Has it ever occured to anyone that, over the course of history, humans often come to the conclusion that anything that cannot be explained at the moment is automatically considered to be supernatural? For example, the Greeks. They had a god for just about anything that they could not explain with their means of science or technology at the time. How else could they explain the torrent of fire and molten lava that spwes out of a volcano? By claiming that Hephasteus is simply working in his forge of course.
But fast forward to today. And we know that isn't the case. The advent of computers, automobiles, airplanes, etc etc etc, would simply astound the Ancient Greeks. They would consider us gods. They would be unable to speak out of pure awe.
And since science is never ending in the sense that, with each question answered, more questions are formed... we still do not have a logical explanation for God. That being that supposedly judges us from afar, and moves through us all.
Think about it though... what if we just haven't reached the technological threshold to explain it yet?
It could be possible, that "God" is nothing more than a wave that interacts with our matter. Influencing our decisions with maybe electrical impulses or something similar. Religion is making "god" more important than it really is. With the advent of more powerful technology, we may be able to see what it is that moves through us all. More than likely, it is just another force of nature. It justs exists. It is there, always has been. But it is not a being, it is not something to worship... it is just not something we can understand. YET.
Basically, what I am trying to say is, we humans have proven over time that with the advent of better technology we can understand the ways of nature around us. So what's to stop us from unlocking the secrets of the universe? As well as explaining what "god" really is? We just can't comprehend it yet... but we will in time I think. Just like we did with volcanoes, oceans, telephones, airplanes, etc etc etc.
Religion is powerful in many ways no doubt. It helps certain people get through rough times, and to them, it explains the way things are as well giving them a code of ethics that they can follow. But religion is also on a way ticket to being obsolete. If science can bridge the gap between the two, what now?
Now just so everyone knows, I am not trying to attack anyones beliefs, I am merely wondering outloud if the above could be the case. I would also like to hear what other people have to say. Please be open-minded, and rational.
I will explain in better detail some ideas that I have heard as well some of my own if a great dialogue can be established.
Well, I asked....and you replied....Zorastrianism may be good enough for you as a revealed religion by God, but it's rings up a "No Sale" for me.
I know. You and I have different attitudes towards the Holy Bible.
You are so eager to be the sole arbitrator of truth that you happily reject what the Bible says if it contradicts your opinion.
Zoroastrianism IS a revealed religion.
Thus says Yahweh to his anointed, to Cyrus, whom he has taken by his right hand to subdue nations before him and strip the loins of kings, to force gateways before him that their gates be closed no more: I will go before you levelling the heights. I will shatter the bronze gateways, smash the iron bars. I will give you the hidden treasures, the secret hoards, that you may know that I am Yahweh. (Isaiah 45:1-3)
And the Bible doesn't even have to say it for it to be true. Zoroastrianism is a revealed religion by the virtue of being revealed, not by the virtue of being mentioned in the Bible. But the fact that the Zoroastrian King is specifically mentioned in the Bible as G-d's servant and agent really gives it away.
Leauki, with consideration to the other readers, if you wish to debate this further, perhaps we should cut and paste this to another blog?
Yes.
http://citizenleauki.joeuser.com/article/350814/Judaism_before_and_after_Jesus
I am not relegious but i AM spiritualyet i can easly explain my spiritual elements in what i beliave is a sientific fact
Everything in the univarse is made of energythe base of every element is the univarse is energy, even us as humans
so here how it works:1. we made of energy which means we can be effected by outer source of energysome call it Karma, when we are serounded by a balanced source of energy we feal stable and secureyet when we come close to an unbalced source of energy, we feel anxious2. I beliave people can feel this energy, yet some of them apply it to the feeling of a beeinglike there is someone invisible near us, religious people say its God or Angels who follow themand protect them and so on.3. By nature people are social beings, when we find ourself alone we naturally seekfor company, if we cant find it, after awhile our senses sharpens and we start to feel thingsusually we never could of feel, a good excample is when someone walking alone in the middle of the nightand got this feeling like hes been watched or followed, while the truth is that he just sance the energy all around him.
Now about how people explain things they cant undarstand..Indeed long time ago before the sience revolution, many applyed religious answaresto things they cant explain, but today its somewhat different, people close thair eyes to factsjust because they prefare to think that its god, people see things that arent real because theywant to see them, such as the face the jesus on trees, clouds, and so on...The fact that no one really knows how jesus looked like, the religous people dont care abou it at all!someone told them that jesus is a cocasian guy with ling hair and beard, so they all think its the truthwhile facts are that jesus was born in the middle east to a middle eastern jewish fammilywhich means that he probbly was not cocasion but more like middle eastern with brown skin and black hair and dark eyes.yet religious people prefare to ignore those facts.
I think its due the fact that people are in so much need to feel spacial and unique that they will fightanyone who will say otherwise.even if today i will be a part of an experiment where doctors will stop my hear and brain activityfor 15 minuts and then bring me back to life, and then they will ask me what did i seeand ofcourse record it all on video, it wont change anything, even if i will say that i saw heavensome will come up with explanations like it all was illusion due to chemicals in my brainif i will say it didnt saw anything, religous people will just turn thair back to me and this video
When I was a Priest, I was in on a lot of protests... does that count? :~D
Makeshiftwings:
"God is man trying to ignore how science does it."
If you replace the word "God" with the word "Religion" I'd have to agree with you, at least to some extent. I've talked to religious people who seem to bend over backwards trying to deny anything science has to teach us. One guy said that science can't possibly accurately measure distances in space. When I asked him why NASA engineers could accurately "guess" where Mars would be when the Rover was supposed to enter it's atmosphere... he had no answer... but he was still insistent that science can't possibly measure distances in space.
I understand people choosing science or spiritual, but I can't find anywhere in any scripture that tells me that I'm supposed to ignore the things of the physical simply because I accept the spiritual. For that matter, while there are many who tell me that the physical proves that can't be a spiritual, I haven't seen any proof of that either.
But I did get a laugh from your paraphrase. ;~D
Man dont confuce spirituality with religion!I am spiritual AND very sientific, and the fact im spiritual dosnt mean im religious, as i am not..
Man dont confuse spirituality with religion!I am spiritual AND very sientific, and the fact im spiritual dosnt mean im religious, as i am not..
That's a very good point!
Religion is a set of rules, spirituality is an approach to faith. One can be religious and spiritual or one of the two or neither.
When I asked him why NASA engineers could accurately "guess" where Mars would be when the Rover was supposed to enter it's atmosphere... he had no answer... but he was still insistent that science can't possibly measure distances in space.
Nothing ever landed on Mars. It was a sound stage on Pluto!
I have a little video link I would like to give to all of you. I find it quite interesting, it is just under an hour in length. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liMmvu9eMrg , I hope some of you find it as interesting as I did.
I hope some of you find it as interesting as I did.
Any hint what it might be about?
'Why We Believe in Gods' I found it quite interesting. The Dr. giveing the talk appears in the current Discover Magazine.
Coca Cola:
I think of the two pretty much interchangeably, but that is mostly because my religious and spiritual beliefs are inseparable. I do understand that many people think of them as different, and that works too.
'Why We Believe in Gods'
I believe in G-d because my parents told me that there is one.
Essentially I believe in G-d for the same reason that I don't wet my pants.
Interesting, I didn't know that. Which ones?
I thought the Protestant Reformation abolished the priestly office and doesn't acknowledge the Sacrament of Holy Orders. It repudiates anything of sacerdotalism or of a priesthood distinct by its very nature from the condition of the laity.
A Catholic priest receives the very priesthood of Christ in the order of Melchidechech indelibly stamped on his soul by the Sacrament of Holy Orders. He is forever consecrated and raised to a sacred dignity above all other levels.
It's in the article I linked to.
The general priesthood or the priesthood of all believers, is a Christian doctrine derived from several passages of the New Testament. It is a foundational concept of Protestantism.[7] It is this doctrine that Martin Luther adduces in his 1520 To the Christian Nobility of the German Nation in order to dismiss the medieval Christian belief that Christians were to be divided into two classes: "spiritual" and "temporal" or non-spiritual.
Ordained Protestant clergy often have the title of pastor, minister, etc. In Scandinavian Lutheran national Churches which have episcopal polity, ordained clergy are called priests.
It doesn't specifically list priest in the titles list, however there are several, mostly they are the more radical churches, however they do exist. What a church wishes to refer to their clergy has can change even within a religious designation.
As far as I know the "priesthood of all believers" is a doctrine that says that all Christians are priests. It does not establish a Lutharan priesthood comparable to the Catholic system.
German Lutheranism doesn't have priests and does not refer to its clergy as priests.
I believe in God because of what I have experienced in my own life. I have experienced things that cannot be explained by science, but that I know to be true and real. I researched religions and found one that fits my beliefs. My parents would probably fight with me to no end on sevarl parts of what I believe.
I consider myself to be a Christian, but I don't claim a denomination nor do I claim a church. You can be Christian and yet not go to church or even tell anyone about it. What belief system you follow is up to you. I've seen more than one person who claims they are Christian and all their religion consists of is going to church when they feel like it or in order to secure their place in the afterlife, but don't actually believe in the religion. I also know several atheists that believe in the basic principles of the Christian belief, however they don't call themselves Christians. Christianity is a very broad spectrum of religions and beliefs.
With respect, to believe in something just because you parents told you, its a big mistakefammily tradtions got a devastating effect on progress, not all of them ofcourse.For excample my dad keeps telling me that trading shares is like a game at the casinothe house always win, while in fact i trade shares and only for the past 4 months i earned about 20.000$with innitial invesment of 50.000, it took me 4 months to pay back about 40% of the innitial investment.and remember we are in a middle of a crisis here, where shares have a high tendancy to drop
With respect, to believe in something just because you parents told you, its a big mistake
No, it is not. But it is a mistake to doubt your parents' words if you have no reason to do so other than the knowledge that there is no evidence for what they said and no evidence against it. When in doubt, trust the people who did everything for you. That's the basis of society.
My parents were right on the toilet issue. I assume they knew what they were talking about in general.
The older I get the more I notice how often they were right. Why doubt one of the most important teachings now?
family tradtions got a devastating effect on progress, not all of them ofcourse.For excample my dad keeps telling me that trading shares is like a game at the casinothe house always win, while in fact i trade shares and only for the past 4 months i earned about 20.000$with innitial invesment of 50.000, it took me 4 months to pay back about 40% of the innitial investment.and remember we are in a middle of a crisis here, where shares have a high tendancy to drop
I think it is stupid to invest in shares to make quick profits. MOST people are not as lucky as you were.
Your dad was right.
Incidentally, short-term investments are not "progress". And advice to stay out of risky share gambling does not have a "devastating effect on progress".
Very true.
Theoretically there could even be (and probably are) fully atheistic Christians, who believe in no god but do believe that Jesus was a great teacher and saviour. They are hence "Christians" because they believe that Jesus was the Messiah, but not that he was in fact annointed by a god (maybe he was annointed by the universe or by his deeds and teachings).
I respect any such belief.
The fact that my dad as most of other people dont know how to abuse the trading shares sistemand end up with high proffits, dosnt mean that he is right!While if i would of listened to him, then i couldnt get richer by 20K (and still gaining)
The truth is that the best thing to do is to question everything in your lifeso if you parents told you that there is GOD, first you must question them and check the factsin case you didnt found any facts about the excictance of god, then your parents are wrong.same thing with alcohol, while people drink alcohol, they are strictly against drugs such as weedthe reason for that is education that told them that weed is illigal and bad, while nothing was saidabout alcohol, but the facts are that alcohol is the most addictive and devestating drug in the worldand its a fact that weed have no addictive elements and the only damage it dose it the smoke damagesame as cigarettes, yet cigarettes are also legal and have deep roots in the traditional life.another fact is that every year people die from car accidantes due to alcohol WAY more then dueto driving under the effects of drugs, same thing with cime, many peple who commited murderwere under the effect of alcohol, and those are facts that not many knowbecause no one question the laws and restrictions, people just accept them as they arejust as you accepted that there is god only because your parents told you so.
The truth is that the best thing to do is to question everything in your lifeso if you parents told you that there is GOD, first you must question them and check the factsin case you didnt found any facts about the excictance of god, then your parents are wrong.
I think you missed the part where he said that there was no evidence against it.
As for stocks, if you do it right there's a lot less risk, but there's always risk, but then such is life.
Lol...Only kids use this "you cant give evidence AGAINST it nither" thing...2+2 is 4 right? why?and and if its 2 cars + 2 house, then how can it be 4? no its just remain 2 cars and 2 housesor you can say that 2+2 is 22...yet, we all know that 2+2=4!!!!
So, if i cant see it, cant hear it, cant smell it, cant taste it, cant feal it, then it DOSNT excist!now i bet will come the smartass that will say "can you see atoms?! no? so they dont excist?"well... yes you can... you only have to find a powerfull electro microscopecant say the same about god...
Sorry, misread what you said. But it's the same for all religions, that's part of what makes them a religion, belief in the unseen or unexplained. If it was seen and explained then it's fact, not religion.
Using that logic humanity would have been eaten by tigers hundreds of thousands of years ago when children decided that believing their parents was stupid and that one's attitude towards tigers should only be developed once the tiger is visible.
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