Okay, I now feel confident in publicly saying that I think that the connectivity issues some have had is going to go away next week.
Here's what we've built:
1. If you open ports 6112 to 6200 and port forward them to your IP on your router (this is for people who are familiar with this stuff) you'll get what is called direct connect.
2. If you don't do this, we will try to do a quick NAT connect. This takes longer but works for most people.
3. If NAT fails, you will be connected to our Proxy server system. This is not going to be super desireable at first because the physical location of the Proxy server is going to make the difference between a good and a lagfest. When the proxy server is nearby (east coast US player for instance to the east cost proxy server) it's perfectly good. But, for instance, if you're in Japan and it uses a proxy server in Singapore, you're adding 200ms to your latency which can make the game a total lag nightmare. so this is clearly your last result.
...
Now, right now, the current version of Demigod uses a connectivity server that ONLY does option 2. That's because it was decided early on that users shouldn't have to open ports. This, IMO, should NEVER have been the first option because when you force even technically sophisticated users into this system, you end up having a LOT of unnecessary connections to these NAT servers.
So, I feel confident that this next week is going to be the turning point for those people who have had connectivity difficulties PLUS the whole range of stat stuff, pantheon stuff, etc. will all come into line as well because, as I've said elsewhere, because the connectivity thing was our #1 priority, everyone, including the people who would resolve favor items and favor points and accurate win/loss stuff have been pulled onto this.
Heck, this past week, I had the ART team from Elemental working on doing benchmarks for speeing up NAT (That's where we finally concluded that NAT, for P2P is just feasible when there's thousands of players, it would simply require so many NAT servers, located around the world, to make it not totally awful that it wasn't financially logical - we'd be better off just hosting all the traffic which is better anyway).
..
We absolutely do not want to do any more "betas". The betas don't really solve our problems. We're getting rave emails from people in support today saying how this beta "totally fixes connectivity". NO, it doesn't. The only reason it seems that way is because there's so fewer people using the beta servers. If you check impulsereactor.dll, it's still the same one from day 0. So the betas don't really help because it gives us the same false sense of success that the actual open beta had.
The other problem with the beta is that it splits the multiplayer community which is really a problem. Right now, the Demigod MP community is fragmented. You've got a ton of people on Game Ranger. a Bunch of people on Himachi, others on Demigod release and some on the beta. And you get some very poor results hwen you play Skirmish or Pantheon or just find games.
Now one of the things that I've always been painfully aware of in online games is that you need a critical mass of users to make it work. With Demigod, we have some plans on how to make sure there's always lots of people to play with once the MP is bullet proof both in terms of connectivity and stat tracking. As someone who has been ejected from a pantheon game during connection, I know we have to do some QUICK changes to some of this stuff in order for the MP experience to have any integrity.
First, one of the things we did is we have everyone's email address who has updated the game. When we start the next-gen pantheon with favor points, achievements, favor items, stat tracking, disconnects dealt with and of course bullet proof MP (all of which I expect to be done this week) we will email everyone letting them know where we are at.
Second, the Stardock marketing push will actually begin. After that day 0 debacle with the MP connectivity being so crummy, I made marketing halt all Demigod marketing efforts. Those will go into high gear probably in the third week of May.
Third, and this is where we need your help: The demo. We will be working with GPG on the demo but I was thinking of proposing that the demo for Demigod be multiplayer ONLY. Moreover, I would like the demo players to be able to play online with legitimate players. Here's where we need your help: What do you think would be a good way to limit this demo then in order to get people to still buy the game?
Fourth, we plan to start formal Demigod tournmants with cash and prizes for the winners.
Fifth, Stardock is working on an update to Impulse Reactor that will allow people to have more control over the types of people people are matched up with. Think of it being like eHarmony but for gaming. You'll be able to describe the type of gamer you are and the match making system will pick out people for you. This feature is actually being developed for Elemental but because Demigod uses Impulse Reactor, it'll get that for free.
Sixth, Stardock moderators will soon be introduced into the online community. This will probably happen in mid-May. The idea is, if we have forum moderators, why not multiplayer ones? Their job will be to provide enjoyable multiplayer experiences (i.e. good sports, skilled player, etc.) PLUS they will be able to add or subtract in-game karma from players. People who are just nasty or horrible to other players will lose karma points. People who are good sports and good citizens will get points. Those with higher karma will tend to get matched up. Yes, we know this is controversal. Players will see the karma as part of their account and there will be a way for users who feel they were unfairly negated to appeal.
Seventh, all people who have bought Demigod at retail or direct up May 10th (and didn't return the game obviously) will be getting a coupon that will let them purchase a second copy of Demigod for 50% off for a limited time as a way for us to show appreciation for this community that has put their faith and trust in us.
Thanks everyone!
I think from my post it's pretty obvious what my complaint is, Fanboy.
when can we expect the coupons? I wanna start calling my freinds
I'm assuming multiplayer.
1. No ability to buy artifacts.
2. Limited ability to tech up.
3. Limited demigod selection.
What you want is a situation where they can start a game, play, and have fun... FOR A WHILE. Then they get crushed midgame onwards if they can't tech up past... say level 10 (just pulling a number out of my ass here), and if they can't equip powerful items that others can equip.
I see one potential pitfall here. If one team has the misfortune of getting a demo player on their team, they are sure to lose. One solution would be to only pair demo players with other demo players, or perhaps evenly distrubute the demo players between teams.
You could contemplate...
but the problem I see here is that it might be too much of a disability early game, where as you would want their disability to come later in the game.
I think that you should just cap the favor at 200 or something, at least then they get too see how it works and can use the first couple of items.
So here's what I'm thinking. You make the full version of Demigod a free download over Impulse. You can't log in to play online without a key, of course, which you have to pay for. It's the full latest game, all bug-fixed and patched, you can skirmish all you like, etc. It's what people are pirating, only with the bugfixes in (for crash to desktops, sound issues, and so on). Make sure that the game, when you're not logged in with a valid key to play online, has a nice big jolly button on the main menu that says "purchase Demigod for free updates, new demigods, online play, tournaments, and more!" Basically, make the warez version irrelevant while simultaneously giving people a better, fuller demo experience, and making it easier for people to purchase the game if they like it (no need to re-download a non-demo or non-warez version, no need to patch up, just buy a key and log in).
So here's what I'm thinking. You make the full version of Demigod a free download over Impulse. You can't log in to play online without a key, of course, which you have to pay for. It's the full latest game, all bug-fixed and patched, you can skirmish all you like, etc. It's what people are pirating, only with the bugfixes in (for crash to desktops, sound issues, and so on). Make sure that the game, when you're not logged in with a valid key to play online, has a nice big jolly button on the main menu that says "purchase Demigod for free updates, new demigods, online play, tournaments, and more!"
Basically, make the warez version irrelevant while simultaneously giving people a better, fuller demo experience, and making it easier for people to purchase the game if they like it (no need to re-download a non-demo or non-warez version, no need to patch up, just buy a key and log in).
This seems like the best idea so far. It shows how generous you are, prevents the online part of the game from being messed up with all the potential mp demo issues, and ultimately will increase sales... because rather than pirating it, people will have the latest game (sp only of course), polished & bugless, with lots of advertising for the real thing.
It seems a bit crazy at first, but I can't see any problems with it now. Great idea, +1
Great news. I've been having a blast so far, and these connection fixes will only make it better! And when can we expect to recieve our cupons? I've got a couple of friends who want them.
Reguarding the Demo:
I'm strongly against the idea of only allowing 2/4 DGs for the demo players. If this is finalized, these select two are going to overrun the matches, and give these two demigods the apperenace of "noob characters." I think that the demo players should have the ability to play as each DG; however, only a select two at one time. My suggestion is to allow two DG's to be available at a time (one assassin, and one general), but once every 24 hours, change the DGs (or follow some sort of Demigod rotation). This would still limit the choices that the demo gives, but still creates enough options that people will get to experiment with different characters. This would still result in days where most players selected one DG, but changing it every 24 hours prevents the major influx of a single character.
I'm also against the idea limiting items for demo'ers. The demo should be a portion of the full game, not some half-powered trial account. If these demo players are going to be joining games with legimitate buyers, give them a chance. Favor items should also be reset every 24, giving these players some incentive to actually buy it if they want to be competetive.
A similiar idea could be implemented for maps as well, limiting demo players to only two maps per day. I'm obviously bias towards my idea, but I think this would help DG. These map rotations will create interesting matches. Right now, these games are mostly 3v3 conquest games on Cataract. If the map day was, say Prison, and Brothers, then there would be a large number of Prison and Brother games. The devs obviously spent a lot of time making each of these different maps, lets give some other ones a chance.
You could either list the daily rotations for these, or make them random. Perhaps a bulletin window when you boot the game explaining which DGs are selectable for demo, and which two maps are chosen for the day.
They should not get access to pantheon. I'm undecided on if they should only be allowed to play in custom, or skirmish matches. They should not have access to clans, or be on the leaderboards.
tl;dr: 24 Hour Rotations: Two Demigods, Two maps, new favor each day.
Second thoughts: You could even limit the amount to ONE per day. Some people might just stick with the demo rathar than buying the full thing.
50% off. I love you.
The thing is, if you let the demo-er choose whatever Demigod they want, there will be people who will just re-download the demo so they can just keep playing. If you limit it to two specific demigods then I think more people will want to get the game to try out Demigods that they would have no opportunity to use otherwise.
I think in general, for the Demo, whenever you restrict anything, it should be specific restrictions that are the same for every demo download.
Just my opinion.
+karma on stardocks response time to issues and listening to the community.
Where/When/How do I get my 50% coupon.
*snip*
Actually, I mentioned that only two (or even one) of the DGs would be playable at a time. Every 24 hours a new DG would be selected. The user wouldn't be able to re-download to get the one they want, it would be based on the DG Main server. They would have to wait until the one they wanted gets picked, to be able to use that one that day.
For Example:
Today, players would only be allowed to play The Rook, and Oak. The two selected maps would be Crucible and Cataract. Tomorrow, the characters would be limited to Torch Beaer, and Queen of Thorns; the maps would then be Prison and Brothers, and so on. Each day, a new (possibly random, but still based on the Demigod main server) combination of DG's and maps for the demo players.
I think the point of the Frogster pushing for MP on the demo is to allow all of the people who've been hearing negative things about Demigod multiplayer to try it out for themselves. I agree that this is a good move, but the problem seems to be that the community doesn't want demo-restricted newbies swarming all over their games. But if you keep demo-ers restricted to their own type, you run the risk of the demo player pool running dry a month or two down the road. It's an interesting problem, one I can't even pretend to know the correct answer to (outside of what's already been recommended). So, uhm, good luck! I'll be over here enjoying my retail copy and buying my roommate a 50% discounted copy to get him off his damned DotA!
The demo needs to be multiplayer and capable of playing with the larger community. Why? Because these games die if there are not enough people playing and by allow the demo people to play with retail people, you make the community that much larger. Segregating the community is a bad idea. Further, this game got a very bad rap for connectivity. Letting the demo people get into games with the retail people demonstrates that that is all behind us.
My idea for restrictions on the demo:
2 demigods, 1 light, 1 dark
1 map
-------------------
I am not in favor (ha) of capping favor or any other in game stat. I do not want to be paired with a person that is handicapped playing a team that is not. The limited number of demigods and maps will entice people to buy the full game.
I think that would be a good compromise...free sins expansion pack or even 50% off it
Posting again, Sorry but this is what a demo should be:
-2 Demigods...one Light, one Dark....have one General, one Assassin.
-Probably Queen of Thorns and Rook
Queen of Thorns to seduce them to the wonderful graphics
Rook to show them the power of Demigods (and he's on the cover)
-1 Map- Crucible
-Favor Items are limited to the 1st 4 on the list but others can be viewed
-Items at the shop can be bought but only 2 from each section...the rest can be viewed also
-And for Demigod's sake! No Online Demo please...
Period.
-Phal
If you make the demo MP online playable and with limited demigods, PLEASE consider to put the demo players on a separate server or something. Because if not, the full game owners will have a hard time playing online with an invasion of only one type of Demigod (the one that was included in the demo)...
I like the idea of rotating which DG demo players can use.
I hate the idea of playing against a certain DG or two every single game because people are on the demo. Why don't we make each person get a random hero for the demo only? That way the game isn't inundated with Rooks, and every player gets just a taste of the game.
Fine with me, but do you really think people will pay 40 dollars just so they don't have to play with Random heroes?
Does opening port 6112 to 6200 invovle using the file : impulsereactoroptions.exe in demigod directory?No, it involves using your router.
You obviously wasnt participating in the beta.
For the game to use those ports, it was necessary to use this file located in demigod directory to actually tell the game to not use the NAT and use thoses ports instead. But im not sure if this has changed since release.
And yeah I know its on the router i open ports duh.
Oh, I'm fine many of the other restrictions people are suggesting (no favor, limited time, etc). I was just saying that instead of everyone playing Rook and QoT, we could have the first demo player get Rook and only Rook forever, the second person get Sedna and only Sedna, the third gets TB, etc.
IF YOU DO A DEMO, MAKE A TUTORIAL!
If I were in charge of arranging a demo, I'd make it a free weekend, like Valve have done for Left4Dead, Team Fortress 2 and Unreal Tournament 3. That strategy seems to work really well for them (or at least I assume so, as they keep on doing it!). I can't think of a better way to demo a multiplayer game than having the whole thing for a couple of (non-working) days.
Of course, doing that means your servers are going to get absolutely hammered for that one weekend, and people will get angry if that impacts on download speed (as happened in Steam's UT3 free weekend).
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