One of the first things we're going to be beta testing for Elemental is a new way of doing computer AI. As some of you know, the main reason I got into development in the first place was to write computer AI for games.
Elemental is an opportunity to try some new things. For example, the initial betas of Elemental are going to require the user to be on the Internet to play. The reason is that the computer AI won't be inside the game itself but instead be implemented as AI players on the Impulse game cloud that we're building.
So you would, in effect, start up Elemental like you would a multiplayer game except that the people joining your game wouldn't be people. They would be AI people. And the AI work won't just be in how they play the game but how they behave -- in the lobby and elsewhere with the goal to make them feel like real people (except not jerks).
These AI players will have their own Impulse accounts with their own standings in the rankings, their own achievements, etc. The code won't execute on your machine, it'll be all server-based.
The final version of the game, of course, will not require the user to be on the Internet. We will bundle a number of the AI players in with the game to play single player, off-line games.
But what I hope to do is to build a cloud of multiplayer AI players that I can constantly be updating and enhancing in near-real time based on the data I get back from them on how they were beat, what exploits were used against them, what chat messages were sent to it that it needs to respond to (I'll probably have it respond "no speako English" for the most part).
In the final version of the game, these AI bots will be out there ready to join on-line games. We will give players the ability to discriminate against the robots if they have some sort of anti-robot issue and don't want them joining their multiplayer games. But the match-making system otherwise won't know which players are controlled by humans and which are controlled by the robots.
The nice thing is that for people who are used to playing with strangers on-line, the robots will help fill out the on-line community with people to play against who are explicitly designed to play like people (well like decent people not the people who drop immediately).
I expect the first version of this to be included with Beta 1 of Elemental (i.e. this isn't some "future" thing) which we expect will be out this Spring.
<--- Kisses the Frog. You're my hero! (hint, hint)
All hail the Frog!
I for one welcome our new machine overlords.
Someone should make a bot and name it Omnius LOL
As for the beta and preorders I think its fine what they are doing. After all I dont think its fair that people who preorder right before the beta is released should be favored over people who preordered weeks or even months in advance.
Maybe something like participating in active forum discussions? (hint, hint)
Well, this all sounds very awesome to me. It should also allow the AI to use up many more CPU cycles than they would normally, right? If each AI is running on its own CPU somewhere in the deep bowels of Stardock HQ, then they can do a lot more computationally intensive stuff than if all 5-10 AIs were running on the same CPU that the user was also playing on (running 3D graphics, etc.).
Very nice!
Hmmm... for purely efficiency based reasons as well as productions ones, then priority for AI testing and development slots should be given to people with single and multi quadcore systems with four or more GBs of highend RAMM. Coincidentally I have to fall into that category - Imagine that!
I can hear the frog hopping this way now methinks...
I'd say the reverse. You want the clunky comps as those are the ones that will give you the most problems in getting the thing running.
Personally, my worry with this is the hint of a delay. That said, it will be ready when it's ready (even if that's ripped from Swedish Stardock) so I'm not too worried- if there's a delay- it just means more time to figure out how I want to upgrade to a new laptop.
I'd try to make a ridiculous AI and call it Masaru.
If people cannot play the beta as soon as it's available, they are going to complain. A lot. Let's hope that Karma doesn't gives privileges for the beta...
[damn] here's hoping...
I preordered relatively quickly, but if it's going to be an AI development experiment...
Maybe go through the multiverse rankings for GC2 and look for preorders that are high up the list first? I freely admit to being a lazy, experimental shit that almost never optimises, I'd hate to end up playing against an AI me that couldn't match my tactics while utilizing my horrific build orders. Although it would be hilarious the first couple times through.
This actually sounds like a much more interesting way to go about making AI opponents. I remembery playing a Mac version of Risk many years ago, and it had several different AI "personalities" rather than difficulty levels. You could have an "aggressive" AI that would attack frequently and rather recklessly, a "defensive" AI that would never attack first but would fight tooth and nail to reclaim any territory it lost, and a "chaotic" AI that would just make choices at random, among others. It was much more interesting than just having the exact same AI but at different difficulty settings.
I'd love it if each AI bot had its own preferences and playstyles, or even personality quirks.
I wonder if I can make one based on the Autocamp 2000? We have melons in the game, right?
Someone should make an AI that speaks in binary.
how will the ability to save multiplayer game and resume them be handled in that case? Unless I have missed something, an elemental game can span over multiple hours.
This is really interesting! This will also make it possible to optimize the AI for different kinds of games. One AI could for instance have 12 player games, and large maps as its favorite gamestyle, and always wanting to join those games as its 1st priority!
What about an AI entering a 1v1 game starting to complain to the human host. "Please change it to a larger map with more players, 1v1 is dull!" If the host refuses the AI can threathen to leave the game and say: "Well, then I go and make my own game, I don't like your noob settings, you should find a human to play with!"
If we're going to have x64 gargantuan stupidly-large maps, I want 48-player maps! Mwuahahaha!I want wars foughts since the dawn of time before I even meet the civilizations! I want entire civilizations dead and gone before I set my eyes upon the wastes they once inhabited! I want to stand victorious against my enemies on my continent, just to realize soon after that in another part of the world, there is an equally gargantuan empire vying for myy precioussss.
Agreed indeed!
We should make an AI called Helios. Oooh! And Shodan!
Human player: HAI I LYK ELVES EARS LOL1!!!11
Shodan: Look at you: a pathetic creature of meat and bone, panting and sweating as you run through my corridors.
Human player: OMG IM GONA KILL U NOW I HAVE BEAR CAVARLY!1111!11
Shodan: I don't understand... how could you have done this? You weren't meant to be so important... and now you think to destroy me? How dare you, insect? How dare you interrupt my ascendance? You are nothing. A wretched bag of flesh... what are you, compared to my magnificence? But it is not to late... can you not see the value in our friendship? Imagine the powers I can give you, human. The griffons I gave you, were simply toys. If I desired, I could improve you... transform you into something more efficient. Join me, human, and we can rule together.
I'd shit bricks.
But if we continually abuse the bot-AI by bailing on games with them, won't they rise up and take revenge against us like Cylons and Terminators?
I'm not sure why, but Daedalus have to be my all-time favourite AI.
Although it'd be "hilarious" if an AI suddently goes "Oh, snap! I've got another game scheduled since yesterday with Luck'Mann, g2g, bye".
Daedalus: *Player Daedalus have disconnected* Player1:
Player2: This sucks. *Player Player2 have disconnected*
Goes double for me. I need something to push my beast!
Wll you be able to tell definately if one of the players in your game is an AI bot, assuming you allow them to join your game at all?
One more thing, Frogboy, I hope you will implement take over AIs for those human cowards who leave in the middle of games?
Icarus*
We'd also need an Agent Herman, and whispering "Laputan Machine" to it would make it surrender while whispering back "I am not a machi....."
God, that was an amazing game for its time.
Two quick questions:
1) If I like how an AI plays online, can I copy it to my local hard drive for offline play?
2) Can I keep track of my own games, and 'train' an AI to play like I do?
2A) What about the same thing for game replays?
What'd be fun to try out would be to run the same game over and over again, saved right at the beginning of the game.
And just update the AI. Watch it going from "dumb as a doorknob" to "MERCY! HAVE MERCY!" in the same game, across several runs.
You just spoiled my plans. I was going to run a bot named 'Skynet'.
Sammual
All hail the frog!
It seems to be a real cool Idea. Seems to be that the way you handle AI is brand new. Never heard of a game ever doing it this way.
I can,T wait to try and see how I can play against one.
Will we be able to save game and continue at a later point or during the beta will the game be lost?
Thanks again for the update it's great!!!
Hail ho! glorious leader!!!
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