The new subsription drive has started...
This is a site that gets 90,000 visitors a day. And today it's gotten 9 subscriptions or renewals during the subscription drive. $260 down, $49,740 to go in about a month to re-do the site.
There are two different visions for the site. Let's call them the community versus commercial views. I'm on the commercial side. Zoomba/ID/jafo are likely on the community side.
We've estimated that the new site is going to cost around $50k to make. Stardock is going to pay for anything that the community doesn't come up with. But in return, the more Stardock pays into it, the more say it's going to have on the design.
I'm pretty sure that the core skinning community is no longer big enough to pay the bills and that's fine. Skinning has become one of those ominipresent things that, because it's not a niche, doesn't really have a strong core following like it used to. It has millions of users but relatively few who really care about a "skinning community" any more than people really care about a core World of Warcraft community. Skinning is everywhere these days.
The new WC, the commercial one, will be radically different than the WC we have today. First, the S-corporation that runs WinCustomize will get disolved and become part of Stardock Software (which makes WindowBlinds, Object Desktop, etc.).
Second, WC will be funded out of Stardock Software's marketing budget.
Now this may sound bad but let's face it, most people come here for Stardock related content. When this site started, programs like Winamp, Hoverdesk, WinStep, ICQ Plus and others were pretty significant. Today, it's pretty much all about WindowBlinds, DeskScapes, IconPackager, wallpapers and a that's about it.
The community won't disappear but obviously the site will become much more Stardock oriented and the days of WinCustomize as a quasi-independent entity will come to an end.
See what we have in mind: https://forums.wincustomize.com/335824
Wha?
If I had to PAY to use THESE forums, I wouldn't do it. Period. I wouldn't pay to use ANY forums. Forums are supposed to be a community, social, get-together thing. Not a pay-to-play gimmick. As if WC doesn't get slapped with the "elitist" label enough, imagine having to be forced to shell out your already dwindling amount of cash just to chat with other users. Forget it.
I believe we're talking about the use of WinCustomize (ie downloading/uploading stuff). There's no reason to charge for forumaccess.
superman, T20, is that some uhh....Kryptonian code?
Read back a few posts to starkers' proposed tier system.
I again agree with Bebi.
I also think that if you want to attract more business, you lower prices...especially in harder economic times.
[quote who="Bebi Bulma" reply="5" id="2071448"]I believe we're talking about the use of WinCustomize (ie downloading/uploading stuff). There's no reason to charge for forumaccess.Read back a few posts to starkers' proposed tier system.
Bebi, I think you're getting the wrong end of the stick here, with regard to my ideas. The idea is not to charge extra for forum use.... but to NOT charge those who have no use or need of it. In other words, a reduced subscription for those who have NO need of forums or personal pages, etc. I mean, would you pay 20 bucks for an item that has more frills than you need, or would you pay 6 bucks for a frill-less but similar one that suits your every need?
Again, the idea is to increase revenue via lesser value subs to those who can't or wouldn't pony up $20 for stuff they see as superfluous/beyond their needs, but would pay 6 bucks for unlimited downloads without ads. It's NOT CHARGING EXTRA to use the forums, but about increasing WC revenues with $5.95 subs it would otherwise not have seen, OK? In fact, under the proposal, you'd probably be paying less because there'd be a lot of 6 buck subs contributing to WC's upkeep and maintenance.
Or put another way, and more bliuntly, WC has thousands of drive-by skin hunters who would never consider parting with 20 bucks to become a subscriber to things they'd never ever use or need, but offer them a $5.95 annual sub for unlimited and ad free downloads and they're more likely to consdider it... particularly in these harder economic times.
That was and is the whole crux of the idea.... and current subscribers (then Premium Subscribers) would HAVE THE SAME BENEFITS but would be PAYING LESS.
Precisely! But for some reason, as soon as you mention NOT CHARGING some people for services they DO NOT USE, people suddenly think they're being ripped off and being charged extra for those optional services they DO USE.
Although I'm right 'til 2010, I'd still like to up my sub to help us get closer to that $50k... but I can't, not for another couple of months because I just paid a quarterly power bill of $664.30. up at least $240 due to government price indexing and Rudd's 'trade emissions' scheme that'll do nothing for the environment but put money into the bank accounts of the corporate power providers
It makes good economic sense to have a tiered subscription process that allows lower-end users to pay for what they actually use... but as always, there'll be those who don't like it because they somehow think they're being ripped off for stuff they DO USE and are already paying for anyhow.
Starkers...that actually means someone will be paying for the forum use...as you are discounting others that same fee.
You cannot remove it from some people without conceding it must therefore be in place for others.
That's simple logic....cause and effect...
You need to pay me to access these forums...
Seems like ya'll are beating a dead horse. Whats going to happen is going to happen and either the people will accept it or move on. Thats the black and white of things. For those thats been here a long time should already know this.
That's about it in a nutshell.
Keep in mind that for every "end" there is a new beginning.The only thing that's permanent is change.
I think your logic is a bit 'fuzzy'.
Unfortunately, that's very true. But, if you don't own the playground, you don't get to say who uses the swings.
So when, 'perxactly is the sub drive supposed to end? Maybe it's just me, but I don't really see an end date...
I believe it ends Saturday.
Forums are not going to be subscriber only. However, I'm toying with the idea of having a section of forums for subscribers-only, but it's just a thought. Opinions?
Also, whoever brought it up, you can subscribe via regular mail.
That's for sure! I see the subscription doing as wrll as a 3-legged horse in a steeplechase and come up with an idea to encourage non-subscribers who don't want to pay for extras they don't use to contribute 'something', and what happens, people start to think they're going to get ripped off because others don't happen not to pay a premium price for services they never use.
What I suggested would actually increase revenue through greater contributions otherwise not received, meaning everyone would benefit through cheaper premium subs than they currently pay.... but no, rather than seeing it for what it really is - a way to increase the subscriber base - it's a "fuck that, I'm noy paying more" attitude, and people are cutting off their noses to spite their faces.
It's like the person who knowingly pays X amount for fully catered front-row seats at a show, who suddenly kicks up a stick when he/she discovers somebody down the back without refreshments have paid less. I mean, where does somebody get off pulling a stunt like that... and whatever happened to the user pays principle that so many are so fond of around here. I could understand the fuss if an additional forum access fee were to be suddenly introduced, but we've been indirectly paying for benefits in the over-all price for years, so hat's the big diff now... just because it was suggested that those who don't use it get a discounted price to encourage fence-sitters and the undecided to subscribe?
Sheesh, just when my faith in human nature had been elevated a notch or two... what an idiot.
Depends what each group would be entitled to...and how would cross posting be affected by that? Could one group be exempt from that?
I understand your indignation, but when you consider it might get more subs or partial subs for WC, and thereby enable the site to be less commercial and keep more of it's current character?
What I mean to say is that there's a 'quid pro quo' in more than one dimension with this current idea.
Like all ideas it'll have to be fleshed out a bit before I say yea or nay.
@I.D. Could you flesh your idea out a bit more? I'd like to hear more about it.
I see nothing wrong with that idea,it would add value to a subscription,in a way.It has a WCClub sound to it. I don't think that would be construed as "elitist" at all,only as a subscriber-only benefit.
This may sound like a silly question but someone I am sure is thinking about this. If the stated goal of getting $50,000 by way of new or renewed subscriptions doesn't happen will there be a WinCustomize 2009 Update?
I understand what has been said in this and other threads and post, I was just wondering if anything has changed in the last 50 or so days.
One interesting thing that could be done is to give anyone who submit a skin the possibility to make it subscriber only. That way, any skinner can help out in giving extra benefit to being a subscriber, and indirectly support the maintenance of the community.
Wouldn't the skinners just make subscriber only skins then? That's sort of in line with what has been said before. People buy the software and are somewhat happy. How happy will they be with no skins to apply?
When you get down to it the money for WinCustomise (running, updating, moderating) needs to be included in the cost of the the software. Wonder if that would work?
Well, skinners wouldn't get any personal advantage by releasing a skin as subscriber only. Also, not every skinner is a subscriber. There could be a limit to how many subscriber only skins you can do if things got out of hand, like a maximum of 1 out of 5 skins can be subscriber only.
Doing the "subscriber only" type skin wouldn't promote skinning at all, in fact it would have a chilling effect.
I couldn't even see making personal pages "subscriber only"...none of that makes any sense.
Subscriber only doesn't mean much. and as WOM said, it's gonna be what it's gonna be.
There are many great features available to you once you register, including:
Sign in or Create Account
