Recently I've noticed more and more regulus are just tossing minds at peoples feat as apposed to laying traps (like their description and very nature would imply they are used for). I'm not complaining about the amount of damage mines do, I understand why regulus does so much damage. But the ability to toss mines at people feat just seems contradictory to their nature. Mines in real life and in most other games are used for ambushes. They take time and planning to use and rely and luring an enemy to their position so as to fight them under the conditions they desire. Just running up and tossing them at someones feat barely delivers the romanticism implied by the name mines. Why not just make them grenades? They explode when thrown and do not stay on the ground.A Mine would require time to bury and forethought as to how to fight the target.Like I said I'm not complaining about the damage as much as I am pointing out the misnomer
Regulus has a strong autoattacklategame and mines are, once again, very very good for one on one confrontations (against melee, anyway). He is by no means hard to play as in a 1v1.
What's even more annoying is that you can't kill the mines even if you can see them. The only point to seeing them is so you walk around them but you can't shoot them from range.
The key word here is late game. Regulus is a good late game character, he sucks early game.
This is seriously silly.
If you can't interrupt mines or at notice them coming, you need to pay better attention. This should be even easier to anticipate after he tries to pull it on you a few times.
Kind of a shame that in a game this basic, people can't figure out how to counter an ability as slow, predictable, and obvious as using mines as grenades.
Mines have a 1 second cast time. Oak and maybe Torchbearar can stop it if they have their attention on the regulus, UB and Sedna are fast enough but their range is significantly shorter than mines.
Latency is also a problem. I've played games where I can't reliably cast interrupts before a Hammer Slam hits owing to latency, a 1 second cast time is effectively uninterruptible in those circumstances.
It's 100% impossible for a Rook to dodge mines or interrupt Regulus, which is super lame. Doesn't Regulus have enough advantages over any Rook build already?
Pretty much agree with you... if you are good, you don't complain about this kinda stuff, if you are bad, even if they nerf regulus, you will still lose to him.
It's hard to interrupt a 1 sec cast time skill when it's lagging... the human reaction time is .3 seconds, so you need to be able to cast within .7-casting time of your interrupt-amount of time lag will affect you to hit. With lag frequently being 200 ms in the heat of battle (with some people) that's .5 - skill time, with a .3 second cast skill you have essentially .2 seconds to hit Regulus, and that is assuming that you can notice the very start of the Mines animation and react within the right amount of time (while really, the animation overlaps a bit so you might not even have that much). It's very reasonable to be unable to interrupt this, especially when the enemy is a melee demigod.
Also, it still doesn't change that mines deal a tremendous amount of damage and hugely debuff the enemy if they are stunned. While I'm not saying this is cheap, or OP (it's actually very smart playing), it does make the disadvantage of mines, being dodgable, a nonissue, and the other disadvantage (long casting time) is solved by it having a long range and needing, at best (no lag at all and a .1 cast skill) a .6 second window to interrupt. That's not very big.
I'm not saying it's overpowered. It's a very nice ability, but it's a huge amount of reliable damage with a huge effect at level 10. With smart play, mines and a stun from your ally = GG whatever demigod you just hit, because his speed is going to be absurdly low and if your ally has another interrupt, he can't even teleport out.
Granted, you arent gonna interrupt every one of your opponent's casts in a match due to lag spikes or just general latency. But I do feel that after the first time a Reg player starts dropping mines in a match, you will be more mentally prepared to anticipate it and not only see him pull his arm back to drop them, but also notice hes stopped shooting, or just outright guess when it would make the most sense to toss them.
So from my perspective, this is what mines really look like on this topic. Off the top of my head the ideal situations where I would drop mines offensively are:
Getting Rushed by a melee focused DG:
Against characters like Sedna, Oak, Erebus, or UB, I can not risk letting them get into melee before I drop mines. The chances of getting Silenced, Stunned, Penitenced, Pounced, or Misted are too high, and mines are my sole source of close range burst damage.
The main way an opponent can counter this is to immediately change direction once they see the Mine toss animation. Due to its cast time and somewhat shorter range, I usually have to guess the best direction and range to throw them. If the opponent is oblivious and continues forward as if nothing happened, yea hes gonna be eating some serious damage before he can open up on me.
If the enemy switches direction at the last minute however, they usually wont be in the full spread of mines and at least mitigate some of the damage, leaving me with a much lower chance of survival now that my mines are on cooldown and I cant really run him into the remaining active mines.
Assisting a DG already engaged with an ally:
This is also a good scenario to drop mines offensively if you are absolutely certain the fight will remain stationary long enough to get in range and drop them.
Against an opponent or average awareness, assisting with mines will usually only work at the fights onset, and only when both combatants are unlikely to run away from each other. This approach is unreliable in a 2v1 scenario because if the enemy DG has half a brain, he will not engage.
This will also not work well unless the combat area is flooded with creeps and other visual distractions; Because the mines are shorter range than your crossbow, Regulus has to stop his firing and walk towards the enemy. This movement makes it a bit obvious what you are planning and as a result, the fight might shift while you are in cast animation, especially if you have already done this a few times before in the same match.
This also doesn't work well if your ally has a great level advantage over the opponent. Once the opponent is psychologically dominated into permenantly disengaging from your ally, it will be unlikely you will ever be able to set up a good assist mine bomb.
Presently engaged by a melee focused DG:
This approach is a last ditch effort and something that needs to be timed when you are certain your opponent has no interrupt abilities off cooldown. Tanking melee DG's that have invested in HP and Lifesteal is almost certain doom for Regulus. To be totally honest though, this is a desperate measure that has a pretty uncertain success rate, depending on your opponent.
If the enemy survives, you have very few options short of trinkets and potions to win the damage race. The mines will put you ahead, but if the enemy DG is wearing the appropriate gear and is of comparable level, that lead will not last long.
I really have had a much greater margin of success with using mines in ways besides just dropping them in front of me. It only works vs. DGs with crap HP and/or poor offensive abilities.
Mines aren't that great in the context of throwing them at your opponent as you're fighting 1v1.
You can't target a player with them so you kind of have to guess where they will be.
There's an obvious animation you're throwing them, it takes time and can be interrupted. This makes it worthless vs. frost TB, a boulder rook, sedna, oak, UB, basically anyone with a stun/interrupt.
You get to see where they land, and they don't go off immediately. If you're a range class, just run towards regulus; if you're a melee class run through regulus. It's really unlikely he will either throw it at his own feet or behind him.
It's pretty decent at farming grunts.. but so is his wings really. Imagine If you're going 1v1 against another regulus who has 4 points into stats and just moves when you throw the mines; you're going to be in a world of hurt.
Mines do definitely have a purpose though.. they are solid for taking out minions and they really shine when supporting others.. setting them up early.. or saving a fleeing DG on your team. Again, very difficult to snare opponents that are running because of the cast time. Set early and used defensively they are the most effective.
As for effective as a 'trap' or vs. towers that's really exaggerated. Any general with 6 minions and a wave of creeps could zerg a tower faster than a regulus using mines to take it down. And really.. if you're worried that regulus is planting 6 mines on say the center flag in Cataract.. spend like what.. 150 gold? to buy the detect eyes. Or if you're a general just have your minions walk in front of you.
They're not awful.. and I definitely use them from time to time.. esp. on cataracts and vs. teams with more generals than assassins. But regulus has a lot of other good skills.. range.. slow.. snipe and he's fragile so stats really help. On a fast hectic map like prison I almost never use it and recommend going straight snipe, snare, and stats with a lot of damage and health items and forgo mana.
my 2C
I actually think that mines would be much too weak if they couldn't be thrown under someone's feet. I don't really think leaving a little trap for an enemy player is typically useful, especially since there is rarely more than a couple places that you could set them where they won't be hit by the enemy grunts, and players are usually very mine-conscious when they enter these places.
It's also nice that mines give Regulus a good reason to get up close in a fight. Without that, he kind of would just sit back and fire from a safe distance.
The problem is that if you're trying to dodge them when they're airborne it's probably too late unless you were already in motion... The fact is that they have a fairly long cast time, the time between the beginning of the cast, the travel time, and the arming time is more than sufficient to escape.
The real problem is that 90% of the casts in this game have incredibly subtle animations. The only decent one is hypnosis.
I play a Regulus online. Yes, mines are very powerful. Even too powerful, compared to the other demigods' abilities. But right now, Reg really needs them to be effective. Snipe is anything but a main damage power, MoB is nice, kinda, but situational, and ineffective against some demigods. With the game as it is now, where an Erebus assassin is far more effective assassin than all the Light assassins, and can beat Regulus without losing 25% health, Regulus needs something to make foes think twice about confronting him.
Acceptable nerfs: 2s activation time: coupled with the 2s casting time, it will be a great GTFO skill, kinda like the fear effect of Hammer Slam, and remain an effective "mine", but not a good "grenade".lower damage across all levels, snare across all levels:I'd personally love a lower damage mine if it snared by ~10% on level 1.1 mine with the same stats on all levels, but an energy and recharge reduction for the skill on each level, and max mine increase for levels: this could work, would enable Reg to make cheap minefields fast, and up his damage a bit, together with a l15 snare.Can't think of anything else right now.
How about we nerf mines in a way so that they're slower, but buff snipe so that the arrow passes through every enemy on its path to its target(doing less damage to enemies that aren't the target, of course)? Regulus gets a useful AoE, and mines become less OMGWTFSUPERSPIKEOFDEATH. Not to mention they can be used more as traps and less like grenades.
Mines have been nerfed to death already we are down to 6 mines from 50 people get a grip it is his only big damage attack in melee
He used to be able to have 50 mines active at once??!?
Jeebus, stay away from center flag.
30 normal and 20 demigod specific mines in beta 1 guess you don't remember much
Mine do great burst damage but I dont think they are that OP as they can be counter and avoid easily if you pay attention to the Regulus. I haven't had a game where those mines were giving me trouble because it's so easy to run away from them or predict they are.
On other hand, I played Regulus a few times. I dont throw them at my opponent, but right under my feet and then asking them, MELEE DEMIGODs to try me. Does anybody do that?
yea in real life mines are different thatn in demigod, but have you ever seen a catapulasaurus? just wondering
I have...
I fought a high-rank player today (PUG 3v3 on Cataract) whose entire strategy centered around spamming mines. He had a Staff of Renewal and was loaded up with +mana and +health items. He wasn't speedy and he didn't hit hard with his bow, so its clear he was concentrating heavily on his abilities and tanking.
It was unbelievably annoying. He spammed them at like max rate for the whole game. They have good AOE and he was extremely good at targeting - despite knowing what was coming, it was extremely difficult to dodge...and dodging with minions is a waste of time. His tank build also meant that if attacked he threw the mines at his feet, causing facesmashing damage. The massive -slow is insult piled atop injury.
We did win the game, but it was a damn close thing. We managed to score two kills right before giants came out. Used the temporary advantage to secure control of one of their portals, and although it was touch and go for a while that was the deciding moment. The Regulus had something like 500k damage, IIRC I was next closest with 260k. if he couldn't kick the hell out of us he would kick the hell out of our minions. he was happy either way. I'm certain 85% of this damage was mines.
the only reason we won is that our team was resistant to minespam, and we got lucky timing on our kills. They were pinning the hell out of us.We had:
Mines need buff.
Trust me, At least mines should not disappear in current way.
For example, I put three mines on the flag.
And I throw three mines on an enemy demigod.
Now I have three total positioned.
But as soon as I throw another three, the ones on the flag gone.
This really defeats the actual definition of "mine" in this game.
Unless this is fixed/buffed you will see more and more people spamming mines as grenades.
They do that because you can only have 6 mines on the map at once, so if you try to exceed that limit the oldest mines disappear. The same thing happens to Rook towers. What you're suggesting would only lead to their overuse as Regulus will just lay mines all over the map and turn it into a minefield.
It's sad that people don't understnd how overpowered mines are, and especially with two regs. The arming time should be a second or two longer. In general its fairly ridiculous that a reg can stand on top of you and put them at your feet and get huge garaunteed damage. You have two choices (run), or run behind the reg. Yes running behind the reg sound easy. It would be if the pathing in this game didnt blow. I mean many people forget this is still a BETA game. They have made us pay for a BETA game. The game is fun, but the balance programming and bug testing are a joke. If this game had to meet specifications of a car manufacturer they'd be shut down.
With that saidthe biggest fix mines need is they need to be mitigated by armor(they are not). They should also disappear quicker like rook towers. Also slowing someone down 33% may be fine "1v1" but its not fine in team battle. It's basically an i win button in a group fight. It shoud be tweaked to 20-25% maximum and you should have to put skill points in it in addition to the slowing shot. Whatever % you've speced your slowing shot to be should be what your mines slow as well.
I'd like to see overall tweaking done. Perhaps giving reg a "scatter shot" like a WoW hunter has or more varied forms of mines (burst dmg mines, slow mines, and fire mines)
Let me also add to this.
Mines would be closer to being balanced if that map was "wide open" all the time. If it were just an open world. But with the slow masturbation we have to do at the flags for the first 10 minutes of the game or more its hugely in favor of a class that can just sit back and control a lane with mines. Once the all the towers are down and everyone is running around it's a bit more balanced because people can actually just avoid the mines and or the reg but this is whent he game is over and is such a minute portion of the game.
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