it and I assume acting as commander-in-cheif, since "the Praetor's power is in the Romulan Fleet" (or something to that effect)
I think this is basically what Memory Alpha says too
And, if I remember correctly, the Romulans (at least in the TNG/DS9/Voyager era) do not have an Emperor.
I love the progress so far.. good job.. I can't wait to see the other races incorportated...
Some constructive feed back because I know how much you get already lol... I really think the Vor'cha should be a capital ship maybe exchange it with the K'vex... I love how you have balanced captial ships now however, the none capital ships pop like popcorn which isn't so much fun . The exp values are also very low but I guess since they go up like popcorn that is kind of balanced.... Also I think the captial ships need more abilities like sticking to the Sins orginial formula of 4 per because for example when you're playing the klingons there is no modivation for building any other ships then the K'vex *which with overload is insane* and the Neg'Vhar the other 3 are useless more or less.. Also the same goes for the Feds the Defiant goes up weight to easily... and the Soverign owns but the others don't really hold their weight... The nebula gemini effect it cool.. but pre-soverign and defiant the Nebula was the big gun of the federation I don't know why it always gets made into a weaker galaxy class ....
But all and all fantastic job.. the mini-dump issues which you're well aware of is a PAIN IN THE BLANKING ARSE... also did you cut the opening cinimatic in the newest version? I really like what you had.. I guess you're reworking the fact it says 6 races etc etc etc...
Major Stress what part of the Country are you from Anyway? When you finally get this beast handled I think you and your team need to be a Guest of Honor at what ever local ST Convention .... If I hit a windfall I'll take you to ours
And one least beg and plea... please put the Ferengi in at least as pirates .... I hate the fact Birth of the Federation was the only game I could play them in but I understand your interest in Dominion war cannon.. but I bet my money that the Ferengi were having a savalge field day with all those battles...
Dont get me wrong i do indeed want the ferengi in the mod. But at the moment they are very low priority. If they go in they will be as part of the "ship of the week" lineup of planetary defenders (which will replace the pirate faction as well). The SotW Faction will also have Sona, Talarian, and other misc ships of the weeks we have seen. The ferengi werent pirates per say. They were more like privateers that would attack targets of oppertunity if they thought it was worth fighting over, and if they could would win the fight. They have a yellow streak on their backs. They would just as soon "strike a bargain" first before using force.
I am from the US.. West coast. The 1st, and LAST trek convention i went to was in Tampa FL in 1996. Just after the release of 1st contact. The only reason i went was to see if they had anything hobby wise (models, and rare collectibles) that wasnt already available at walmart, or the local hobby shops. They had "some" things, but nothing that i really was interested in. Plus i wasnt gonna pay 500 bucks for a 12" Kirk doll in TMP garb. I am also a "Construction Worker type that happens to like Trek" as Shatner would put it. I felt way out of place there. Least i got to hear some good TOS, TNG, and DS-9 actors speak. Gary Lockwood (Gary Mitchell) he was kind of an arrogant ass. Nobody there liked how he conducted himself. Charles Napier (Adam from TOS "way to eden", and the bad guy senator from Rambo II) He Cracked me up. I had a smoke, and chatted with him outside on the balcony, and didnt realize it was him until he spoke. I expected him to be taller Dwight Shultz (Barkley) was a pleasent surprise too. and last but not least.. Terry Farrel (Jadzia Dax).
That was pretty much the high point of my experience, and made up for my dissapointment of the lack of "rare" collectables there. Everything there i could have found somewhere else.. Much cheaper. Of course the peeps dressed up in uniforms n "spock ears" cracked me up too. Was fun, but wont do it again.
Sorry you guys are putting up with the dumps. I do know the Original Sins converted 0.03c works with no dumps. One of these days ill convert my copy and re-upload it. Bad thing about 0.03c is there is no research pre-reqs for anything.
Can someone post the current status of this mod? Last post i saw suggested that the research needs to be done and that was all that was left.
The research was just submitted tonight for the Dominion. Things have been going a little slow atm with myself due to the holidays and real life. I assume the same with Stress. But dont fear we are working on the mod!!!!!!!
First i want you guys to give Jaylorpcs some MAJOR recognition. He pulled off the new builds researches damn near SOLO. Freeing me to work on other aspects of the mod. He deserves some major kudo's, and Karma. Freaking Outstanding!
Jay is right. Real life got the better of us for the moment. I am working, and have holiday commitments as do we all.
Research tress are done. They just need to be incorporated which will more than likely happen tonight.
Mesh issues fixed (miss sized bounding radius's), and miss sized shield meshes fixed.
Need to redo the mods music files. Removing all original sins references, and replacing them with only the mods music. I hate how IC did this for the record.
Dominion and Romulan factions still need rebalancing. Cloak needs to be added to ships that use it.
UI work is still in progress, and will be the largest chunk of work for 0.4e due to the ridiculous amount of UI textures. All of the older version of the mods UI textures need re-doing, because of texture corruption, and some ship slots have changed locations. New UI textures will be added to complete the mods LCAR's UI. I have to freehand draw some of UI in photoshop. Especially the hundreds of buttons. This is gonna take lots of time. Portraits, and ship pictures are going to be redone as well, because with some of the HUD, and build icon pictures you cant make out what ship it is clearly. So i am going to work on making them stand out more.
Was hoping for a christmas release, but i am not so sure now. Still have much to do.
Good job Jaylorpcs and SoA team. Look forward to the next release.
Thanks for the update and the hard work all of you guys are putting into this amazing mod!
Your continued dedication to bringing this mod along with the updates out to the ST fans here is very much appreciated. You guys rock!
/cheers
Just FYI.. A new SoA 2 topic will be started soon. It will cover The Original Sins version of the mod all the way to Sins Diplomacy. We still wont support original sins or entrenchment if we do decide to port over to diplomacy
Yes i am updating the Original Sins version of the mod. Just this one time. It will still be 0.03c, but i am adding dynamic movement, and vanilla sins research trees. That should tide you over until 0.4e/0.4d is released. 0.4d will depend on how much of a pain in the ass it will be to port the mod to Diplomacy, and if we feel it is worth doing. So far i am not too impressed with Diplomacy. Not that it is a bad expansion. It has its good points, but not enough right now IMO to waste another 6 months porting over the mod. I may "delegate" some authority to a 3rd party if there is enough interest in a Diplomacy port. For right now we are staying focused on Entrenchment.
You guys are great. It is now just like old times with the old HW SoA mod
I'm kinda confused....does that mean all discussion on this mod will be discontinued on this thread and moved over to the new one? If so plz make sure to link new forum thread....dont want to miss a single update on this mod.
gotta tell ya', this is the only thing keeping my interest in sins, great job!
I hear ya Stress. I pre-ordered my copy, and this preview so far does not bring much to the game (IMO it is basically the stata screen advanced, but not well enough to be worth the heart-ache).
I vote that you finish on this platform, and then when all is said and done, covert it to the new expansion (unless IC can put in some better things).
If you pre-ordered Diplomacy you should be able to DL the public beta. Least that is how SD/IC have been doing it.
From what i have seen of the Diplomacy beta so far porting SoA 2 over to Diplomacy will be a cakewalk compared to porting it from Original Sins to Entrenchment. Its file system is set up just like Entrenchment. This is of course if we decide to go that route. TBH i have no interest in porting over to Diplomacy just yet. So it will be up to you guys if we do it, or not.
The reason i will open a new topic is more like 1900+ reasons. As in this topic is becoming too heavy. People get confused looking back at 1000's of posts, and this forum has no search function.
Also if there are to be versions of the mod for Original Sins, Entrenchment, and Diplomacy then we need to keep it all centralized. My work on an updated SoA 2 "os" (os for Original Sins) is just a courtesy to tide you guys over until we get 0.4e out the door. It is the ONLY time i am gonna do this.
Yes of course ill link the new topic silly. Then i am gonna count how many times people bump this topic despite there being a new one
While Jay is finalizing the 0.4e researches i am porting 0.03c to work with original sins 1.181. Understand it will be an updated version of 0.03c. I am not gonna go nuts adding new stuff into it, because brutal honesty i dont have time to incorporate all the 0.4e stuff into it. Like i said above if someone else wants to take the time, and "downgrade" 0.4e once it is released i will have no issue with that.
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