ok now lately we all know lrm rushing has come back to the forefront of early game warfare. however thanks to amish... people now scout rush. now originally this was fine. it was a bold new tactic to add in a little mix however players have begun to abuse it obsessively and in all honesty since when are wars won with scouts and not frigates?
discuss
Then as I said, build a lot of LFs. Really, any spam can be countered- and virtually anything will destroy Scouts.
Really, and the Scout spam relies on having more. You need three Scouts to counter one Assailant, and killing LRFs is really all they can contribute in ship combat. I'm actually glad Scouts have found a use other than just running around.
Everything does have its place indeed. A scout is supposed to hmmmmmm.....I dont know......scout? Spamming anything isn't inventive. The fact that even one is named scout tells you that that class of ship is for scouting. They all don't have to have heavy cruiser or long range frigate or carrier in their name to be that kind of ship. Scouts are typically not intended to be the primary damage dealing component of a fleet because they are scouts. They are supposed to be quick and take enough damage to do their job at scouting effectively. Their job IS to run around. They already even have side uses as minesweepers and resource extraction with vasari. It does take more scouts than lrms to win but thats easily done and cheaper considering you dont have to research it. They are faster than anything short of strikecraft too so that means they can avoid you all day long if they want to and cause one of their counters(carriers) to build more slowly. TEC can even kill all your structures with time bombs and keep them killed by killing any contructor that pops back up. I tire of seeing fleets where the overwhelming majority are scouts even 45 minutes into the game.
[_]-Greyfox
Remove the scouts 200% damage buff against light armor type and you would probably never see them massed again.
Yes but then you woudl nerf the scouts vs each other. Like when i try to defend neutral againt vasari scouts I'll more often then nor use scouts of my own.
The real way to iliminate scouts as a rush unit is to reinstate carriers in their role.
I agree. Scouts are ships just like any other. And no they aren't "just for scouting". Each one has an ability that can be used for something else. Timed explosives, capture extractor, martyrdom. Timed explosives means TEC scouts can attack buildings incredibly effectively. Martyrdom encourages Advent players to bring seeker vessels into battle and kamikaze them against enemy ships. Primarily, scouts are for scouting but thats not their only role in the game by far. There's plenty of ways to kill them, so use em. Scout rush is the same as any rush, just learn to counter it and get over having to build something other than just LRMS in the beginning of the game. Why would you want to make the weakest military ship in the game weaker? Anything with AOE damage is going to own a crap load of scouts. Try that.
The devs certainly have more pressing issues to deal with than figuring out how to make scouts unable to rush.
As I said scouts them selves aren't the issue. but the carriers. People use the scouts to do the job the carriers should be doing. But yes scouts have otehr uses and those uses should remain and people should learn them.
Right, carriers have lost their place and need to have their nerf cut down more. I feel however, that we'll still see scouts in battle more than in previous patches even if they did fix carriers. People are going to use anything at their disposal to counter the ever dominant lrm.
I think that returning carriers to 1.1 would eliminate scouts as they are being used now for a couple of reasons. First off being that the LRMs that scouts are being made to kill would be built less in favor of carriers(basically killing off the prey means the predators starve). Also fighters would kill scouts more efficiently than scouts kill carriers. I was always fine with carriers even before they were nerfed.
Quite simply 1.1 was the best the game had ever been.
I made a post to give as much explanation as possible about this. Scouts aren't impossible to counter. If anything they're incredibably easy to counter. Check my post. It's in this strategy section too.
Actually Corsairs were for countering Carriers.
The pirate HC? What are you on? Not sure what you actually meant there. The post is up now.
Um silly question for you all. If the carriers are as nerfed as you say they are why dosen't someone make a simple mod that resets the carriers for all three races. Just edit the carriers and pop them in. Figure out what stats you all want and make an Unofficial Patch like the mod community did with Oblivion and Fallout 3. Or don't mods work on Multiplayer if everone in the game has the same ones?
Problem here it doesnt work as well as fallout or Oblivion smaller communaty and lsot fo people don't read the forums and play online. In the end it wouldn't work. Sot he game it'S self needs to be fixed in the official way. And the active member of this communaty are trying to help the devs along that road.
Everything counters scouts but lums I mean lrf
Not when they had the armor upgrade. Scouts > Carriers ~> Corsairs > Scouts
scouts already cant be 'primary component' or core of the fleet....if you lose to such a thing you are either LRF rusher or a retard......use the mind device to think of an early game counter to scouts,thats not hard to figure out.really.
As a relative newcomer to the game Ive learnt that IF you get hit by scout spam early, you biggest ally is build speed. Scouts have to be 3v1 or more to be effective. Once engaged the enemy has to build more and faster and you only need to build 1-1.5 for every three.
That being said, if the enemy has 30-50 scouts in your HW early game, then you missed something before they got there.
However, its fascinating to see the way scouts can be used.
Questions on scouts?
Can you set them to move in a permanant patrol around 4-5 planets. Set it and leave them go round and round?
Is there anyway to determine where they will go to autoexplore? If the map is 50% controlled by you, will they avoid your 50% and mostly move around enemy territory? Thus as you own more of the map, they only move around smaller areas?
I LOVE TEC SCOUTS ----timed explosives are so soo much fun to use on those precious labs and factories
But if im TEC im going to start immidiatly building scouts. If i see my opponent going LRF heavy then i get 30-even 50 scouts (if hes advent then i especialy need alot of them early). Then i get my own LRF at this point for a multitude of reasons (they counter the scouts counter, they kill caps, and buildings...) if i see he is getting alot of flak (advent usualy will) and/or carriers then i throw in LFs...
What im saying is scouts countering LRFs (especialy lums) brings balance to the game. Noone is gonna LRF spam and win against me (anymore...lol). It did take me a couple of games for to do it right.
He builds LRF---> i build scouts to counter--> he gets LFs/scouts/flak (latter not so good) to counter--> i get LRFs/LFs to counter. Before you know it each player has a decent amount of almost everyship.
I love that scouts have a place in battle, and i love the balance scouts bring to the game where carriers are failing
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